±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 814
Total: 814
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: CPGlang
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Home
08: Member Screenshots
09: Home
10: Community Forums
11: Photo Gallery
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Home
18: Home
19: Downloads
20: Photo Gallery
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Photo Gallery
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: CPGlang
33: Photo Gallery
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Search
37: Home
38: Community Forums
39: Photo Gallery
40: Community Forums
41: Your Account
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: Community Forums
46: Home
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Downloads
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Home
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Member Screenshots
60: Community Forums
61: Member Screenshots
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Photo Gallery
65: Community Forums
66: Home
67: Community Forums
68: Downloads
69: Downloads
70: Home
71: Photo Gallery
72: Photo Gallery
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Downloads
78: Community Forums
79: Photo Gallery
80: Photo Gallery
81: Community Forums
82: Photo Gallery
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Downloads
88: Home
89: Home
90: Home
91: Member Screenshots
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Photo Gallery
97: Community Forums
98: Photo Gallery
99: Downloads
100: Community Forums
101: Home
102: Home
103: Downloads
104: CPGlang
105: Downloads
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Downloads
111: Community Forums
112: CPGlang
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Downloads
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: CPGlang
129: Community Forums
130: Photo Gallery
131: Community Forums
132: Photo Gallery
133: Home
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Photo Gallery
138: Community Forums
139: Photo Gallery
140: Community Forums
141: CPGlang
142: Photo Gallery
143: Community Forums
144: Photo Gallery
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Downloads
151: Community Forums
152: Photo Gallery
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Member Screenshots
157: Community Forums
158: Home
159: Photo Gallery
160: Community Forums
161: Photo Gallery
162: Community Forums
163: Community Forums
164: Photo Gallery
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Photo Gallery
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Photo Gallery
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Home
180: Home
181: Community Forums
182: Home
183: Photo Gallery
184: Home
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Home
190: Photo Gallery
191: Photo Gallery
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Photo Gallery
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Photo Gallery
200: Downloads
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Photo Gallery
204: Community Forums
205: Home
206: Community Forums
207: Photo Gallery
208: Photo Gallery
209: Community Forums
210: Photo Gallery
211: Community Forums
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Home
217: Community Forums
218: Photo Gallery
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Home
222: Home
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Photo Gallery
228: Photo Gallery
229: Downloads
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Community Forums
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: CPGlang
241: Community Forums
242: Downloads
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Photo Gallery
246: Home
247: Community Forums
248: Downloads
249: Home
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Photo Gallery
254: Statistics
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Home
259: Community Forums
260: Photo Gallery
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Photo Gallery
265: Community Forums
266: Home
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Member Screenshots
270: Community Forums
271: CPGlang
272: Community Forums
273: Home
274: Home
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Photo Gallery
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Downloads
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Downloads
285: CPGlang
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: CPGlang
289: Community Forums
290: Home
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Home
294: Community Forums
295: Community Forums
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Photo Gallery
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Photo Gallery
304: Downloads
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Downloads
309: Community Forums
310: CPGlang
311: Photo Gallery
312: Community Forums
313: Home
314: Community Forums
315: Home
316: Photo Gallery
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: Photo Gallery
321: Downloads
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Photo Gallery
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Community Forums
330: Photo Gallery
331: Home
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Home
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Home
341: Community Forums
342: Member Screenshots
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Photo Gallery
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Photo Gallery
350: Home
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Photo Gallery
355: CPGlang
356: Community Forums
357: Photo Gallery
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Downloads
361: Community Forums
362: Home
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Photo Gallery
366: Downloads
367: Community Forums
368: Photo Gallery
369: Community Forums
370: Community Forums
371: Downloads
372: Community Forums
373: Community Forums
374: Community Forums
375: CPGlang
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Community Forums
379: Photo Gallery
380: Community Forums
381: CPGlang
382: Community Forums
383: Community Forums
384: Home
385: Photo Gallery
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Downloads
391: Photo Gallery
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Home
399: Community Forums
400: Photo Gallery
401: CPGlang
402: Downloads
403: Photo Gallery
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Community Forums
407: Member Screenshots
408: Downloads
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: Photo Gallery
412: Your Account
413: Community Forums
414: Community Forums
415: Community Forums
416: Community Forums
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Home
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Community Forums
426: Downloads
427: Community Forums
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Home
431: Community Forums
432: Community Forums
433: Photo Gallery
434: Community Forums
435: Photo Gallery
436: Community Forums
437: Home
438: Statistics
439: Community Forums
440: Community Forums
441: Downloads
442: Community Forums
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums
447: Community Forums
448: Downloads
449: Community Forums
450: Photo Gallery
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Community Forums
454: Downloads
455: Downloads
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Community Forums
460: Community Forums
461: Photo Gallery
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Community Forums
467: Home
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Photo Gallery
471: Your Account
472: Community Forums
473: CPGlang
474: Photo Gallery
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Downloads
480: Your Account
481: Home
482: Home
483: Community Forums
484: Photo Gallery
485: Photo Gallery
486: Community Forums
487: Downloads
488: Statistics
489: Photo Gallery
490: Community Forums
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Home
494: Community Forums
495: Home
496: Community Forums
497: Community Forums
498: Your Account
499: Community Forums
500: Member Screenshots
501: Community Forums
502: Home
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: Community Forums
506: Community Forums
507: Home
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Home
511: Member Screenshots
512: Community Forums
513: Photo Gallery
514: Community Forums
515: Downloads
516: Downloads
517: Home
518: Home
519: Home
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Photo Gallery
523: Home
524: Community Forums
525: Photo Gallery
526: Home
527: Community Forums
528: Community Forums
529: Photo Gallery
530: Community Forums
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Downloads
535: Community Forums
536: Community Forums
537: Community Forums
538: Community Forums
539: Community Forums
540: Photo Gallery
541: Community Forums
542: Home
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Community Forums
550: Community Forums
551: Photo Gallery
552: Photo Gallery
553: Photo Gallery
554: Community Forums
555: Downloads
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Home
562: Community Forums
563: Photo Gallery
564: Member Screenshots
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Photo Gallery
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Photo Gallery
572: Photo Gallery
573: Community Forums
574: Community Forums
575: Photo Gallery
576: Community Forums
577: Downloads
578: Community Forums
579: Community Forums
580: Photo Gallery
581: Your Account
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: Community Forums
586: Community Forums
587: Community Forums
588: Photo Gallery
589: Community Forums
590: Community Forums
591: Downloads
592: Home
593: Community Forums
594: Community Forums
595: News Archive
596: Community Forums
597: Statistics
598: Community Forums
599: Home
600: CPGlang
601: Photo Gallery
602: Community Forums
603: Photo Gallery
604: Community Forums
605: Home
606: Community Forums
607: Photo Gallery
608: Member Screenshots
609: Community Forums
610: Community Forums
611: Photo Gallery
612: Community Forums
613: Your Account
614: Downloads
615: Home
616: Community Forums
617: Community Forums
618: CPGlang
619: Community Forums
620: Community Forums
621: Home
622: Community Forums
623: Community Forums
624: Community Forums
625: Community Forums
626: CPGlang
627: Photo Gallery
628: Photo Gallery
629: Community Forums
630: Community Forums
631: Downloads
632: Downloads
633: Community Forums
634: Community Forums
635: Community Forums
636: Community Forums
637: Community Forums
638: Home
639: Community Forums
640: Community Forums
641: Community Forums
642: Your Account
643: Home
644: CPGlang
645: Community Forums
646: Community Forums
647: Community Forums
648: Community Forums
649: Community Forums
650: Community Forums
651: Community Forums
652: Home
653: Photo Gallery
654: Photo Gallery
655: Community Forums
656: Community Forums
657: Member Screenshots
658: Your Account
659: Community Forums
660: Community Forums
661: Community Forums
662: Community Forums
663: Community Forums
664: Community Forums
665: Photo Gallery
666: Community Forums
667: Photo Gallery
668: Community Forums
669: Community Forums
670: Community Forums
671: Community Forums
672: Community Forums
673: Community Forums
674: Photo Gallery
675: Community Forums
676: Community Forums
677: Community Forums
678: Community Forums
679: Photo Gallery
680: Community Forums
681: Photo Gallery
682: Community Forums
683: Community Forums
684: Community Forums
685: Home
686: News Archive
687: Community Forums
688: Community Forums
689: Community Forums
690: Community Forums
691: Community Forums
692: Community Forums
693: Community Forums
694: Community Forums
695: Community Forums
696: Community Forums
697: CPGlang
698: Home
699: Community Forums
700: Community Forums
701: Your Account
702: Home
703: Community Forums
704: Community Forums
705: Photo Gallery
706: Community Forums
707: Community Forums
708: Home
709: Community Forums
710: Community Forums
711: Community Forums
712: Community Forums
713: Community Forums
714: Community Forums
715: Community Forums
716: Downloads
717: Photo Gallery
718: Community Forums
719: Community Forums
720: News Archive
721: Photo Gallery
722: Community Forums
723: Photo Gallery
724: Downloads
725: Community Forums
726: Member Screenshots
727: Home
728: Community Forums
729: Community Forums
730: Home
731: Photo Gallery
732: Community Forums
733: Community Forums
734: Community Forums
735: Community Forums
736: Photo Gallery
737: Community Forums
738: Home
739: Community Forums
740: Community Forums
741: Community Forums
742: Community Forums
743: CPGlang
744: Community Forums
745: Community Forums
746: Member Screenshots
747: Community Forums
748: Photo Gallery
749: Community Forums
750: Community Forums
751: Community Forums
752: Community Forums
753: Member Screenshots
754: Community Forums
755: Community Forums
756: Community Forums
757: Community Forums
758: Community Forums
759: Downloads
760: Community Forums
761: Community Forums
762: Photo Gallery
763: Statistics
764: Downloads
765: Community Forums
766: Downloads
767: Community Forums
768: Community Forums
769: Community Forums
770: Downloads
771: Community Forums
772: Community Forums
773: Community Forums
774: Photo Gallery
775: Community Forums
776: Downloads
777: Downloads
778: Home
779: Community Forums
780: Photo Gallery
781: Community Forums
782: Home
783: Community Forums
784: Member Screenshots
785: Community Forums
786: Community Forums
787: Photo Gallery
788: Community Forums
789: Community Forums
790: Community Forums
791: Home
792: Community Forums
793: Statistics
794: Community Forums
795: Community Forums
796: Community Forums
797: Community Forums
798: Home
799: Community Forums
800: News Archive
801: Downloads
802: Photo Gallery
803: Photo Gallery
804: Your Account
805: Community Forums
806: Community Forums
807: Community Forums
808: Community Forums
809: Community Forums
810: Your Account
811: Downloads
812: Community Forums
813: Community Forums
814: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Stryker at NTC
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:43 am
Post subject: Stryker at NTC



I visited the NTC last week to follow 3rd Bde, 2nd ID as they went through a rotation to get ready for Iraq. Here is a "knocked out" scout from 1-14 Cav. The scenerio was that some insurgents took over a small town from the Iraqi security forces. with an armor depot nearby, so they had some armor. A BMP took out this scout. When I asked the VC how he let a BMP take him out, he said he was escorting a convoy back to post when he got hit. He said he could have taken out the BMP if he had his Javelin, but the CO took it from him. I don't know, if this were the "Legacy" army then the scouts would have had some anti-armor capability, like a 25mm gun at least.

Reminds me of early WWII German scounts who did not have much besides MGs to defend themselves with. And back then in 1939 and 1940 other armies did not have the punch that is out there today, so at least the Germans had a chance. I would not want to be a scout in a Stryker (other than Iraq where the threat is really non-existent).

Does anybody know what the code is on the corner of the vehicle? Does it possibly have to do w/ shipping, a la the codes used in OIF1. It definitely is not a serial number as that is on the front hull and is different.

Bob
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 5:23 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

The code you speak of is the USA number, if you are refering to the black stencil on the OD paint (JO00IT). I have a couple vehicles on display here at NTC that have comparable USA #'s, (JJ03YM, JJ05UF, JZ002H, etc...). Even if he had his Javelin, OPFOR and the "Insurgents" of the NTC are quite good. I have taken out a Marine LAV here back in summer of 04 with relative ease with 155 shells buried under the road suface on a one lane bridge by East Gate village. Marines ahd actually walked over and stepped on the round while I acted as an inocent civilian. Once the vehicle moved over the bridge which had been "cleared" by the ground troops, "BOOM"!. The OC's "killed" the vehicle and a couple ground troops as we walked away. Another good day for the OPFOR!!!

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 6:12 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

And I came upon an OC who was MFing the men at a checkpoint at Junction City for making a tactical mistake I will not go into here. It was amusing to listen to him, "This town is grey now, but it will be going black soon!"

Man, and those OCs are hardcore. Freezing temps and no doors or windshields. They all have heater hoses tucked into their BDUs and whatnot! I have had my fill of driving in Humvees over rough ground. I had to ride like I would a horse, anticipating the bumps and raising my butt off the seat to take the bump. Also, almost rolled over when a turn came up going at speed in the dark - whoaaa, hold on! If it weren't for the seatbelt I would have got tossed out on that slide since those seats are damn small! Or maybe it was my big fat butt that did not fit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:26 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- Burik

I visited the NTC last week to follow 3rd Bde, 2nd ID as they went through a rotation to get ready for Iraq. Here is a "knocked out" scout from 1-14 Cav. The scenerio was that some insurgents took over a small town from the Iraqi security forces. with an armor depot nearby, so they had some armor. A BMP took out this scout. When I asked the VC how he let a BMP take him out, he said he was escorting a convoy back to post when he got hit. He said he could have taken out the BMP if he had his Javelin, but the CO took it from him. I don't know, if this were the "Legacy" army then the scouts would have had some anti-armor capability, like a 25mm gun at least.
Bob


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

Thanks for the photo of a M1127 RCV Stryker.

Interesting that the C.O. took the VC's AT-4 Javelin away from him.
That would be like a WW II German Commander or a Legacy Commander taking the auto cannon off the scout vehicle. Sad
The AT-4 is the primary anti-armor weapon/round of ammo for scout RCVs and infantry ICVs of the Stryker Brigades. Puzzling. I wonder why the VC didn't use his Scout Scope (I think that system is called a RVSS?) to ID the BMP and then take the convoy his was escorting around it? Neutral

- Burik

Reminds me of early WWII German scounts who did not have much besides MGs to defend themselves with. And back then in 1939 and 1940 other armies did not have the punch that is out there today, so at least the Germans had a chance. I would not want to be a scout in a Stryker (other than Iraq where the threat is really non-existent).

Bob


If not a Stryker, what do you think would be a better scout vehicle?

How about using a M-151 mounting a M-60 machine gun? Rolling Eyes

The Stryker Brigades are not designed for something like the Warsaw Pack vis NATO full blown fire fight, putting them into something like that would be a major mis-used. But then we have taken an Airborne Infantry BCT and thrown it out into the desert for use as a speed bump to stop or delay an armored attack south out of Kuwait. An SBCT would have a much better chance of pulling off a delaying action like that with a lot fewer casualties. The Stryker FOVs/SBCTs adds another tool to Combat Commander's tool box. No vehicle or system is prefect for all conditions. Confused

Unless we are talking about the greatest Scout vehicle ever. The M114 Lingle.

Any chance you where able to take some other photos of the NTC during your visit? Razz

Just my 2 cents for the discussion. Smile
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:28 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

Roy:

I was wondering the same thing about the BMP. I was not in a position to really quiz him, as we were pulling out, and he probably would have gotten ticked off with too many "insulting" questions. As Sgt Button noted, those OPFOR guys are pretty good. Maybe they popped out from behind good cover before he could do anything about it.

The whole Stryker concept perplexes me a little. The Marines have a darned good vehicle in the LAV and it has plenty of firepower and is light at the same time. Why can't the Stryker have the Bradley turret on it? I would think it would still fit in a C130, which seems to be a major requirement. I know the threats out there are not like the old Soviet days, but the N Koreans are pretty strong, and the Syrians, and the Iranians. Sending a Stryker Bde to be the first point of contact would be even worse than the 82nd w/ their Sheridans since the Sheridans at least could shoot back. But I have no problem w/ the Stryker's use in Iraq. I have first hand experience w/ how quiet it is, and so it is great for raids and such. Just as long as the Stryker guys are not expected to go up against enemy w/ armor or anti-armor capabilities... Plus, it's offroad capabilites are not as good as say a Bradley or M113, and it may be in a tough spot in a built up area since it can not make tight turns like a tracked vehicle. But, wheeled vehicles are not as tough to maintain. So, yes, there is no perfect vehicle. As long as it is not misused...

Yes, I have lots more photos. I can share some here. I plan on doing an article or two in Military Modelling of England coinciding w/ the new Trumpeter kit coming out. I also plan on doing a photo history book on the NTC. Digital cameras are the greatest. THere is no such thing as wasted film, and LOTS of photos can be taken, as long as you have enough flash cards or flash card space. One version I did not get enough good shots of were the engineer vehicles. But, I am invited up to Ft Lewis (I live in Portland, OR) to see some more at the motorpool. I need to see some with the slat armor. I think I have a coulpe of cool shots of an FA unit during a live fire exercise taking down a small village.

Bob
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:44 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

i49.photobucket.com/al...gas011.jpg

I took this shot after a long day, so I was too lazy to get out of the OC Humvee, but the OCs have no windshields, so no problem. It is the FA guys mounting up onto the Strykers from the Recon unit that was attached to them. Live ammo, so everybody is pumped up after a couple of dry runs. The Recon unit is not the Cav guys though, like the first photo in this thread. I am told this is a newer idea, and you can see there are a mixture of vehicles in a small unit/platoon.

i49.photobucket.com/al...gas010.jpg

This second shot is the same guys, but earlier. This was one of the dry runs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:47 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC





Sorry about that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:58 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC



"If not a Stryker, what do you think would be a better scout vehicle?"

How about using a M-151 mounting a M-60 machine gun? Rolling Eyes


Ha! BTDT....no thanky, Roy! At least, not without the added protection of canvas doors....

I have had my fill of driving in Humvees over rough ground. I had to ride like I would a horse, anticipating the bumps and raising my butt off the seat to take the bump. Also, almost rolled over when a turn came up going at speed in the dark - whoaaa, hold on! If it weren't for the seatbelt I would have got tossed out on that slide since those seats are damn small!


Bob...now we get to the heart of the M151 question. If you thing the Humvee is a bad ride, get in the back of an M151 sometime! Laughing
...and don't think about taking turns at speed...just don't.

Oh....what's a "seat belt"? Shocked

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:54 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

This rotation you took the pictures of was the first to utilize "live ammo" to within 200 meters of the towns. There was very strict compliance with who could go and be where at certain times. OC's played a much larger and important role than usual because of this ammo training. I know of a few 1SG's that were more worried about their troops being out in the "box" with ammo than they were about being in Iraq with ammo, and they were vocal about it at the command and staff meeting. As much as you try to replicate and make it seem like a combat enviroment, there is still that part in the back of your mind that knows your not, and therefore soldiers aren't always as careful with their weapons as they should be. But so far, so good, no ones been hurt and I haven't heard of any accidental discharges yet. Believe me, when they happen, we'll know, that kind of incident spread like wild fire.

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:11 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- Burik
Roy:

The whole Stryker concept perplexes me a little. The Marines have a darned good vehicle in the LAV and it has plenty of firepower and is light at the same time. Why can't the Stryker have the Bradley turret on it? I would think it would still fit in a C130, which seems to be a major requirement.
Bob


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

It's not good to compair the Marines with the Army when it comes to 8x8 armored cars.

The Marines are using their LAV-25s in Recon Battalions. They only carry four dismount Scouts in the back of those vehicles. With the Delco 25 mm turret, there is ONLY room for six combat loaded Marines. One of the major problems learned with the Bradley and that turret is there isn't enough room to carry a squad of infantry (nine men) in a Bradley Infantry Company. The Stryker could be fitted with a Bradley turret or a Delco 25 turret and still fit inside a C-130. The Canadain Forces use LAV IIIs with the Delco 25 turret and we have been told by some of them that those vehicles do fit inside a C-130. The Army could have added a 25mm turret but it would reduce the number of troops a Stryker can carry and that would require more Strykers to carry the number of infantry men in the BCT. As for the Scouts (I to would have liked to have seen the M1127 RCV fitted with a 25mm turret) but that would add weight to the supply tail. More ammo (in this case, only used by the Scouts). More parts to repair things (in this case, again limited to only the Scout vehicles). The idea is to get an infantry brigade in the air with the least amount of lift aircarft and tied up the least amount of aircraft required to support and resupply the BCT once it is there.

Think of a Stryker BCT as light infantry unit (as in walking and must carry almost everything on their backs) that has been upgraded with trucks that have some armored protection. This is an upgrade of light infantry, not a down grade of mech infantry with lighter vehicles. The Scouts in the SBCT are light scouts who will need to use movement and concealment to do their job. They are not heavy Armored Cavarly Scouts who can fight for information or conduct an ecomany of force operation. That VC you talked with would have been conducting that convoy escort mission with a M151 or Hummer if he was still in a light infantry brigade. The BMP would have still got him if he was not watching and drove out into it's kill zone. With a light infantry scout unit, you have walking Scouts and light wheeled vehicle mounted scouts. The Stryker RCV can carry a lot of AT-4s, more troops in each vehicle, carry that very heavy Long Range Scout Surveillance System (LRAS3, the super scout scope I was talking about in my other post). When thinking about a light infantry brigade and the scouts units, Stryker is a major upgrade.

- Burik

I know the threats out there are not like the old Soviet days, but the N Koreans are pretty strong, and the Syrians, and the Iranians. Sending a Stryker Bde to be the first point of contact would be even worse than the 82nd w/ their Sheridans since the Sheridans at least could shoot back.
Bob


Sending a Stryker BCT would have been worse that the 82nd w/their Sheridans?
Hold on here David! First of all we are NOT talking about all of the 82nd Airborne Division. We are talking about ONE BCT from the 82nd. About the same number of infantry, maybe a little bit less than what a SBCT now has. Sheirdans? We are not talking about the complete battalion. We are talking about ONE tank company, divided three ways with four tanks support each battalion of dismouted infantry. Dismounted infantry that could only get out of the way of a heavy division attack by digging in and keeping their heads down or using their feet and trying to run away in an open desert. It would have been very hard for that BCT to conduct a delaying action once the troops had been dropped off. A SBCT on the other hand would have been able to load up the infantry and move them to one delaying position after another. Using AT-4s to reduce the number of attacking AFVs.

- Burik

But I have no problem w/ the Stryker's use in Iraq. I have first hand experience w/ how quiet it is, and so it is great for raids and such. Just as long as the Stryker guys are not expected to go up against enemy w/ armor or anti-armor capabilities... Plus, it's offroad capabilites are not as good as say a Bradley or M113, and it may be in a tough spot in a built up area since it can not make tight turns like a tracked vehicle. But, wheeled vehicles are not as tough to maintain. So, yes, there is no perfect vehicle. As long as it is not misused...
Bob



When it comes to military operations, one must always be ready to use what is available to do what ever must be done. Someday, possible somewhere those Stryker BCTs may end up facing a heavy armored force and those troopers had better know how to use what they have to do the best they can. Task Force Smith and the Battle of the Bulge are two possible examples where units where tasked to do things they where never designed for.

- Burik

Yes, I have lots more photos. I can share some here. I plan on doing an article or two in Military Modelling of England coinciding w/ the new Trumpeter kit coming out. I also plan on doing a photo history book on the NTC. Digital cameras are the greatest. THere is no such thing as wasted film, and LOTS of photos can be taken, as long as you have enough flash cards or flash card space. One version I did not get enough good shots of were the engineer vehicles. But, I am invited up to Ft Lewis (I live in Portland, OR) to see some more at the motorpool. I need to see some with the slat armor. I think I have a coulpe of cool shots of an FA unit during a live fire exercise taking down a small village.
Bob


Super, can not wait to see what you can share with us all.

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.


Last edited by Roy_A_Lingle on Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:06 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 4:59 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

Roy, well said. Point taken.

Cheers.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 10:04 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

It just hit me that these Strykers do not have the bar armor on them. Seems that if they are training for deployment they would try to have vehicles equiped the same way as they will use in the field. I can see the extra size affecting everything from how the vehicle drives to how you dismount and clear the vehicle.

Just seems like a big oversight to me

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 10:22 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- bsmart
It just hit me that these Strykers do not have the bar armor on them. Seems that if they are training for deployment they would try to have vehicles equiped the same way as they will use in the field. I can see the extra size affecting everything from how the vehicle drives to how you dismount and clear the vehicle.

Just seems like a big oversight to me


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

It's not an oversight. It's another case of NOT ENOUGH MONEY Evil or Very Mad . One of the lessons learned by the first two SBCTs was the drivers need some training with all that extra bar armor. The corrective plan is to buy a few sets for the state side units so all drivers can get some experence driving with the cages installed. Besides, the bird cages are an intrim Evil or Very Mad fix, the Army is working on next phase of protection.

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum