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Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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ddoyle
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2011 10:30 am
Post subject: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

Until recently (or perhaps even currently), there was a Bradley Fighting Vehicle in front of the Ordnance Museum building at Aberdeen. The signage on the vehicle said it was an M2, the USA AFV list shows it as a M3 - and my personal notes have it both ways.

Anyone know for sure what it is/was?

Thanks,
David Doyle
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:16 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

I was told by the Curator of the Museum several years ago that it was an M3 and that was the way I presented it on all my tours

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ddoyle
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:29 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

Thanks Bob - now it is starting to get really confusing, as an hour or so Ed Heasley told me it was an M2!!! Ed was at one time the Deputy Director/Curator of the Ordnance Museum - and is now with Aberdeen Proving Ground Museum.

The vehicle appears to have the blanked firing ports one would expect to see on an M3, however........

Anyone else care to way in on this?

Best wishes,
David Doyle
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armyjunk2
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 10:35 am
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

Does a pic help??

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 3:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

- ddoyle
Thanks Bob - now it is starting to get really confusing, as an hour or so Ed Heasley told me it was an M2!!! Ed was at one time the Deputy Director/Curator of the Ordnance Museum - and is now with Aberdeen Proving Ground Museum.

The vehicle appears to have the blanked firing ports one would expect to see on an M3, however........

Anyone else care to way in on this?

Best wishes,
David Doyle


Well Ed was the person that told me it was an M3 Confused !!!!!!. I'm going to have to call him. I haven't talked to him in a while. When I first met him he was the Curator, He later became Deputy Director but didn't want to move to Ft Lee. We'll get this straightened out. I probably won't be able to reach him til the beginning of the week

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JimWeb
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 3:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

- armyjunk2
Does a pic help??

Its%20a%20very%20early%20M3%20and%20without%20an%20image%20of%20the%20roof%20hatch%20at%20the%20rear%20-%20the%20clue%20is%20the%20screen%20on%20the%20front.%20On%20M3%20the%20vertical%20slots%20almost%20reached%20the%20raised%20portion%20covering%20the%20headlights.%20On%20the%20M2%20there%20were%20shorter%20vertical%20slots%20and%20they%20reached%20about%20halfway%20to%20the%20headlight%20mouldings. M2 M3

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ddoyle
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 8:01 am
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

Thanks guys!

To add to the confusion (I've not mastered posting photos, or I would) - this machine does have a hatch over the rear area, and it does have firing ports in the rear door. The side firing ports are present, but have plates bolted over them blanking them off.

My understanding was/is that only M2 variants have the firing ports in the rear doors, and only M3s have the side firing ports blanked out. It has periscopes in sides of the crew compartment. FMC donated this machine after restoring it - so I suppose it could be a hybrid, either an ex-test vehicle, or "restored" by using whatever components were handy.

Any further thoughts?

David Doyle
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JimWeb
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 7:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

Has the roof hatch the rear looking periscopes in it (M3) or are they in the hull roof between the hatch and the rear hull plate (M2)?

As far as firing ports in the rear door go the early M3 appeared to have a single firing port (as opposed to the two firing ports on the M2) but they were quickly eliminated AFAIK.

Your right it could be a bitsa machine in which case this conversation is moot!

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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 8:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

This gallery may help
www.flickr.com/photos/...474291167/

Neil
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tanker2010
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 11:54 am
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

The gate guard and the pic captioned as a M2 are both pre-production M2s. The pic captioned as a M3 is in fact a M2 . It says Bradley on the side and has his 5 stars. This is one from the intial fielding of the M2 at Ft. Hood. At that time the M3 was still known as the M3 Gen. Devers. There was no difference in the trimvane ( so called screen) on production M2/3s. The extenal difference in production M2 and M3s where that the firing ports on the side, while present, were blanked off on the M3.
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JimWeb
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 8:32 am
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

- tanker2010
The pic captioned as a M3 is in fact a M2 .


Oh crap wrong image Rolling Eyes

Well the point is moot now anyway. Didn't know about the General Devers. designation though....

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Sabot
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2011 2:06 pm
Post subject: Re: Bradley formerly in front of Ordnance Museum

The TOW loading hatch for the CFV didn't change until the M3A1. As far as I know, the "plain" hatch on M2 was the same as the M3. As pointed out, the firing ports on the sides and ramp were present on the M3 but blanked off.

I am not sure when the ramp firing ports were deleted (as opposed to just blanked off) on the M3 series, but probably on the M3A1. I know they are gone on the M3A2 and later.

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