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Thurmont MD M60
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 10:47 am
Post subject: Thurmont MD M60

A while back someone asked me for more information on the M60 at the Turmont MD AMVETS. I couldn't remember which thread it was on so I decided to start a new one.

I have uplloaded some pictures to Photobucket, Let see if I can link them here
First%20an%20overview.%20This%20is%20an%20older%20picture%20but%20from%20our%20recent%20discussion%20of%20M60A3s%20I%20notice%20this%20tank%20has%20a%20complete%20set%20of%20Aluminum%20roadwheels I%20believe%20this%20is%20the%20Serial%20number.%20It%20was%20on%20the%20right%20hand%20side%20(as%20you%20are%20sitting%20in%20the%20driver%20seat)%20just%20in%20front%20of%20the%20headlight%20guard.%20Serial%20number%2012!! You%20can%20barely%20read%20the%20registration%20number%20stamped%20into%20the%20Left%20side%20opposite%20the%20Serial%20Number%20%20The%20Registration%20is%209B3096.%20%20This%20matches%20the%20old%20number%20barely%20visible%20on%20the%20side%20of%20the%20tank. This%20is%20the%20casting%20on%20the%20top%20of%20the%20turret.%20%20I%20think%20this%20is%20saying%20Turret%20#29%20with%20a%20casting%20date%20of%201-60?? Now%20a%20couple%20questions Someone%20want%20to%20tell%20me%20what%20is%20different%20about%20this%20gun%20barrel?

And can someone tell me what this is? It was mounted on the aft right side.


As a reminder this is one of those M60s with 'Training Tank Only' in welding bead on the glacias.

Thurmont MD is the town just outside Camp David for those interested.
I took some other pictures of details I may post later

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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 12:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

- bsmart

I notice this tank has a complete set of Aluminum roadwheels


It also has the older chevron type track block.

- bsmart

Now a couple questions

Someone want to tell me what is different about this gun barrel?


The top half of the travel lock is welded to the barrel.

- bsmart

And can someone tell me what this is? It was mounted on the aft right side.


If you are asking about the box with the yellow light on top, that is the Infantry phone box.

Nice photos Bob.
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 12:37 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Here is the other half of the Travel lock on the rear deck. I suspect that the gun was welded into the travel lock over the rear deck and to display it turret forward the AMVETS cut the travel lock in half!


So that is the infantry phone? I was expecting something like he box I remember on the back of an M48A1 which was mounted on the rear vertical panel. Since this appeared to be a 'sheet metal' box mounted ona braket I figured it was some kind of temporary device. I assume the light was to let the infantry troops know the tankers wanted to talk to them?

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Dontos
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 12:40 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Ah,...Bob. I think thats the wrong photo...

Thats the FT18 Turret.

Don


(oppps, never mind, you caught it... Wink )

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Last edited by Dontos on Sat Apr 29, 2006 12:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 12:41 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Fixed Smile

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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 1:02 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

- bsmart




That plate the box is mounted on is an upgrade (or MWO) based on lessons learned the hard way. The phone boxes started mounted on the fender. When the fender was damaged by hitting something, it would also mess up the phone box and cabling. By relocating the box into a bracket that is spaced above the fender, it reduced the damage to the box and it's cable when the fender hit something.

As for the barrel being welded into the travel lock. Remember Jeff posted some photos of a M-60A1 in Barstow CA that had it's barrel welded into the travel lock. When I first saw the top half out there on the tube, I was thinking could that be part of the bracket that was used by the SimFire system. Also fooled me for a second.

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 1:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

- Roy_A_Lingle


That plate the box is mounted on is an upgrade (or MWO) based on lessons learned the hard way. The phone boxes started mounted on the fender. When the fender was damaged by hitting something, it would also mess up the phone box and cabling. By relocating the box into a bracket that is spaced above the fender, it reduced the damage to the box and it's cable when the fender hit something.

As for the barrel being welded into the travel lock. Remember Jeff posted some photos of a M-60A1 in Barstow CA that had it's barrel welded into the travel lock. When I first saw the top half out there on the tube, I was thinking could that be part of the bracket that was used by the SimFire system. Also fooled me for a second.

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile


I guess when they replaced the gas engine in the M48A1 with the Diesel and that big louver system meant they had to move the box fromthat big flat rear surface the gasser had.

Yea, I put the barrel picture out there to see who was awake.

Here is another picture from today that I found interesting. The Rangefinder hood is turned downward and welded that way

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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 4:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Bob,
Thanks for the pictures, I was the one that asked for more. Interesting location for the serial number. All the M60's with the exceptions of the Mainz A-3's and CEV's had the number stamped on the left front toe eye and left rear hull that I've seen.
This%20is%20one%20of%20three%20I%20know%20of%20that%20have%20the%20\"Training%20Tank%20Only\"%20welded%20on%20it.%20The%20others%20are%20at%20the%20Intrepid%20display%20in%20New%20York%20and%20one%20was%20on%20the%20Mile%20of%20Tanks%20at%20Aberdeen%20at%20one%20time.%20I'm%20pretty%20sure%20it's%20one%20of%20the%20first%2015%20made%20with%20sub-standard%20armor%20based%20on%20the%20serial%20number. Never%20thought%20to%20look%20by%20the%20right%20head%20light.%20Now%20I'll%20start%20looking.%20 %20%20%20%20The%20phone%20box%20was%20a%20great%20thing%20to%20have.%20I%20really%20hated%20not%20having%20one%20on%20the%20M1.%20If%20you%20were%20lucky%20the%20cord%20was%20long%20enough%20for%20you%20to%20boresight%20with.%20The%20light%20on%20it%20let%20you%20know%20the%20Driver%20was%20signaling%20you.%20In%20the%20drivers%20hole%20the%20intercom%20box%20had%20an%20additional%20switch.%20If%20he%20saw%20the%20light%20flashing%20it%20would%20let%20him%20know%20some%20one%20was%20squeezing%20the%20hand%20mike%20to%20talk%20to%20the%20crew.%20He%20would%20flip%20the%20lever%20to%20EXT%20to%20allow%20the%20phone%20to%20work.%20To%20signal%20the%20out%20side%20he%20would%20rotate%20the%20lever%20to%20SIG.%20It%20was%20spring%20loaded%20in%20this%20mode.%20(Picture%20Courtesy%20Doug%20Kibbey) Once%20the%20box%20was%20activated%20the%20soldier%20outside%20could%20talk%20to%20the%20crew.%20He%20could%20also%20use%20the%20tank%20radio%20to%20transmit%20if%20he%20held%20the%20spring%20loaded%20switch%20up%20to%20RAD.%20Another%20great%20feature%20was%20you%20could%20run%20you%20commo%20wire%20to%20it%20where%20it%20says%20LINE.%20That%20way%20you%20don't%20have%20to%20run%20them%20all%20they%20into%20the%20turret%20when%20running%20a%20hot%20loop%20or%20OP%20phone.%20Hated%20that%20with%20the%20M1's.%20 Here's%20a%20picture%20of%20one%20mounted%20to%20the%20fender%20still,%20Really%20sucked%20if%20your%20track%20broke%20on%20that%20side.%20My%20friends%20quote%20when%20that%20happened%20was%20\"%20I%20knew%20something%20wasn't%20right%20when%20I%20saw%20the%20phone%20box%20fly%20by%20me.\".%20The%20newer%20bracket%20was%20a%20bigger%20pain%20though%20when%20pulling%20pack,%20so%20that's%20why%20you%20see%20some%20still%20on%20the%20fender.%20 Around%20'86-'87%20a%20message%20came%20out%20that%20phone%20boxes%20were%20no%20longer%20neccesary%20and%20would%20not%20be%20repaired.%20So%20a%20lot%20of%20tanks%20had%20them%20removed%20and%20the%20cable%20cut%20off.%20Some%20of%20the%20late%20Anniston%20rebuilds%20even%20had%20the%20opening%20welded%20over%20on%20the%20hull.

Thanks again for posting the pictures Bob,

Joe D
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 5:41 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

[quote="Joe_D"]Bob,
Thanks for the pictures, I was the one that asked for more. Interesting location for the serial number. All the M60's with the exceptions of the Mainz A-3's and CEV's had the number stamped on the left front toe eye and left rear hull that I've seen.

This is one of three I know of that have the "Training Tank Only" welded on it. The others are at the Intrepid display in New York and one was on the Mile of Tanks at Aberdeen at one time. I'm pretty sure it's one of the first 15 made with sub-standard armor based on the serial number.
Never thought to look by the right head light. Now I'll start looking.

I couldn't remember where to look. I looked at the front tow lugs and could barely make out a 2 on the front left one. There was a lot of flaking rust so there could be a 1 under there. I didn't see anything on the left hull rear but you can see the condition the surface is in so When I get back up there I'll look again.

The one at Aberdeen is now behind the museum. Do you have the serial number for that one? If not I'll try and remember to get it next time I'm up there.

What about having the Registration number stamped in the hull? Have you seen that on others?

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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 29, 2006 6:19 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Bob,
Yes, the registration number is usually found on the upper left hull front, it can also be found below the left rear deck on some tanks. It depends on the model and if it was rebuilt. M60A3's are the most maddening. They would x out the numbers and restamp them with a serial number on the rear, but registration numbers usually weren't changed for some reason on the front. I always wonder why they decided to start with new numbers for the A3 series. The hardest numbers to get are from A1's and slick 60's. Mostly because of their age, many coats of paint make them difficult to ID. M728's (CEV's) are he biggest pain since the only place I've seen them stamped was below the rear deck. If it's an old one it's always obliterated by paint. AVLB's are very easy since the data plate is exposed on the left side of the launcher mount. Interesting note, the M60A2 hulls used to make a lot of AVLB's never had their serial numbers changed. They still sport the 4400 series numbers, while an original AVLB would have a 3 digit number like the M728.
If you have any more shots I'd sure love to add them to my folder on this tank.

Joe D
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L.Delsing
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 2:18 am
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Is there more info about the ones at Aberdeen and the Inteprid museum (serial and constructionnumbers?)


And were is this nr.95 located?

Regards,
Lesley
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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 9:07 am
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

Lesley,
I only know that they were there and the pictures I've seen of them had the "TRAINING TANK ONLY" mark visible. The markings are identicle to the one in Thurmont that Bob posted. One can make the assumption that these came from the Aberdeen school house once the M60 was dropped from the Army stocks. The distance isn't to far.
Serial number .95 is located at the 1/278th National Gaurd Armory in Athens Tennessee. It's off I-75 north of Chattanooga. This was one of their tanks before they switched to M60A3's. Each Squadron kept one along with the Regiment.

Joe D

Joe D
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SFC_Jeff_Button
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:28 am
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

I'd like to know if this M60A0 had a smooth-bore barrel?

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:54 am
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

I'll try to run up there with a ladder soon and check. I won't promise anything because the barrel is elevated and the ground slopes slightly down in front of it. I ain't gonna shimmy up the barrel to check Shocked

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obob
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Thurmont MD M60

- bsmart
I'll try to run up there with a ladder soon and check. I won't promise anything because the barrel is elevated and the ground slopes slightly down in front of it. I ain't gonna shimmy up the barrel to check Shocked

If you're allowed to bring a camera and tripod, and if the camera has either a remote or timed shutter setting ... well, I've obtained a few decent high-angle shots by holding the whole kit up in the air. You can get photos that way of a lot of things you can't actually get eyeballs on.

Having an image-stabilized camera like my Olympus probably helps a lot, though. A large capacity memory card and the willingness to take a LOT of bad shots helps too.
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