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M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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SFC_Jeff_Button
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Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 9:08 pm
Post subject: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

[img][/img]

Don,
I found this picture while "Googling". Any idea what the Hog/Sow image on the front fender is?
Also, back in 1993-95 time frame at Ft Stewart, GA., I was on Mortar firing point 4 or 5, when I found a bunch of flechettes stuck all through a dead downed tree on the range. Word had it that the Ranger Batt at Hunter Army Airfield used to fire recoiless rifles on the same range. Would these flechettes be from the AP-T (antipersonnel-tracer) round. If they are, would they have been fired from the M40A1/A2, 106mm recoiless rifle, and is this the same rifle found on the Ontos? The Ontos had a 50 cal "marking" rifle as well, how many were there?, one for each tube?
I read that 176 Ontos were acquired by the USMC for use in VietNam. While popular, their main weakness was the crews vulnerability while reloading. It also said the Ontos was dropped from inventory in 1970. I got this info from Olive-Drab.com. School me on the Ontos.

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Dontos
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Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2006 9:39 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

There is very little written on the Ontos. A couple of online articles, magazine features, but no definitive history.

Here are a couple of site that can lead you in the right direction:

The History of the Ontos

Ontos Veterans Site

Just one Ontos Restoration site

I'm not an Ontos Veteran, but just a dedicated armor historian, my knowledge on the subject is based off of oral history and the bits & pieces I've been able to dig up. There are a couple of Ontos veterans, that lurked around on the old AFV. I hope they have made the 'leap'.

If those sites don't answer your questions, I'd be happy to attempt it.

BTW: That photo is common on the net. Its a Bravo Co vehicle (written over the pig emblem. The location and specific Anti Tank Battalion is unknown.

The 'PIG' is a nickname for the Ontos.
Enjoy

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Roy_A_Lingle
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Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 2:52 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

Hi Jeff! Hi Folks!

"Would these flechettes be from the AP-T (antipersonnel-tracer) round."

The flechette rounds I have see were from the Sheridan. Those rounds didn't have a tracer element. They were like a can packed full of those modified nails. After the can cleared the muzzle, the sides would break off into four parts, along with a flat plate on the front, three or maybe four flat plates between each row of packed nails (half point foward and half pointed backwards) and another flat plate at the base. Something a bit like a shotgun with the smallest size buck shot. As soon as the round cleared the muzzle, it started breaking apart and fanning out. No need or time of a tracer element. It was a point blank oversized shotgun type of round.

"If they are, would they have been fired from the M40A1/A2, 106mm recoiless rifle, "

Possible, but I am not sure.
I think the flechette type round started with the 105mm howitzer and by the time Vietnam ended most of the direct fire weapons had an anti-personnel round with flechetts.

Sgt, Scouts Out!
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 3:32 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

Jeff this is a 106mm Beehive.

[img][/img]

Don

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bsmart
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Posts: 2515
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 5:09 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

I thought AP-T would be an Armor piercing round with tracer. Was there an official letter desgnater for beehive rounds? I've always heard them refered to as beehive and i assume they have an M (or XM) designator but do they have something along the lines of AP, APDS, HE, HEAT, HEP?

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Dontos
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 5:31 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

APERS or Anti Personnel is the designator for BeeHive

AP-T would be Armor Piercing w/Tracer.

Don
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2006 6:29 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos question/picture for Dontos

FYI


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