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This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :) :) :: Archived
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JG300-Stoopy
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:02 pm
Post subject: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :) :)

OK, man, so, like........I been on the hunt for a reeeeaaalllly good miltary jet to tool around FS9 with, to burn some holes in the sky and make some serious tracks with when I get that itch. And, I dunno, man, but it's like.....well, no offense to the freeware developers but I'm kinda particular about some stuff. And for some reason, lots of these jets have stuff that doesn't seem to work right...must be a complex task, So, instead of gettin' all excited about every jet that comes along and looks good, I've been really putting some of the more promising ones through the paces to find "The One".....and man, I tell ya, thanks to a great tip from good ol' JG300-Lurps, this is IT for me!!!

It's the FSD T-38 Talon, and you can get it from this link right 'char:
library.avsim.net/esea...DLID=33097

I know she's been around awhile and lots of ya may have it already, but sometimes ya gotta point out these planes lest they be forgotten. So for anyone who didn't know about it, I'd be happy to tell ya all about it before you head off to download her!

Had a few criteria to meet, which were:

1) Coolness factor, of course.....gotta look good and be a beechin' plane,
2) Gotta install with a minimum of fuss. Minimum file manipulations and all that,
3) Gotta be available from a reputable source, and easy to download for others,
4) Gotta fly good, I mean GOOD......
5) Gotta have a VC, and lotsa detail and readable intruments,
6) GOT to be ILS-capable. This sucker's for all-weather flying and you never know what's under that cloud blanket below.
7) Gotta have stuff that works in any normal plane. I mean autopilot, spoiler, all that jazz. A VERY cool F-18 has a 'super spoiler' that acts as a carrier trap by bringing the speed down to zero in nothing flat. That's cool, but makes it impossible to use spoilers in normal flight. A real nice F-14 has no ILS indicators anywhere in the cockpit - go figure.

So anyways, coupla nights ago I was flyin around with Lurps and Drafty (aka "Hoppa Jr") and Hoppa.....Lurps says hey go get this plane...so I check her out, skeptical at first, and have been flying her ever since to see if she's really up to snuff on the above needs.

Well this baby meets those criteria fully. I mean, she's beautiful, cool, shapely and sexy.....she got a one-click install from an self-installing executable in the ZIP fle......she's from FSD and available at Avsim, so it's quality goods bro......flies like she's on rails, got a serious roll rate too, just THINK about rolling left and she's there ......VC is just as readable as the 2D panel, and offers better visibility than the 2D panel for landing......and her instrumentation is 60's vintage but accurate and capable, LOL man I had to learn her ILS instrumentation the hard way while landing in an unexpected blizzard (dumb me, I was doing a Britain hoplist with real weather, for this time of year).......this gal pulled my @ss out of that jamb with grace and style, SUUUUUWEEEEEEEEEEE!

Here's some photos and yak about the lil'sweetheart......

Like 'the Manolo" says, "Some pictures, they do not need the caption"......
I%20use%20the%20VC%20for%20landing,%20and%20for%20some%20reason%20I%20had%20an%20initial%20tendency%20to%20land%20WAYYYY%20nose-high....and%20when%20I%20let%20the%20nose%20down%20too%20fast,%20she%20scalded%20me%20with%20an%20authentic-sounding%20\"BANG\"%20from%20the%20nosegear,%20just%20to%20let%20me%20know%20she%20didn't%20like%20it.....but%20she's%20a%20tough%20gal%20and%20hasn't%20broken%20on%20me%20yet,%20and%20I%20treat%20her%20much%20nicer%20these%20days. With%20the%20small%20wing%20area,%20I%20keep%20an%20approach%20speed%20of%20about%20140%20knots%20as%20per%20Lurps'%20advice,%20but%20she's%20got%20excellent%20brakes%20and%20accelleration,%20and%20can%20actually%20get%20in%20and%20out%20of%20some%20surprising%20airstrips.%20%20The%20animated%20oleo%20struts%20on%20the%20gear%20are%20cool,%20as%20you're%20taxiing%20along%20on%20rough%20ground%20the%20plane%20is%20stable%20and%20gently%20rocking,%20but%20outside%20view%20shows%20those%20little%20wheels%20busily%20bouncing%20up%20and%20down%20on%20the%20gravel.... I've%20put%20A%20LOT%20of%20miles%20under%20her%20wings%20already%20and%20this%20is%20just%20one%20of%20many%20refueling%20stops%20that've%20been%20necessary.%20%20Which%20is%20saying%20a%20lot%20becuase%20she%20actually%20gets%20fairly%20good%20fuel%20economy%20and%20I%20cruise%20her%20at%20FL150%20at%20about%200.9%20Mach.%20%20Here's%20me%20and%20the%20GIB%20takin'%20a%20smoke%20break%20%20between%20hi-speed%20legs..... Here's%20the%20virtual%20cockpit......looks%20great,%20eh??%20%20As%20you%20can%20see,%20the%20visibility%20over%20the%20nose%20is%20GREAT%20(probably%20why%20I'vebeen%20landing%20her%20so%20nose-high%20at%20first).%20%20This%20was%20an%20ILS%20approach,%20and%20the%20glidepath%20needle%20(vertical%20position)%20is%20on%20the%20left%20side%20of%20the%20artificial%20horizon%20(small%20white%20arrow),%20and%20the%20runway%20centerline%20needle%20(horizontal%20position)%20is%20the%20usal%20segmented%20line%20in%20the%20middle%20of%20the%20HSI%20just%20below%20that.%20%20I've%20found%20I%20really%20like%20this%20arangement%20compared%20to%20having%20both%20indicators%20on%20the%20same%20instrument....it%20enforces%20good%20panel-scanning%20practices,%20as%20opposed%20to%20staying%20fixated%20on%20just%20one%20instrument. \"So%20there%20I%20was....\".......flying%20along%20at%20FL150,%20enjoying%20a%20nice%20hoplist%20over%20Great%20Britain%20with%20excellent%20(real)%20weather.%20%20Or%20so%20I%20thought........as%20I%20slowed%20and%20descended%20down%20to%20the%20destination,%20we%20sank%20into%20heavy%20cumulus%20and%20ground%20fog....okay,%20what%20was%20that%20ILS%20frequency%20and%20where%20th'heck%20are%20the%20needles%20on%20this%20thing........at%20FL100,%20we're%20totally%20engulfed%20by%20the%20gray%20stuff.....at%20FL050,%20the%20snow%20kicked%20in...intercepted%20the%20ILS%20needle%20and%20set%20up%20on%20final%20approach.....getting%20closer...closer......FL005%20now.....where%20the%20hell%20is%20that%20runway.... It%20was%20at%20that%20point%20I%20noticed%20I%20was%20juuusssst%20a%20little%20bit%20below%20the%20glideslope.....and%20WHOAAA......I%20swear%20to%20gawd,%20out%20of%20the%20corner%20of%20my%20eye,%20through%20all%20the%20muck%20and%20snow,%20I%20saw%20a%20CHURCH%20STEEPLE%20flash%20by%20on%20the%20right.....and%20the%20top%20was%20above%20me.....YYYEEEEEEOOOOWWWW!!!! Of%20course,%20at%20about%20this%20time,%20the%20periodic%20\"FSHOST%20Server%20yada%20yada%20yada\"%20thing%20came%20scrolling%20across%20the%20top%20of%20the%20screen...just%20what%20you%20need%20when%20you're%20sweating%20out%20the%20final%20seconds%20of%20a%20tight%20approach%20in%20mimums,%20LMAO!!!! After%20a%20tiny%20slight%20climb%20and%20a%20few%20fractions%20of%20a%20second,%20I%20figured%20I%20had%20to%20be%20on%20top%20of%20the%20damn%20runway,%20so%20lowered%20the%20nose%20a%20bit%20more...STILL%20nuthin!!!....then%20suddenly..BANG....dropped%20out%20of%20the%20fog%20about%2010%20frikkin'%20feet%20above%20the%20runway,%20%20and%20dang%20me%20if%20I%20hadn't%20already%20passed%20the%20threshhold! Set%20'er%20down,%20hit%20the%20brakes,%20took%20this%20pic%20before%20turning%20off%20the%20runway,%20and%20went%20outside%20for%20a%20smoke...MAN%20I%20haven't%20had%20such%20an%20exciting%20time%20with%20a%20new%20plane%20like%20this%20for%20so%20long!!!!!!

A coupla caveats, and not bad ones at that:

1) When you install this plane, there's a "T-38 Paint Scheme Manager" program that gets installed in your Start->Programs menu. You gotta run that to get the extra two liveries, otherwise all you'll see is the default NASA scheme. This is explained in the README.

2) The autopilot is certainly 60's vintage, which means it'll do the job but isn't like the AP's you might be used to. However, I found that figuring it out (not hard, and Lurps helped me out there a bit) was kind of a pleasure. Gives the plane some unique character, and you get a little sense of accomplishment out of it too.

3) Haven't had her supersonic yet, just up to 0.99 Mach. Don't know if it's because this is originally an FS2002 aircraft, or if I haven't had her high enough, or what. There's an operating handbook for her that also gets installed in the program menu, just been havin' too much fun to read it yet!

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Last edited by JG300-Stoopy on Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:19 am; edited 5 times in total
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JG300-Hoppa
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:13 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

WELL THANKS BOSS,,,,you sold me,,,,,going to get it right now,,,hehe

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JG300-Stoopy
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:21 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

Coolarino, Hoppa!!!!! Lookin' forward to makin' some tracks with ya!!

Might put up a little quick guide to the quirks on the A/P.......like I said, Lurps helped me figger it out, so am happy to pass any info along....think I'll look over the POH frst to make sure I'm not missing anything.

S!

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JG300-Hoppa
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:48 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

well just took her out for a rip and this is a definite to add to the essentials,,,,,,I love it,,,,,,took off from the sty,,,,,as soon as gear was up I punched it,,,,,did a vertical climb and a rolling loop,,,,came outa the loop ,hit the speed brake, flaps and gear and brought it in for a suuuuwwweeeeet landing like I'd done it a thousand times,,,,,,I love it!!!!!!,,,also dig the blue, grey camo paintjob,,,

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{92}Warhawk
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:57 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

WOW!! thats a keeper!!! thanks for the heads up stoopy!

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Kitform
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:54 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

You sold me...:) Downloading now...
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JG300-Holmes
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:42 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

well SUUUUUUWWWWWWEEEEEEE!

I've always had a thing for the T-38, always thought it was a little too good for a trainer, lol we should get someone with painting skills to make a JG300 livery for this sucker

i'll download her when i get off work, but yea man looks awesome...

- JG300-Stoopy
3) Haven't had her supersonic yet, just up to 0.99 Mach. Don't know if it's because this is originally an FS2002 aircraft, or if I haven't had her high enough, or what. There's an operating handbook for her that also gets installed in the program menu, just been havin' too much fun to read it yet!


as for your supersonic attempt...were you straight and level? or diving and still couldnt get it? i know it's supposed to be supersonic on it's own, but hey, every bit helps

plus maybe the mach indicatr is just off, if you hit 660 knots on the airspeed indicator though that should put you over it

also, damn man, ILS approaches, reflueing, etc, etc, one day stoop i'mma have to find you on FS9 and have you teach me something about all that hehe

~S~

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:22 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

Well I did a little research and found a couple of things......

The T-38 performance specs I've found list a top speed of Mach 1.08. So, heck I can give up that 0.09 mach.

Found reference to an "afterburner" key.....man alive, learn something new every day, IS there such a thing in FS9? What key is it, anyone know?

Also.....I didn't think this autopilot could be slaved to the GPS, but in mid-flight last night, I switched from another plane (that was on A/P slaved to GPS route) into the T-38 and it was following the GPS, even circled over the destination when it got there. There's just no "Nav/GPS" switch to be found anywhere on the panel(s). Guess the crew chief didn't want to drill any holes in the nice vintage cockpit.

Is there an FS9 key command that does the same thing?

And Holmes.....hehe refuleing is easy, pull up next to the gas pump, set the brakes, and shut your engines off. Fuel tanks fill right up! And I can show you just enough about ILS approaches to be dangerous, lol!!!
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:26 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

D'oh! The nimrod that posted that last bit -- yeah that was me......

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BooRay
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:56 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

I might add that there are some cool add ons for this aircraft too.

One you can update your panels and guages and that adds a slot on your throttle control for after burners. The effects package also gives you an after burner glow and some other sound effects.

Also, I updated my sounds for the whoom of the engines firing and the wind effects in canopy and other effective sounds for the T-38.

Last I have 4 repaints of this bird in my collection including, Thunderbirds, Tiger and 2 more I can remember off the top of my head.

I have the zip files for the addons if you want those names on AVSIM. I just did a search there and added them. They work fine for me so far
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JG300-Stoopy
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:35 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

Thanks Boo! I was eyeing some of that stuff, and shied away form it only becuase I didn't want to mess with a good thing....or even start talking about more files, lord knows the Saus'r probably about ready to make me walk the plank if I suggest too much more....:D

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JG300-Holmes
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:36 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

- Anonymous
And Holmes.....hehe refuleing is easy, pull up next to the gas pump, set the brakes, and shut your engines off. Fuel tanks fill right up! And I can show you just enough about ILS approaches to be dangerous, lol!!!



lol where's the gas pump...hehe some things i noticed though


and Stoop she'll get up to 1.08 Mach in a dive, but the Mach guage is all messed up, just go by the knots

it's about 660 knots for mach 1 under normal circumstances

but here's me lettin out a good ol' loud Phobbbbbbt over our airstrip

as%20for%20the%20guage%20inconsistencies%20check%20the%20next%20two%20pics%20and%20note%20the%20needle%20reading%20knots%20and%20the%20associated%20Mach%20number,%20seems%20a%20lil%20off%20to%20me%20:) and and%20Stoop%20you%20forgot%20the%20most%20needed%20pic%20of%20any%20new%20plane,%20lol%20inverted%20at%20the%20Sty!


i'll have to check those other add ons and stuff like that out too, but yea this plane's a blast to burn up the skies with


~S~

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JG300-Stoopy
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:09 pm
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

LMAO!! VERY nice Holmes!!! When you can see the roof inside the hangar...that's an inverted pass baby!

Hey I was wondering....doesn't Mach change with altitude? I mean, the speed of sound is listed as 700-something at sea level, and different at higher altitudes, isnt it?

Dumb question from a propellor-driver......

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JG300-Holmes
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 12:36 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)

it probably does, cause speed always seems to depend on temperature and pressure, but since you got me thinkin on this one i google'd it real quick and it seems that it's more temperature here

but i think that's cause maybe they're taking for granted seas level

www.school-for-champio...ed_gas.htm

that's the link though about that...and it's easier to read, lol but i knew pressure had to do with it too (which is why it would change in altitude) so here's another link although it's kinda worse so i'll quote the part i was looking for, it's the last entry on this page:

www.eng-tips.com/viewt...amp;page=1

- BrianR
The speed of sound also decreases at altitude and for this aircraft there is an altitude where the decreasing speed of sound curve crosses the increasing TAS curve.


which is basically saying that actually if the aircraft couldn't go supersonic at sea level it'd have a better chance doing it at a higher altitude because

1) the true airspeed will be higher since the air is less dense
2) the speed of sound is slower since the air is less dense

hehe remember that old thing where speed travels faster through like water than air?

if that doesn't sound familiar it's due to sound being a pulse wave

these pages explains that some more if your interested
www.le.ac.uk/se/centre...y/snd3.htm
hypertextbook.com/fact...kyDu.shtml

and this page here is a great site I use to convert every kind of unit immagenable....lol well almost

home.flash.net/~lorint...onvert.htm

hehe, kinda went wild and had some fun looking this one up Stoop, hope that answers you pretty good, hehe that's that engineer in me gettin all pysched up with questions like that

~S~

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JG300-Lurps
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 8:25 am
Post subject: Re: This frikkin' T-38 ROCKS!!!! THANK YOOO LURPS!!!!!!! :)


Ok guys ..I have my own story to tell .... and it starts like this ......

Ya see, the Boss Hawg needed someone to run him up to Vancouver
so he could meet up with his ... errr....ugh ... friend ...yeah .....
Soooo%20...anywhooo%20...after%20dropping%20him%20off%20for%20a%20covert%20liason%20..%208)%20..%20I%20had%20to%20bug%20out%20for%20KSFO%20to%20do%20som%20non-similar%20a/c%20tactical%20maneuvers with%20the%20Navy%20F-18%20jocks%20..... Yee%20Haaaw%20Maverick%20...%20we're%20going%20ballistic%20! and%20settled%20into%20a%20nice%20comfortable%20mach%201.20%20cruise%20at%20FL32%20....%20a%20cold%20Molson%20in%20one%20hand%20and%20little%20Elvis%20in%20the%20other%20..%20%20:oops:%20.. Anywhooo%20...%20after%20the%20virtual%20flaming%20of%20two%20of%20the%20Navy%20jocks,%20with%20another%20hightailing%20it%20back%20to%20Miramar%20like%20a%20scalded%20rabbit%20.... I%20decided%20to%20do%20a%20touch%20and%20go%20on%20the%20Navy's%20flat-top%20cruising%20outside%20San Fransisco%20Bay%20....%20just%20so%20they%20could%20get%20a%20good%20look%20at%20a%20REAL%20fighter%20 pilot%20....%20%20:wink:%20 and%20then%20it%20was%20off%20to%20Vancouver%20to%20pick%20up%20the%20Boss%20Hawg%20after%20his%20much needed%20R&R%20.....
ahhh .... what a way to make a livin .... Mr. Green

p.s. - to answer the Afterburner question : shift F4 turns on the afterburners ... but you have to be at full Military power ..... if you check
the throttle window you will see the afterburner light come on .... retarding
the throttle a bit will pull it out of afterburner ..... kinda like in the real thing, because you have to advance the throttles around a notch at full
military power to go into afterburners .... keeps the pilot from lighting the
burners and sucking up fuel w/out realizing it ! With the burners on Mach 1.20 is no problem at altitude .. about what the book says for a T-38 .

Have fun with her fellas ! ~S~
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