±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: nbrich1
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6596

People Online:
Members: 1
Visitors: 114
Total: 115
Who Is Where:
 Members:
01: silviop15 > Community Forums
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Photo Gallery
06: Community Forums
07: Home
08: Photo Gallery
09: Community Forums
10: Com-Central Videos
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Photo Gallery
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Photo Gallery
27: Community Forums
28: Photo Gallery
29: CPGlang
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Photo Gallery
33: Community Forums
34: Photo Gallery
35: Community Forums
36: Photo Gallery
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Photo Gallery
40: Home
41: Community Forums
42: Home
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: Photo Gallery
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Photo Gallery
52: Community Forums
53: Photo Gallery
54: Community Forums
55: Photo Gallery
56: Community Forums
57: Photo Gallery
58: Community Forums
59: Photo Gallery
60: Community Forums
61: Search and Rescue
62: News
63: News
64: Community Forums
65: Home
66: Photo Gallery
67: Downloads
68: Photo Gallery
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Community Forums
72: Photo Gallery
73: News
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Home
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Home
88: Photo Gallery
89: Community Forums
90: Photo Gallery
91: Community Forums
92: Photo Gallery
93: Community Forums
94: Photo Gallery
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Downloads
99: Photo Gallery
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Photo Gallery
103: Home
104: Home
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Photo Gallery
109: Photo Gallery
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Photo Gallery
114: Photo Gallery

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Dirk
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 115
Location: South Africa
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 7:10 am
Post subject: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

Used Adobe Photoshop to grab following two frames from a vid clip I downloaded.

Image 1

What%20120mm%20ammo%20is%20being%20loaded%20? Image%202 (Had%20to%20flip%20this%20image%20!%20)

What ammo is loaded in the ready racks ? Note lettering on base of 120mm shell.

Thanks - Great forum

Dirk
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 2516
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 7:42 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

That looks like HEAT being loaded since it is blue I figure it is an inert training round. Should they be handling it like that? (by the standoff probe). The ready round is 'Target Practice, Tracer'

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])


Last edited by bsmart on Tue May 23, 2006 7:49 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 4632
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 7:46 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

Is that HEAT round being loaded blue? (I have weird color vision)...if so, it may be a TP-T round (a training round, as Bob correctly notes) in HEAT configuration.
How standardized are the colors, internationally, for various types of rounds?
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 2516
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 7:52 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

I just edited my answer to add my thought about the blue color. I think at least within NATO the colors are pretty much standardized ( I know in the Air Forces they were) and Blue was pretty standard for 'INERT'. Looking at the base of the ready round it looks like their stock came from the same source as NATO stuff (Not surprising actually)

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 8:59 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

Looks like standard training (target practice) HEAT ammo to me. The lettering is standard, and the M-number indicates type standardized ammo used by the US and by extension NATO. Too bad we can't see the rest of that base cap in the second picture..."Made In...?"

The blue is standard for training ammo of all types, indicating inert fillers or non-explosive projectiles. 105mm HEAT training ammo was always marked at TP-T. Sabot training ammo was always marked TPDS-T...when I was around it.

The "-T" is actually kind of funny, because I've never seen or heard of any modern tank ammo that didn't have a tracer in it! Then again, standard markings are standard...and changing ANY NATO standard, even for paper size, is a major undertaking.

C

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 4632
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 9:16 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

- C_Sherman

The "-T" is actually kind of funny, because I've never seen or heard of any modern tank ammo that didn't have a tracer in it! Then again, standard markings are standard...and changing ANY NATO standard, even for paper size, is a major undertaking.

C


Canister. Sorry Chuck, just had to say it.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Dirk
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 115
Location: South Africa
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 9:39 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

- C_Sherman
Too bad we can't see the rest of that base cap in the second picture..."Made In...?"


Not able to grab the frame where one could see this 'Made In.....'. , the loader or gunner (?) is in the way Neutral
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 2516
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 9:50 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

I wouldn't be surprised if there was a way to look up the 'OR104F158H002' and get the plant name, batch number, date it was produced and maybe even the QA person's name! The information is out there somewhere.

It may even have been on that Disk with my SSN and date of birth that got stolen from the VA employee!

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 11:01 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

Both are training HEAT.

As for handling, thats pretty much standard.

Although its prefered to cradle the round with hands around the base of the projectile and covering the 'aft cap' primer.

Don
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Sabot
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 380
Location: Kentucky
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 12:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

Quick google search of the M831A1 shows that they are made in the good old USA (page 6, third paragraph down): www.dtic.mil/techtrans...ndices.pdf

Handling is standard. The size and weight of the 120mm make handling by the aft cap primer too uncumbersome.

Even though the training HEAT round is just a big chunk of aluminum, it is still a very potent projectile travelling at Mach 3.

_________________
RobG
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 12:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

I'm reminded of an old old poster for one of those embarrassing Rambo movie. There's musclebound scowling Johhny Rambo with an M60 mg in his hands and double ammo bandoliers across his chest like a later-day Pancho Villa. Looks very mean and dangerous, until you notice the little blue-painted tips on the belted rounds. Blue? Training? BUSTED!
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 2516
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 1:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

- Sabot
Quick google search of the M831A1 shows that they are made in the good old USA (page 6, third paragraph down): www.dtic.mil/techtrans...ndices.pdf

Handling is standard. The size and weight of the 120mm make handling by the aft cap primer too uncumbersome.

Even though the training HEAT round is just a big chunk of aluminum, it is still a very potent projectile travelling at Mach 3.


I thought that lifting it by the standoff rod might be frowned upon. I figured that the training round would be sturdy enough 'to get away with it' but that a live round might not be as strong at that point and it would be a bad habit to get into.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 04, 2005
Posts: 6249
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 1:28 pm
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

- mike_Duplessis
I'm reminded of an old old poster for one of those embarrassing Rambo movie. There's musclebound scowling Johhny Rambo with an M60 mg in his hands and double ammo bandoliers across his chest like a later-day Pancho Villa. Looks very mean and dangerous, until you notice the little blue-painted tips on the belted rounds. Blue? Training? BUSTED!


Normally, uttering the "G" word is enough to put you over the edge, but when you invoke the "R" word, well....that's totally beyond the pale. Only the qualifier "embarrassing" immediately before it is probably what's saving you from the wrath of the Com-Central Secret Tribunal. Still, your vivid, sweaty imagry is in the poorest of taste and I'll ask you not to insult our (or others') servicemen past, present, and future with even taunting references to he-who-shall-not-be-named....or I shall be forced to report you to the authorities....

Some of us may be merely flight simmers here, but we have our standards to uphold. They're low, but they're there.

Thank you in advance for your cooperation...

Wink

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Sabot
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 380
Location: Kentucky
PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 2:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

- bsmart
I thought that lifting it by the standoff rod might be frowned upon. I figured that the training round would be sturdy enough 'to get away with it' but that a live round might not be as strong at that point and it would be a bad habit to get into.
I saw a service HEAT round fall off of the sponson box of an M60A3 and smack the concrete motor pool surface with nothing but a slight dent on the windscreen (little aluminum hat on the rod). I did dive for cover when I saw it fall though.

_________________
RobG
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 9:13 am
Post subject: Re: Questions on Finnish Leo 2 Ammo

- Sabot
- bsmart
I thought that lifting it by the standoff rod might be frowned upon. I figured that the training round would be sturdy enough 'to get away with it' but that a live round might not be as strong at that point and it would be a bad habit to get into.
I saw a service HEAT round fall off of the sponson box of an M60A3 and smack the concrete motor pool surface with nothing but a slight dent on the windscreen (little aluminum hat on the rod). I did dive for cover when I saw it fall though.


As a loader on an IPM1, we used to 'bounce' the rounds on the loaders skate ring during monthly ammo inventory download, in Germany.

I had two service HEAT rounds that if you attempted to lift them by the 'rod' the projectile would slide out of the casing!! Shocked ( I actually did that once!! Shocked )

When we transitioned to M1A1's the ammo inspector (from USAREUR) was amazed at the terrible condition of the service ammo. It turns out that the 105mm ammo we had, had been on the M60A3's prior to getting the IPM1's years before.

Handling ammo became a whole different 'animal' with the 120mm. Several 'split rounds' convinced the 'power that be' to keep our service ammo in the bunkers, crated up. Instead of being uploaded on the tanks.

'Memories.....'
Don

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum