±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 183
Total: 183
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Photo Gallery
03: Community Forums
04: Home
05: Photo Gallery
06: Photo Gallery
07: Photo Gallery
08: Photo Gallery
09: Community Forums
10: Photo Gallery
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Photo Gallery
14: Photo Gallery
15: Community Forums
16: Home
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Home
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Home
25: Photo Gallery
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Photo Gallery
29: Photo Gallery
30: Downloads
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Home
34: Photo Gallery
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Home
42: Photo Gallery
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: Home
46: Downloads
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Home
50: Community Forums
51: Downloads
52: Community Forums
53: Photo Gallery
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: CPGlang
58: Home
59: Community Forums
60: Photo Gallery
61: Home
62: Member Screenshots
63: Member Screenshots
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Your Account
68: Home
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Home
72: Photo Gallery
73: Photo Gallery
74: Photo Gallery
75: Community Forums
76: Photo Gallery
77: Home
78: Community Forums
79: Home
80: Your Account
81: Home
82: Home
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Member Screenshots
88: Home
89: Photo Gallery
90: Photo Gallery
91: Photo Gallery
92: Home
93: Home
94: Downloads
95: Photo Gallery
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Photo Gallery
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Home
103: CPGlang
104: Community Forums
105: Home
106: Downloads
107: Downloads
108: Community Forums
109: Downloads
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Photo Gallery
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Home
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Home
127: Your Account
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Home
131: Community Forums
132: Photo Gallery
133: Photo Gallery
134: Photo Gallery
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Member Screenshots
139: Photo Gallery
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Photo Gallery
143: Your Account
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Home
148: Community Forums
149: Photo Gallery
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Home
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Photo Gallery
157: Community Forums
158: Photo Gallery
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Photo Gallery
163: Home
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Home
170: Community Forums
171: CPGlang
172: Community Forums
173: Your Account
174: Downloads
175: Community Forums
176: Your Account
177: Community Forums
178: Home
179: Downloads
180: Home
181: Community Forums
182: News Archive
183: Member Screenshots

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Buq-Buq
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 86

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:33 am
Post subject: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

While browsing an online photo collection of the Indian Ahmednegar Cavalry Tank Museum, I found photos of a surviving Grant CDL tank. The vehicle has been fitted with an extremely long gun: not a normal M2 or M3 75mm piece . . . possibly an M1 76mm gun, or maybe a fake gun tube altogether (although I notice that there is a bit of taper to it, making me think that it is genuine). The vehicle has the typical Grant CDL-style stowage bins.

The photo collection page:

www.bharat-rakshak.com...ankMuseum/



The Grant CDL:

www.bharat-rakshak.com...4.jpg.html

www.bharat-rakshak.com...5.jpg.html



There are several other very interesting vehicles at this museum, to include a DD Sherman, a Sherman Crab, and a vehicle described as an M3 Halftrack, but what looks to me to be a T48 57mm Gun Motor Carriage.

www.bharat-rakshak.com...1.jpg.html

www.bharat-rakshak.com...2.jpg.html



Mark
Back to top
View user's profile
Hanno_Spoelstra
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jun 04, 2006
Posts: 185

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:11 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

- Buq-Buq
The vehicle has been fitted with an extremely long gun: not a normal M2 or M3 75mm piece . . . possibly an M1 76mm gun, or maybe a fake gun tube altogether (although I notice that there is a bit of taper to it, making me think that it is genuine).


Could it be a distored picture due to using a wide-angle lens?
Back to top
View user's profile
Pzkpfw-e
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jul 21, 2010
Posts: 1202

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 12:15 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)


In profile, a very big "nose"!
The one auctioned at Melbourne has a similarly impressive proboscis!
Back to top
View user's profile
the_shadock
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: May 27, 2006
Posts: 2865
Location: Normandy, France
PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:17 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

Mark,

this Grant CDL is already listed in this PDF file :

http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_Lee_Grant.pdf

This is not a new vehicle to me, sorry.

However, like other members of this forum, I wonder why it has a longer barrel than other Lees/Grants (this barrel also seems original to me, it is obviously not a fake one).

Pierre-Olivier

_________________
soldat_ryan @ hotmail.com

Looking for photos of Sherman manufacturer's plates
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Buq-Buq
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 04, 2006
Posts: 86

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

Pierre-Oliver, Guys:

Ah! I see! Sorry about that . . . I got all excited. I looked in my copy of the Lee/Grant Survivors PDF, but the one that I have is apparently from 2008 or so.

Sad

The CDL photo in the PDF is great to have, being from a different angle than the two on the Ahmednegar Museum site. Also, the turret is much more clear in this depiction.

Anyway! That gun is very unusual . . . and, now that you mention it, Pzkpfw-e, the M3A3 Grant shown in your lower photo looks to have a very similar gun. I had previously assumed that it was just an M3 75mm Gun, but perhaps the angle of the photo has deceived me. Is it possible that both vehicles mount a larger gun, perhaps a 76mm M1 or M1A1? I have never hear of it happening before, but then again, I also didn’t think that there were any extant Grant CDLs left anywhere, either.

Would a 76mm M1 Gun fit in the sponson of a Grant?

Where would the Australians and the Indians have come up with a 76MM M1 Gun? I am not aware of the Australians ever receiving 76mm-armed AFVs (the Indians did receive M4A1E4 and M4A3E4 Shermans via MAP at some point . . . 1950s?).

Then again, maybe these are just M3 75mm-armed Grants.

Pierre-Oliver, thanks again for the new link to the PDF; there’s lots of great new things in there!




Mark
Back to top
View user's profile
Pzkpfw-e
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jul 21, 2010
Posts: 1202

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:21 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

A Lee with a big gun.
Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 5:16 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

Wiki begs to be corrected. Wink In the article on CDL, it states:

"A CDL equipped Matilda tank still exists as part of the collection of the Royal Armoured Corps Tank Museum at Bovington, Dorset, in Britain. It is the only one of its type known to exist. There are no Grant examples."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...ence_Light
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:09 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

Hi Folks!

I went back and looked at all the M3 Lees and Grants photos I have collected over the years. I remember thinking that a number of photos looked odd, but I didn't catch it. After seeing this thread, I took a longer look and noticed a number of long barrels. After that, I went and pulled out Hunnicutt's Sherman book and review the sections on 75mm guns. A number of the photos in that book have the long barrels also.

In a couple of the photos he calls them "T8/M3 Long barreled 75mm cannons (the same cannon that was installed in the Shermans). This has me wondering about all the shorter barrels without a counter weight. Are those M2s without a counter weight fitted?

Could Hunnicutt have missed something and there were THREE types of 75mm guns mounted in the M3 Lee/Grants?

The only thing I am sure of is those longer barrels are not 76mm cannons.

Sgt, Scouts out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:14 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Folks!

I went back and looked at all the M3 Lees and Grants photos I have collected over the years. I remember thinking that a number of photos looked odd, but I didn't catch it. After seeing this thread, I took a longer look and noticed a number of long barrels. After that, I went and pulled out Hunnicutt's Sherman book and review the sections on 75mm guns. A number of the photos in that book have the long barrels also.

In a couple of the photos he calls them "T8/M3 Long barreled 75mm cannons (the same cannon that was installed in the Shermans). This has me wondering about all the shorter barrels without a counter weight. Are those M2s without a counter weight fitted?

Could Hunnicutt have missed something and there were THREE types of 75mm guns mounted in the M3 Lee/Grants?

The only thing I am sure of is those longer barrels are not 76mm cannons.

Sgt, Scouts out!


Could some of those have been command vehicles with a fake gun welded on like an M31? Just guessing, 'cause the guns actually look "real" enough with functional elevation provisions.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Pzkpfw-e
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jul 21, 2010
Posts: 1202

PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2011 9:29 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Grant CDL/T-10 Shop Tractor (Leaflet)

The long barrels do look fully functional, not just rolled, sheet metal, like the M31's "barrel"
Are these the same 75mm M7 weapons that the M10/Wolverine touted?
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum