±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 603
Total: 603
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Member Screenshots
03: Community Forums
04: Photo Gallery
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Downloads
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Photo Gallery
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: Home
21: Photo Gallery
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Member Screenshots
25: Photo Gallery
26: Community Forums
27: Photo Gallery
28: Photo Gallery
29: Home
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Photo Gallery
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Photo Gallery
44: Community Forums
45: Home
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Statistics
49: Community Forums
50: Statistics
51: CPGlang
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Home
58: Photo Gallery
59: Community Forums
60: Photo Gallery
61: Member Screenshots
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Your Account
68: Community Forums
69: Photo Gallery
70: Home
71: Photo Gallery
72: Community Forums
73: Photo Gallery
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Home
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Downloads
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Downloads
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Your Account
93: Downloads
94: Community Forums
95: Home
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Photo Gallery
99: Home
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Photo Gallery
103: Community Forums
104: Photo Gallery
105: Downloads
106: Home
107: Photo Gallery
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Downloads
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Downloads
115: Community Forums
116: Downloads
117: Community Forums
118: Photo Gallery
119: Community Forums
120: Home
121: Home
122: Community Forums
123: Home
124: Community Forums
125: Downloads
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Home
130: Community Forums
131: Your Account
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Downloads
137: Home
138: Home
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Photo Gallery
142: Photo Gallery
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Photo Gallery
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Home
154: Community Forums
155: Photo Gallery
156: Community Forums
157: Downloads
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Community Forums
163: Photo Gallery
164: Your Account
165: Downloads
166: Community Forums
167: News Archive
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Home
173: CPGlang
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Downloads
179: Community Forums
180: Home
181: Community Forums
182: Downloads
183: Community Forums
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Photo Gallery
188: Photo Gallery
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Home
192: Photo Gallery
193: Community Forums
194: Home
195: Downloads
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Photo Gallery
201: Downloads
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Photo Gallery
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Photo Gallery
210: Community Forums
211: Community Forums
212: Home
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Community Forums
217: Photo Gallery
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Downloads
223: Member Screenshots
224: Photo Gallery
225: Photo Gallery
226: Downloads
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Home
234: Community Forums
235: Downloads
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Photo Gallery
239: Photo Gallery
240: Community Forums
241: News
242: Community Forums
243: Community Forums
244: Photo Gallery
245: Downloads
246: Home
247: Community Forums
248: Community Forums
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Photo Gallery
252: Photo Gallery
253: Community Forums
254: Home
255: Photo Gallery
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Photo Gallery
260: Home
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Member Screenshots
265: Photo Gallery
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Member Screenshots
269: Community Forums
270: Your Account
271: Photo Gallery
272: Community Forums
273: Home
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Home
277: Community Forums
278: Photo Gallery
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Home
282: Community Forums
283: Photo Gallery
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Home
289: Community Forums
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: Photo Gallery
293: Community Forums
294: Community Forums
295: Home
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Photo Gallery
300: Home
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Home
304: Community Forums
305: Photo Gallery
306: Your Account
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: CPGlang
311: Community Forums
312: Photo Gallery
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Downloads
316: Photo Gallery
317: Community Forums
318: Home
319: Community Forums
320: Member Screenshots
321: Home
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: Photo Gallery
325: Your Account
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Community Forums
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Downloads
334: Home
335: Community Forums
336: Home
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: CPGlang
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: Community Forums
348: Photo Gallery
349: Photo Gallery
350: Community Forums
351: Community Forums
352: Photo Gallery
353: Community Forums
354: Photo Gallery
355: Community Forums
356: Photo Gallery
357: Photo Gallery
358: Community Forums
359: Downloads
360: Community Forums
361: Photo Gallery
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Downloads
371: Photo Gallery
372: Downloads
373: News
374: Community Forums
375: Photo Gallery
376: Photo Gallery
377: Home
378: Home
379: Community Forums
380: Downloads
381: Community Forums
382: Photo Gallery
383: Photo Gallery
384: Photo Gallery
385: Home
386: Downloads
387: Photo Gallery
388: Community Forums
389: Photo Gallery
390: Community Forums
391: Community Forums
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Photo Gallery
397: Home
398: Photo Gallery
399: Community Forums
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Community Forums
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: Community Forums
412: Community Forums
413: Member Screenshots
414: Community Forums
415: Community Forums
416: Photo Gallery
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Downloads
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Community Forums
426: Community Forums
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Community Forums
433: Community Forums
434: CPGlang
435: Photo Gallery
436: Photo Gallery
437: Community Forums
438: Photo Gallery
439: Your Account
440: Community Forums
441: Community Forums
442: Community Forums
443: Photo Gallery
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums
447: Photo Gallery
448: Community Forums
449: Your Account
450: Community Forums
451: Photo Gallery
452: Photo Gallery
453: Community Forums
454: Community Forums
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Community Forums
460: Community Forums
461: Photo Gallery
462: Home
463: Photo Gallery
464: Community Forums
465: Downloads
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Community Forums
471: Community Forums
472: Community Forums
473: Photo Gallery
474: Community Forums
475: Photo Gallery
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Community Forums
480: Photo Gallery
481: Photo Gallery
482: Community Forums
483: Community Forums
484: Photo Gallery
485: Community Forums
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Photo Gallery
490: Community Forums
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Your Account
494: Community Forums
495: Your Account
496: Community Forums
497: Photo Gallery
498: Photo Gallery
499: Community Forums
500: Home
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Photo Gallery
504: Community Forums
505: Community Forums
506: Photo Gallery
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: Photo Gallery
510: Photo Gallery
511: Photo Gallery
512: Community Forums
513: Search
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Community Forums
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Photo Gallery
520: Photo Gallery
521: Community Forums
522: Photo Gallery
523: Photo Gallery
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Community Forums
528: Home
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Photo Gallery
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Member Screenshots
537: Community Forums
538: Photo Gallery
539: Photo Gallery
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Community Forums
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Photo Gallery
554: Community Forums
555: Community Forums
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Photo Gallery
559: Photo Gallery
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Photo Gallery
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Photo Gallery
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Home
571: Photo Gallery
572: Community Forums
573: Member Screenshots
574: Community Forums
575: Community Forums
576: Community Forums
577: Community Forums
578: Home
579: Community Forums
580: Community Forums
581: Community Forums
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: Home
586: Community Forums
587: Home
588: Community Forums
589: Photo Gallery
590: Community Forums
591: Photo Gallery
592: Community Forums
593: Downloads
594: Photo Gallery
595: Your Account
596: Community Forums
597: Community Forums
598: Photo Gallery
599: Community Forums
600: Community Forums
601: Photo Gallery
602: Community Forums
603: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
M50 Ontos picture location...
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:30 pm
Post subject: M50 Ontos picture location...

[img][/img][img][/img][img][/img]
I found these pictures of an M50 Ontos, but they do not tell where the pictures were taken. Does anyone know where these possibly are? While I would not want to be on the recieving end, were they really that successful? They were only in the inventory for roughly 6-7 years, correct?

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:32 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

MAN!...those gun tubes are straight! Can't possibly be a Renwal kit!
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 11:51 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

That the T165E2 #19 at APG

Late model prototype 'ONTOS'

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:19 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

That is an old picture of the Ontos on Aberdeen's now gone 'Mile of Tanks' The Mile has been gone for at least 5 years and the Ontos was very faded before that. I suspect the picture is atleast from the early 90s, maybe longer ago than that. The Ontos has been repainted and is awaiting new tracks. It has been waiting for the tracks for several years

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:32 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Jeff

Try here: Ontos History: Where are they now?

Actively fielded from 1957 till 1970. Although a couple seemed to linger till 1980 at Gitmo in Cuba.

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 4:00 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Why would this track need new tread unless it was meant to be a runner? What happened to the 5 mi stretch? Was the boulavard removed? Were the vehicles moved elsewhere on the post? Is there a "survivor" list of Ontos out there and where to find them? Come-on Ontos, you should know these questions?!

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Chris_C
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 214
Location: WV, USA
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 1:24 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

IIRC, some drunk driver smacked into one of the vehicles, leading to the bureaucrats complaining that the tanks weren't far enough from the road, etc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 3:00 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

- SFC_Jeff_Button
.....Is there a "survivor" list of Ontos out there and where to find them? Come-on Dontos, you should know these questions?!


Here you go:

1 ) United States Marine Corps Museum (Quantico, Virginia):
This is an M50A1 version which is in the process of a full restoration.

2 ) The Patton Museum of Cavalry & Armor (Ft Knox, Kentucky):
This is an M50A1 version which is in the process of a full operational restoration. Its completion date is currently April 2006.

3 ) Aberdeen Proving Grounds Museum (Aberdeen, Maryland):
This is a T165E2 (#19) prototype version which is in the process of a cosmetic restoration. It is currently not on public display.

4 ) American Heritage Park (El Monte, California):
This is an M50A1 version on Static display and is available for public viewing.

5 ) Rock Island Arsenal Museum (Rock Island, Illinois):
This is an M50A1 version on Static display and is available for public viewing.

6 ) Twenty Nine Palms Marine Base (29 Palms, California):
This is an M50A1 version on Static display and is available for public viewing.

7 ) Camp Atterbury Army Post (Atterbury, Indiana):
This is a T165 prototype version whch is cosmetically restored, it is on static display on the military installation.

8 ) USMC Museum of the Carolinas (Jacksonville, North Carolina:
This is an M50A1 version whch is operational, but currently not on public display.

9 ) Private Collection (Hockley, Texas):
This privately owned M50A1 version of the Ontos is operational. The owner participates in a number of voluntary public exhibits. This vehicle has been returned to its original configuration from forestry service configuration.

10 & 11) Military Vehicle Technology Foundation (Portola Valley, California):
The privately owned MVTF currently has two versions of the Ontos.
a) A T165E1 prototype version with the original GM 302ci engine. It is undergoing a total operational restoration.
b) A T165E2 prototype version of the Ontos.

12) Private Collection (Staten Island, New York):
This privately owned M50A1 version of the Ontos is being restored from its former forestry service configuration. It is currently not available for public viewing.

13) Private Collection (Vine Grove, Kentucky):
This privately owned M50A1 version of the Ontos is is planned to be restored from its current forestry service configuration. It is currently not available for public viewing.

NOTE: There are an additional '8 parts hulls' that are stripped or being stripped by private collectors to get their respective vehicles assembled.

An unknown collector reportably possesses 3 or 4 incomplete vehicles.

Also there are an additional 74(+ or -) at an undisclosed desert 'dumping' ground. These are untouchable in a closed/restricted area.

So,.....hows that?

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."


Last edited by Dontos on Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:38 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:19 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

I must say that I am impressed! I have printed that list and it is going into my M50 Ontos file, for future assitance on researching thses vehicles should I ever come across one. I've never seen one up close. Having seen your varied posts and resonses to posts, I must says you have one cool job at Knox. That LST building was cool, along with its belongings. I have researched everything I can here at Ft Irwin. I'm hoping that while Dougs here, we can get into the Sherman and maybe some other vehicles. If so, you can bet Doug and I will be posting lots of pictures here! I hope to see some cool stuff at China Lake as well. Once I get to Hood, I'll be very busy with my new job and getting situated, but once I am, I'll be posting quite a few pictures of the display vehicles.

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Jinx
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 186
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 6:08 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Something i've been wanting to ask for some time, now. What is the range of traverse for the turret on the M50? The lower pair of guns look as if they might hit the hull superstructure at some angles. And does the elevation of the guns matter in this? I've only ever seen pictures of this vehicle, and i can't remember any where the guns weren't forward and level.
Back to top
View user's profile
Chris_C
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 214
Location: WV, USA
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 6:36 am
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Turret traverse is limited to 80 degrees (40 left and right).
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 12:49 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Number 1) was at Aberdeen for part of it's restoration a while back. Neil posted some pictures of it on the old discussion group.

3) May not be on public display but it is viewable. I take folks by the storage yard it's in on most tours I give at Aberdeen. It is waiting for new track.

This is as good as time as any to explain what happened to the old 'Mile of Tanks'

Back several years ago (more than 5) a woman viered off the divided highway and ran into the M-5 Stuart. In the accident a child was severly injured. I've been told there was some question about speed, road condition (I'm told it was a rainy night) and driver condition. None of that really matters. There was a possible lawsuit against the Army. One of the factors that came into play was that although the median strip met standards when it was built newer standards required that it be at least 6-8 feet wider to have obstructions (The tanks) in the median and provide safety zones. As part of the settlemnent the Army agreed to move the tanks from the median.

The new Mile of Tanks is off on the right side of the road as you enter the base. It isn't as impressive as the old one but that's life. The good thing about the whole situation is that when they went to move the tanks the powers that be were forced to acknowledge the deteriorating condition of the vehicles. Many have been the the REfurb process now. There was a lot of track damage discovered when the tanks were moved. The band tracks of the Ontos basically fell apart when it was moved from the mud that it was slowly sinking into as were several other vehicles. So as much as I moan about the Mile going away because the Army 'caved in' to a lawsuit It was a good thing for the vehicles overall.

The old Mile of Tanks (as it existed in the 1960s) was Very Impressive. As you came in the gate at Aberdeen you started with the WWI tanks and followed the progression of American Armor right up to the present. Sometime in the years I was away the built a new gate and the WWI and interwar tanks were put in storage as the line was shortned (They just cut off the first several tanks to make space for the construction) and the 'Mile' in it's most recent form started with WWII. SOmetime in that period the 'Main Gate' was moved to a new road in from the Interstate and the 'Mile' was on a side road for most visitors. After 9/11 the New gate off of MD 22 was closed to visitor traffic for security reasons and Maryland Blvd became the main entrance again

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Jinx
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 186
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:32 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

- Chris_C
Turret traverse is limited to 80 degrees (40 left and right).



Great, thank you.

Since we're on the topic.....how about elevation/depression?
Back to top
View user's profile
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:49 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Elevation 20 degrees
Depression 10 degrees

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:51 pm
Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

...and maybe a word about the "kill radius" to the rear? Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum