±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 610
Total: 610
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Home
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Home
08: Community Forums
09: Home
10: Community Forums
11: Home
12: Downloads
13: Home
14: Downloads
15: Photo Gallery
16: Community Forums
17: Home
18: Photo Gallery
19: Downloads
20: Community Forums
21: Home
22: Community Forums
23: Photo Gallery
24: Home
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Photo Gallery
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Home
36: Home
37: Community Forums
38: Home
39: Member Screenshots
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Downloads
45: Community Forums
46: Community Forums
47: News
48: Home
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Photo Gallery
53: Your Account
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Home
61: Photo Gallery
62: Community Forums
63: Home
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Downloads
67: Home
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Photo Gallery
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Photo Gallery
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Member Screenshots
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Home
93: Member Screenshots
94: Photo Gallery
95: Home
96: Photo Gallery
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Downloads
104: Home
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Home
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Photo Gallery
111: Community Forums
112: Photo Gallery
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Home
116: Community Forums
117: Photo Gallery
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Member Screenshots
122: Home
123: Home
124: Downloads
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Downloads
131: Home
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Home
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Home
138: Community Forums
139: Photo Gallery
140: Home
141: Photo Gallery
142: Downloads
143: Community Forums
144: Photo Gallery
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Downloads
148: Photo Gallery
149: Community Forums
150: Photo Gallery
151: Community Forums
152: Photo Gallery
153: News Archive
154: Photo Gallery
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Photo Gallery
163: Community Forums
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Photo Gallery
170: Photo Gallery
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Downloads
174: Photo Gallery
175: Photo Gallery
176: Community Forums
177: Photo Gallery
178: Photo Gallery
179: Home
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Community Forums
184: Community Forums
185: Photo Gallery
186: Member Screenshots
187: Photo Gallery
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Your Account
192: Community Forums
193: Photo Gallery
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Photo Gallery
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Photo Gallery
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Home
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Photo Gallery
211: Downloads
212: Community Forums
213: Photo Gallery
214: Photo Gallery
215: Community Forums
216: Downloads
217: Community Forums
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Photo Gallery
223: Community Forums
224: Home
225: Community Forums
226: Home
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Home
235: News
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Home
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Photo Gallery
242: Photo Gallery
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Home
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Home
260: Photo Gallery
261: Home
262: Community Forums
263: Home
264: Photo Gallery
265: CPGlang
266: Photo Gallery
267: Community Forums
268: Home
269: Community Forums
270: Photo Gallery
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Community Forums
279: Photo Gallery
280: Community Forums
281: Home
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Photo Gallery
285: CPGlang
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Photo Gallery
289: Community Forums
290: Community Forums
291: News
292: Photo Gallery
293: Home
294: Community Forums
295: Community Forums
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Photo Gallery
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Home
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Member Screenshots
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Photo Gallery
309: Community Forums
310: Community Forums
311: Photo Gallery
312: Home
313: Community Forums
314: Photo Gallery
315: Home
316: Community Forums
317: Community Forums
318: Statistics
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Home
323: Photo Gallery
324: Community Forums
325: Downloads
326: CPGlang
327: Community Forums
328: Photo Gallery
329: Community Forums
330: Community Forums
331: Photo Gallery
332: Community Forums
333: Home
334: Photo Gallery
335: Photo Gallery
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Your Account
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Photo Gallery
347: Community Forums
348: Statistics
349: Community Forums
350: Community Forums
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Photo Gallery
355: Photo Gallery
356: Photo Gallery
357: Community Forums
358: Photo Gallery
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Your Account
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Home
369: Community Forums
370: Community Forums
371: Home
372: Community Forums
373: Community Forums
374: Your Account
375: Community Forums
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Photo Gallery
379: Community Forums
380: Downloads
381: Community Forums
382: Home
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Community Forums
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Downloads
391: Community Forums
392: Downloads
393: Photo Gallery
394: Photo Gallery
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Community Forums
399: Home
400: Home
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Photo Gallery
405: Photo Gallery
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Community Forums
409: Photo Gallery
410: CPGlang
411: CPGlang
412: Photo Gallery
413: Community Forums
414: Community Forums
415: Community Forums
416: Photo Gallery
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Home
422: Community Forums
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Community Forums
426: Home
427: Community Forums
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Photo Gallery
433: Home
434: Community Forums
435: Home
436: Community Forums
437: Your Account
438: Community Forums
439: Statistics
440: Photo Gallery
441: Community Forums
442: Community Forums
443: Home
444: Community Forums
445: Downloads
446: CPGlang
447: Downloads
448: Photo Gallery
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Community Forums
452: Photo Gallery
453: Your Account
454: Community Forums
455: Home
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Downloads
459: Downloads
460: Community Forums
461: Photo Gallery
462: Downloads
463: Photo Gallery
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Photo Gallery
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Home
471: Community Forums
472: Photo Gallery
473: Downloads
474: Photo Gallery
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Photo Gallery
478: Community Forums
479: Photo Gallery
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Community Forums
484: Downloads
485: Community Forums
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Your Account
490: Community Forums
491: Photo Gallery
492: Community Forums
493: Community Forums
494: Community Forums
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Home
498: Community Forums
499: Downloads
500: Community Forums
501: Home
502: Community Forums
503: Photo Gallery
504: Photo Gallery
505: Photo Gallery
506: Community Forums
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Photo Gallery
511: Community Forums
512: Home
513: Downloads
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Community Forums
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Community Forums
520: Photo Gallery
521: Photo Gallery
522: Photo Gallery
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Home
526: Photo Gallery
527: Community Forums
528: Community Forums
529: News
530: Downloads
531: Community Forums
532: Home
533: Downloads
534: Photo Gallery
535: Photo Gallery
536: Community Forums
537: Photo Gallery
538: Community Forums
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Photo Gallery
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: News
548: Photo Gallery
549: Member Screenshots
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Home
553: Community Forums
554: Community Forums
555: Community Forums
556: Downloads
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Photo Gallery
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Community Forums
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Community Forums
572: Community Forums
573: Member Screenshots
574: Community Forums
575: Community Forums
576: Home
577: Community Forums
578: Photo Gallery
579: Community Forums
580: Community Forums
581: Community Forums
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: Community Forums
586: Your Account
587: Photo Gallery
588: Community Forums
589: Community Forums
590: Photo Gallery
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Photo Gallery
595: Photo Gallery
596: Community Forums
597: Home
598: Home
599: Community Forums
600: Home
601: Community Forums
602: Community Forums
603: Community Forums
604: Community Forums
605: Photo Gallery
606: Photo Gallery
607: Photo Gallery
608: Community Forums
609: Community Forums
610: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Stryker at NTC
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:43 am
Post subject: Stryker at NTC



I visited the NTC last week to follow 3rd Bde, 2nd ID as they went through a rotation to get ready for Iraq. Here is a "knocked out" scout from 1-14 Cav. The scenerio was that some insurgents took over a small town from the Iraqi security forces. with an armor depot nearby, so they had some armor. A BMP took out this scout. When I asked the VC how he let a BMP take him out, he said he was escorting a convoy back to post when he got hit. He said he could have taken out the BMP if he had his Javelin, but the CO took it from him. I don't know, if this were the "Legacy" army then the scouts would have had some anti-armor capability, like a 25mm gun at least.

Reminds me of early WWII German scounts who did not have much besides MGs to defend themselves with. And back then in 1939 and 1940 other armies did not have the punch that is out there today, so at least the Germans had a chance. I would not want to be a scout in a Stryker (other than Iraq where the threat is really non-existent).

Does anybody know what the code is on the corner of the vehicle? Does it possibly have to do w/ shipping, a la the codes used in OIF1. It definitely is not a serial number as that is on the front hull and is different.

Bob
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 5:23 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

The code you speak of is the USA number, if you are refering to the black stencil on the OD paint (JO00IT). I have a couple vehicles on display here at NTC that have comparable USA #'s, (JJ03YM, JJ05UF, JZ002H, etc...). Even if he had his Javelin, OPFOR and the "Insurgents" of the NTC are quite good. I have taken out a Marine LAV here back in summer of 04 with relative ease with 155 shells buried under the road suface on a one lane bridge by East Gate village. Marines ahd actually walked over and stepped on the round while I acted as an inocent civilian. Once the vehicle moved over the bridge which had been "cleared" by the ground troops, "BOOM"!. The OC's "killed" the vehicle and a couple ground troops as we walked away. Another good day for the OPFOR!!!

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 6:12 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

And I came upon an OC who was MFing the men at a checkpoint at Junction City for making a tactical mistake I will not go into here. It was amusing to listen to him, "This town is grey now, but it will be going black soon!"

Man, and those OCs are hardcore. Freezing temps and no doors or windshields. They all have heater hoses tucked into their BDUs and whatnot! I have had my fill of driving in Humvees over rough ground. I had to ride like I would a horse, anticipating the bumps and raising my butt off the seat to take the bump. Also, almost rolled over when a turn came up going at speed in the dark - whoaaa, hold on! If it weren't for the seatbelt I would have got tossed out on that slide since those seats are damn small! Or maybe it was my big fat butt that did not fit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:26 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- Burik

I visited the NTC last week to follow 3rd Bde, 2nd ID as they went through a rotation to get ready for Iraq. Here is a "knocked out" scout from 1-14 Cav. The scenerio was that some insurgents took over a small town from the Iraqi security forces. with an armor depot nearby, so they had some armor. A BMP took out this scout. When I asked the VC how he let a BMP take him out, he said he was escorting a convoy back to post when he got hit. He said he could have taken out the BMP if he had his Javelin, but the CO took it from him. I don't know, if this were the "Legacy" army then the scouts would have had some anti-armor capability, like a 25mm gun at least.
Bob


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

Thanks for the photo of a M1127 RCV Stryker.

Interesting that the C.O. took the VC's AT-4 Javelin away from him.
That would be like a WW II German Commander or a Legacy Commander taking the auto cannon off the scout vehicle. Sad
The AT-4 is the primary anti-armor weapon/round of ammo for scout RCVs and infantry ICVs of the Stryker Brigades. Puzzling. I wonder why the VC didn't use his Scout Scope (I think that system is called a RVSS?) to ID the BMP and then take the convoy his was escorting around it? Neutral

- Burik

Reminds me of early WWII German scounts who did not have much besides MGs to defend themselves with. And back then in 1939 and 1940 other armies did not have the punch that is out there today, so at least the Germans had a chance. I would not want to be a scout in a Stryker (other than Iraq where the threat is really non-existent).

Bob


If not a Stryker, what do you think would be a better scout vehicle?

How about using a M-151 mounting a M-60 machine gun? Rolling Eyes

The Stryker Brigades are not designed for something like the Warsaw Pack vis NATO full blown fire fight, putting them into something like that would be a major mis-used. But then we have taken an Airborne Infantry BCT and thrown it out into the desert for use as a speed bump to stop or delay an armored attack south out of Kuwait. An SBCT would have a much better chance of pulling off a delaying action like that with a lot fewer casualties. The Stryker FOVs/SBCTs adds another tool to Combat Commander's tool box. No vehicle or system is prefect for all conditions. Confused

Unless we are talking about the greatest Scout vehicle ever. The M114 Lingle.

Any chance you where able to take some other photos of the NTC during your visit? Razz

Just my 2 cents for the discussion. Smile
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:28 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

Roy:

I was wondering the same thing about the BMP. I was not in a position to really quiz him, as we were pulling out, and he probably would have gotten ticked off with too many "insulting" questions. As Sgt Button noted, those OPFOR guys are pretty good. Maybe they popped out from behind good cover before he could do anything about it.

The whole Stryker concept perplexes me a little. The Marines have a darned good vehicle in the LAV and it has plenty of firepower and is light at the same time. Why can't the Stryker have the Bradley turret on it? I would think it would still fit in a C130, which seems to be a major requirement. I know the threats out there are not like the old Soviet days, but the N Koreans are pretty strong, and the Syrians, and the Iranians. Sending a Stryker Bde to be the first point of contact would be even worse than the 82nd w/ their Sheridans since the Sheridans at least could shoot back. But I have no problem w/ the Stryker's use in Iraq. I have first hand experience w/ how quiet it is, and so it is great for raids and such. Just as long as the Stryker guys are not expected to go up against enemy w/ armor or anti-armor capabilities... Plus, it's offroad capabilites are not as good as say a Bradley or M113, and it may be in a tough spot in a built up area since it can not make tight turns like a tracked vehicle. But, wheeled vehicles are not as tough to maintain. So, yes, there is no perfect vehicle. As long as it is not misused...

Yes, I have lots more photos. I can share some here. I plan on doing an article or two in Military Modelling of England coinciding w/ the new Trumpeter kit coming out. I also plan on doing a photo history book on the NTC. Digital cameras are the greatest. THere is no such thing as wasted film, and LOTS of photos can be taken, as long as you have enough flash cards or flash card space. One version I did not get enough good shots of were the engineer vehicles. But, I am invited up to Ft Lewis (I live in Portland, OR) to see some more at the motorpool. I need to see some with the slat armor. I think I have a coulpe of cool shots of an FA unit during a live fire exercise taking down a small village.

Bob
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:44 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

i49.photobucket.com/al...gas011.jpg

I took this shot after a long day, so I was too lazy to get out of the OC Humvee, but the OCs have no windshields, so no problem. It is the FA guys mounting up onto the Strykers from the Recon unit that was attached to them. Live ammo, so everybody is pumped up after a couple of dry runs. The Recon unit is not the Cav guys though, like the first photo in this thread. I am told this is a newer idea, and you can see there are a mixture of vehicles in a small unit/platoon.

i49.photobucket.com/al...gas010.jpg

This second shot is the same guys, but earlier. This was one of the dry runs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:47 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC





Sorry about that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:58 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC



"If not a Stryker, what do you think would be a better scout vehicle?"

How about using a M-151 mounting a M-60 machine gun? Rolling Eyes


Ha! BTDT....no thanky, Roy! At least, not without the added protection of canvas doors....

I have had my fill of driving in Humvees over rough ground. I had to ride like I would a horse, anticipating the bumps and raising my butt off the seat to take the bump. Also, almost rolled over when a turn came up going at speed in the dark - whoaaa, hold on! If it weren't for the seatbelt I would have got tossed out on that slide since those seats are damn small!


Bob...now we get to the heart of the M151 question. If you thing the Humvee is a bad ride, get in the back of an M151 sometime! Laughing
...and don't think about taking turns at speed...just don't.

Oh....what's a "seat belt"? Shocked

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:54 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

This rotation you took the pictures of was the first to utilize "live ammo" to within 200 meters of the towns. There was very strict compliance with who could go and be where at certain times. OC's played a much larger and important role than usual because of this ammo training. I know of a few 1SG's that were more worried about their troops being out in the "box" with ammo than they were about being in Iraq with ammo, and they were vocal about it at the command and staff meeting. As much as you try to replicate and make it seem like a combat enviroment, there is still that part in the back of your mind that knows your not, and therefore soldiers aren't always as careful with their weapons as they should be. But so far, so good, no ones been hurt and I haven't heard of any accidental discharges yet. Believe me, when they happen, we'll know, that kind of incident spread like wild fire.

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:11 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- Burik
Roy:

The whole Stryker concept perplexes me a little. The Marines have a darned good vehicle in the LAV and it has plenty of firepower and is light at the same time. Why can't the Stryker have the Bradley turret on it? I would think it would still fit in a C130, which seems to be a major requirement.
Bob


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

It's not good to compair the Marines with the Army when it comes to 8x8 armored cars.

The Marines are using their LAV-25s in Recon Battalions. They only carry four dismount Scouts in the back of those vehicles. With the Delco 25 mm turret, there is ONLY room for six combat loaded Marines. One of the major problems learned with the Bradley and that turret is there isn't enough room to carry a squad of infantry (nine men) in a Bradley Infantry Company. The Stryker could be fitted with a Bradley turret or a Delco 25 turret and still fit inside a C-130. The Canadain Forces use LAV IIIs with the Delco 25 turret and we have been told by some of them that those vehicles do fit inside a C-130. The Army could have added a 25mm turret but it would reduce the number of troops a Stryker can carry and that would require more Strykers to carry the number of infantry men in the BCT. As for the Scouts (I to would have liked to have seen the M1127 RCV fitted with a 25mm turret) but that would add weight to the supply tail. More ammo (in this case, only used by the Scouts). More parts to repair things (in this case, again limited to only the Scout vehicles). The idea is to get an infantry brigade in the air with the least amount of lift aircarft and tied up the least amount of aircraft required to support and resupply the BCT once it is there.

Think of a Stryker BCT as light infantry unit (as in walking and must carry almost everything on their backs) that has been upgraded with trucks that have some armored protection. This is an upgrade of light infantry, not a down grade of mech infantry with lighter vehicles. The Scouts in the SBCT are light scouts who will need to use movement and concealment to do their job. They are not heavy Armored Cavarly Scouts who can fight for information or conduct an ecomany of force operation. That VC you talked with would have been conducting that convoy escort mission with a M151 or Hummer if he was still in a light infantry brigade. The BMP would have still got him if he was not watching and drove out into it's kill zone. With a light infantry scout unit, you have walking Scouts and light wheeled vehicle mounted scouts. The Stryker RCV can carry a lot of AT-4s, more troops in each vehicle, carry that very heavy Long Range Scout Surveillance System (LRAS3, the super scout scope I was talking about in my other post). When thinking about a light infantry brigade and the scouts units, Stryker is a major upgrade.

- Burik

I know the threats out there are not like the old Soviet days, but the N Koreans are pretty strong, and the Syrians, and the Iranians. Sending a Stryker Bde to be the first point of contact would be even worse than the 82nd w/ their Sheridans since the Sheridans at least could shoot back.
Bob


Sending a Stryker BCT would have been worse that the 82nd w/their Sheridans?
Hold on here David! First of all we are NOT talking about all of the 82nd Airborne Division. We are talking about ONE BCT from the 82nd. About the same number of infantry, maybe a little bit less than what a SBCT now has. Sheirdans? We are not talking about the complete battalion. We are talking about ONE tank company, divided three ways with four tanks support each battalion of dismouted infantry. Dismounted infantry that could only get out of the way of a heavy division attack by digging in and keeping their heads down or using their feet and trying to run away in an open desert. It would have been very hard for that BCT to conduct a delaying action once the troops had been dropped off. A SBCT on the other hand would have been able to load up the infantry and move them to one delaying position after another. Using AT-4s to reduce the number of attacking AFVs.

- Burik

But I have no problem w/ the Stryker's use in Iraq. I have first hand experience w/ how quiet it is, and so it is great for raids and such. Just as long as the Stryker guys are not expected to go up against enemy w/ armor or anti-armor capabilities... Plus, it's offroad capabilites are not as good as say a Bradley or M113, and it may be in a tough spot in a built up area since it can not make tight turns like a tracked vehicle. But, wheeled vehicles are not as tough to maintain. So, yes, there is no perfect vehicle. As long as it is not misused...
Bob



When it comes to military operations, one must always be ready to use what is available to do what ever must be done. Someday, possible somewhere those Stryker BCTs may end up facing a heavy armored force and those troopers had better know how to use what they have to do the best they can. Task Force Smith and the Battle of the Bulge are two possible examples where units where tasked to do things they where never designed for.

- Burik

Yes, I have lots more photos. I can share some here. I plan on doing an article or two in Military Modelling of England coinciding w/ the new Trumpeter kit coming out. I also plan on doing a photo history book on the NTC. Digital cameras are the greatest. THere is no such thing as wasted film, and LOTS of photos can be taken, as long as you have enough flash cards or flash card space. One version I did not get enough good shots of were the engineer vehicles. But, I am invited up to Ft Lewis (I live in Portland, OR) to see some more at the motorpool. I need to see some with the slat armor. I think I have a coulpe of cool shots of an FA unit during a live fire exercise taking down a small village.
Bob


Super, can not wait to see what you can share with us all.

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.


Last edited by Roy_A_Lingle on Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:06 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 4:59 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

Roy, well said. Point taken.

Cheers.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 10:04 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

It just hit me that these Strykers do not have the bar armor on them. Seems that if they are training for deployment they would try to have vehicles equiped the same way as they will use in the field. I can see the extra size affecting everything from how the vehicle drives to how you dismount and clear the vehicle.

Just seems like a big oversight to me

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 10:22 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- bsmart
It just hit me that these Strykers do not have the bar armor on them. Seems that if they are training for deployment they would try to have vehicles equiped the same way as they will use in the field. I can see the extra size affecting everything from how the vehicle drives to how you dismount and clear the vehicle.

Just seems like a big oversight to me


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

It's not an oversight. It's another case of NOT ENOUGH MONEY Evil or Very Mad . One of the lessons learned by the first two SBCTs was the drivers need some training with all that extra bar armor. The corrective plan is to buy a few sets for the state side units so all drivers can get some experence driving with the cages installed. Besides, the bird cages are an intrim Evil or Very Mad fix, the Army is working on next phase of protection.

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum