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Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 6:33 am
Post subject: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

140 M1A1 Abrams, 392 LAVs for the Iraqi Army...

Neil

Iraq - M1A1 and Upgrade to M1A1M Abrams Tanks

US Defense Security Cooperation Agency: dated July 31, web-posted Aug. 1, 2008

WASHINGTON --- The Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Iraq of M1A1 and Upgrade to M1A1M Abrams Tanks as well as associated equipment and services.

The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $2.16 billion.

The Government of Iraq has requested a possible sale of:
--140 M1A1 Abrams tanks modified and upgraded to the M1A1M Abrams configuration,
--8 M88A2 Tank Recovery Vehicles,
--64 M1151A1B1 Armored High Mobility Multi-Purpose Wheeled Vehicles (HMMWV),
--92 M1152 Shelter Carriers,
--12 M577A2 Command Post Carriers,
--16 M548A1 Tracked Logistics Vehicles,
--8 M113A2 Armored Ambulances, and
--420 AN/VRC-92 Vehicular Receiver Transmitters.

Also included are:
--35 M1070 Heavy Equipment Transporter (HET) Truck Tractors,
--40 M978A2 Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck (HEMTT) Tankers
--36 M985A2 HEMTT Cargo Trucks,
--4 M984A2 HEMTT Wrecker Trucks,
--140 M1085A1 5-ton Cargo Trucks,
--8 HMMWV Ambulances w/ Shelter,
--8 Contact Maintenance Trucks,
--32 500 gal Water Tank Trailers, 16 2500 gal Water Tank Trucks, 16 Motorcycles, 80 8 ton Heavy/Medium Trailers, 16 Sedans, 92 M1102 Light Tactical trailers, 92 635NL Semi-Trailers, 4 5,500 lb Rough Terrain Forklifts,
--20 M1A1 engines,
--20 M1A1 Full Up Power Packs,
--3 spare M88A2 engines, 10 M1070 engines, 20 HEMTT engines, 4 M577A2 spare engines, 2 5-ton truck engines, 20 spare HMMWV engines, ammunition, spare and repair parts, maintenance, support equipment, publications and documentation, personnel training and equipment, U.S. Government and contractor engineering and logistics support services, and other related elements of logistics support. The estimated cost is $2.16 billion.

This proposed sale will contribute to the foreign policy and national security of the United States by helping to improve the security of a friendly country. This proposed sale directly supports the Government of Iraq and serves the interests of the people of Iraq and of the U.S.

This proposed sale would advance Iraq’s effort to develop a strong, well-equipped, trained, and dedicated military force, to establish security and stability throughout Iraq, and to promote the stability and development of a friendly, democratic central government.

The proposed sale and upgrade will allow Iraq to operate and exercise a more lethal and survivable M1A1M tank for the protection of critical infrastructure. Iraq will have no difficulty absorbing these tanks into its armed forces.

The proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter the basic military balance in the region.

The prime contractors will be General Dynamics Land Systems Division of Sterling Heights, Michigan; Honeywell International, and General Motors Allison Transmission Division of Detroit, Michigan. There are no known offset agreements proposed in connection with this potential sale.

Implementation of this proposed sale will require the assignment of approximately 8 U.S. Government and 35 contractor representatives to Iraq for up to four years.

There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.

This notice of a potential sale is required by law; it does not mean that the sale has been concluded.

EDITOR’S NOTE: In addition to the M1 tanks mentioned above, since July 25 the Pentagon had notified Congress of the possible FMS sale to Iraq of 24 armed helicopters and related weapons ($2.4 billion), 392 Light Armored Vehicles ($3 billion), technical assistance for infrastructure construction ($1.6 billion), an unspecified number of “armored security vehicles� ($206 million) and six C-130J-30 transport aircraft ($1.5 billion), for a total value of over $11 billion)


Last edited by Neil_Baumgardner on Fri Dec 12, 2008 10:14 am; edited 1 time in total
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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 7:01 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, LAVs for Iraqi Army

More on this:

www.defenseindustrydai...Iraq-05013

M1 Abrams Tanks for Iraq
04-Aug-2008 19:09 EDT

Related Stories: Americas - USA, BAE, Contracts - Intent, Force Structure, General Dynamics, Middle East - Other, Other Corporation, Signals Radio & Wireless, Tanks & Mechanized, Trucks & Transport

Advertisement
US M1A1s, Tal Afar
(click to view full)On July 31/08, the US Defense Security Cooperation Agency announced [PDF] Iraq’s formal request to buy M1 Abrams tanks, well as the associated vehicles, equipment and services required to keep these tanks in the field. It is likely that the tanks themselves will be transferred from US stocks, but this has not been verified. With this purchase, Iraq will become the 4th M1 Abrams operator in the region, joining Egypt (M1A1s), Kuwait, and Saudi Arabia (M1A2-SEP variant).

Defense-related order requests from Iraq over the last 2 weeks now total over $10.9 billion, and include tanks, wheeled LAV APCs ($3.0b), wheeled M1117 armored cars ($0.26b), armed reconnaissance helicopters ($2.4b), C-130J transport aircraft ($1.5b), and major infrastructure build-outs ($1.6b). Once a DSCA request is made, the rule is that Congress has 30 days to pass a blockage of the sale, or contracts may be negotiated and the sale can go through.

This particular Iraqi request could be worth up to $2.16 billion, and includes…

140 M1A1 Abrams tanks, modified and upgraded to the M1A1M configuration
20 M1A1 engines
20 M1A1 Full Up Power Packs
8 of BAE’s tracked M88A2 HERCULES (Heavy Equipment Recovery Combat Utility Lift and Evacuation System) Armored Recovery Vehicles, with the pulling power to tow or winch even a 70-ton M1 out of trouble.
3 spare M88A2 engines
16 M548A1 tracked logistics vehicles, based on the M113 armored personnel carrier
8 M113A2 tracked armored ambulances
4 M577A2 spare engines
64 M1151A1B1 armored Hummers
92 M1152 Hummer Shelter carriers
12 M577A2 hummer Command Post Carriers
8 HMMWV Ambulances w/ Shelter
20 spare HMMWV engines
35 M1070 Heavy Equipment Transporter (HET) Truck Tractors, which can truck tanks on their flatbeds to minimize tank and road wear when the tans need to move to new locations.
10 spare M1070 engines
40 M978A2 Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck (HEMTT) Tankers, which provide fuel for the M1’s gas-guzzling turbine engine
36 M985A2 HEMTT Cargo Trucks
4 M984A2 HEMTT Wrecker Trucks
20 spare HEMTT engines
16 2500 gal Water Tank Trucks
8 Contact Maintenance Trucks
140 M1085A1 5-ton Cargo Trucks
2 spare 5-ton truck engines
92 635NL Semi-Trailers
80 8-ton Heavy/Medium Trailers
32 500 gal Water Tank Trailers
92 M1102 Light Tactical trailers
16 Motorcycles
16 Sedans
4 5,500 lb Rough Terrain Forklifts
420 AN/VRC-92 Vehicular Receiver Transmitters
Plus ammunition, spare and repair parts, maintenance, support equipment, publications and documentation, personnel training and equipment, U.S. Government and contractor engineering and logistics support services, and other related elements of logistics support. The estimated cost is $2.16 billion.
Implementation of this proposed sale will require the assignment of approximately 8 U.S. Government and 35 contractor representatives to Iraq for up to 4 years. The prime contractors will be:

General Dynamics Land Systems Division of Sterling Heights, MI (M1 tanks)
Honeywell International (M1 engines)
General Motors Allison Transmission Division of Detroit, MI.
Abrams for Iraq: Employment and Implications


T-55 ‘Fixer-Upper’
...fire sale price!
(click to view full)The DSCA adds that:

“The proposed sale and upgrade will allow Iraq to operate and exercise a more lethal and survivable M1A1M tank for the protection of critical infrastructure. Iraq will have no difficulty absorbing these tanks into its armed forces.�

While details of the M1A1M have yet to be released, it is likely to use the M1A1-SA variant as a base. Developed for use in Iraq, the M1A1-SA configuration adds a number of enhancements for use in cities and other built-up areas, but doesn’t include the remotely-operated machine gun, reactive armor from General Dynamics and Israel’s RAFAEL, et. al. that are found in full M1 TUSK (Tank Urban Survival Kit) variants.

Other Arab armies in the region, whose recommendations reportedly influenced Iraq’s choice, operate either M1A1s (Egypt) or advanced M1A2-SEP variants (Kuwait, Saudi Arabia).

The DSCA also says, as it almost always does, that the “proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter the basic military balance in the region.� That is true from one point of view, if one factors in the American presence in Iraq. If the Americans are removed from the equation, however, this purchase crosses a rubicon.

Past Iraqi defense purchases, including its recent LAV/M1117 and helicopter buys, have all been focused on building forces whose primary focus was on enforcing internal law and order. LAVs can certainly be used in an offensive context, or the US Marines could not depend on them as they do. On the other hand, there are a number of opponents and situations that a USMC commander will not confront with LAVs.


USMC M1A1 settles a
firefight in Fallujah
(click to view full)American M1 tanks have proven effective in counterinsurgency fights, where their outstanding defenses and the precision fire of their 120mm cannon offer a vital hammer against enemy strongpoints.

What’s new, and different, is that they would also give Iraq a capability it has lacked – the ability to enforce its territorial integrity against incursions from its neighbors.

Iraq’s 9th Division in Taji has done an excellent job with its refurbished T-72 tanks, aged T-55s, BMP-1 tracked APCs, and MT-LB wheeled APCs. Nevertheless, its equipment provided no significant edge over neighboring states, and is not fielded in sufficient numbers to provide real deterrence. 140 Abrams tanks and 392 LAVs would equip only 2-4 mechanized brigades, or about 1/2 to 1 division. That certainly isn’t an invasion force for anything. In a defensive role, however, they would present very formidable mobile opposition against even numerically superior foes. That is exactly what they were designed to do for the USMC in Norway and other areas on Europe’s Cold War front lines, after all. In addition, the Abrams’ battlefield performance against enemy T-72s and other Russian stock would have to give neighbors like Iran and Syria pause, if a North Vietnam-style armored invasion were ever contemplated.

The new tanks may even have some deterrence value vis-a-vis Turkey, which has engaged in sporadic incursions into northern Iraq targeting the Marxist Kurdish terrorists of the PKK. Those incursions have had Iraq’s tacit acceptance, however, so long as they do not go too far. Turkey has an democratically accountable government, just as Iraq does, and the 2 countries have a number of interlocking economic and political interests than cannot be dismissed lightly no mater what sentiments rule the day.

Turkey remains Iraq’s main gateway for its rich northern oil fields, and that transit revenue is important to Turkey as well. The Kurdish provinces’ booming economies since 2004 also have other desirable spinoff effects. Nevertheless, Turkey has shown that it will act regardless if it is pushed by the PKK. Iraq, in turn, knows that Turkey’s coordinated armor and air force power is something it cannot defeat. Nor does Iraq’s government have much sympathy for terrorists of any ilk, though its own ability to act against the PKK is tied by the threat of civil war within Iraq. Hence Iraq’s approach of warnings and protests to Turkey, coupled with tacit acceptance. The Kurdish PUK, which is the PKK’s main rival in the Kurdish provinces and plays a significant balancing role within the Iraqi government, has also remained tacitly neutral – so far.

Turkey, in turn, knows that escalating too far risks the prospect of confrontation that spills well beyond Iraq into Turkey’s own Kurdish minorities. Their nightmare scenario would involve united opposition and funding from the Kurdish PUK and PKK parties, Iraq, and possible Arab allies – many of whom attained statehood by throwing off Turkish control. A corollary public campaign in Europe, where the Kurdish cause has been popular in the past, risks even further damage to the Turks.

These balancing ties and risks, plus the potential fallout in the USA from a serious clash, can be expected to be far more effective than 140 Abrams tanks in deterring any larger conflict along Iraq’s northern border.
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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 7:23 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, LAVs for Iraqi Army

It's started,

What better way to find a purpose for all those M1's we don't use anymore. All you former M1 mechanics, instructors, and master gunner's, looks like a job opportunity is awaiting. I'm sure it would add more points on the application if the person had trained ISF before, like for instance, MiTT, BiTT or NPTT transition experience Wink .

Joe D
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 7:51 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, LAVs for Iraqi Army

You looking to become an expatriot instructor?

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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:43 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, LAVs for Iraqi Army

Don't know what I'll do in the future,

Right now I am taking a minimum of 1 year off from all employment. This is what I owe my Wife, maybe more. By that time, if this happens, and I'm up to it, I might consider it. Over the last 10 years I watched friends of mine get out and work in Saudi, Kuwait, Egypt and other interesting places doing this kind of work. Pay is very, very good with the right qualifications. But money isn't everything.

Besides, that would interfere with my "M60 photo tour" of the lower 48 Wink .

Joe D
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SFC_Jeff_Button
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:38 pm
Post subject: Re: Abrams, LAVs for Iraqi Army

Joe,
When you get down Ft Hood way, look me up and I'll run you around the the M60's around the post that are not directly at the museums.

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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 9:56 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, LAVs for Iraqi Army

The Pentagon yesterday updated the plans to sell 140 M1A1M Abrams and _now_ 400 Stryker ICVs and 400 ASVs to Iraq - this apparently replaces the earlier deal of 400 Abrams and 392 LAVs...

Iraq – M1A1 and Upgrade to M1A1M Abrams Tanks

US Defense Security Cooperation Agency: Dec. 11, 2008)

WASHINGTON --- On Dec. 9, the Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Iraq of 140 M1A1 Abrams tanks modified and upgraded to the M1A1M Abrams configuration, 8 M88A2 Tank Recovery Vehicles, 64 M1151A1B1 Armored High Mobility Multi-Purpose Wheeled Vehicles (HMMWV), 92 M1152 Shelter Carriers, 12 M577A2 Command Post Carriers, 16 M548A1 Tracked Logistics Vehicles, 8 M113A2 Armored Ambulances, and 420 AN/VRC-92 Vehicular Receiver Transmitters as well as associated equipment and services.

The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $2.160 billion.

The Government of Iraq has requested a possible sale of 140 M1A1 Abrams tanks modified and upgraded to the M1A1M Abrams configuration, 8 M88A2 Tank Recovery Vehicles, 64 M1151A1B1 Armored High Mobility Multi-Purpose Wheeled Vehicles (HMMWV), 92 M1152 Shelter Carriers, 12 M577A2 Command Post Carriers, 16 M548A1 Tracked Logistics Vehicles, 8 M113A2 Armored Ambulances, and 420 AN/VRC-92 Vehicular Receiver Transmitters.

Also included are:
-- 35 M1070 Heavy Equipment Transporter (HET) Truck Tractors,
-- 40 M978A2 Heavy Expanded Mobility Tactical Truck (HEMTT) Tankers
-- 36 M985A2 HEMTT Cargo Trucks,
-- 4 M984A2 HEMTT Wrecker Trucks,
-- 140 M1085A1 5-ton Cargo Trucks,
-- 8 HMMWV Ambulances w/ Shelter,
-- 8 Contact Maintenance Trucks,
-- 32 500 gal Water Tank Trailers,
-- 16 2500 gal Water Tank Trucks,
-- 16 Motorcycles,
-- 80 8-ton Heavy/Medium Trailers,
-- 16 Sedans,
-- 92 M1102 Light Tactical trailers,
-- 35 635NL Semi-Trailers,
-- 4 5,500 lb Rough Terrain Forklifts,
-- 20 M1A1 engines,
-- 20 M1A1 Full Up Power Packs,
-- 3 spare M88A2 engines,
-- 10 M1070 engines, 20 HEMTT engines,
-- 4 M577A2 spare engines,
-- 20 5-ton truck engines,
-- 20 spare HMMWV engines,
-- ammunition, spare and repair parts, maintenance, support equipment, publications and documentation, personnel training and equipment, U.S. Government and contractor engineering and logistics support services, and other related elements of logistics support.

The estimated cost is $2.160 billion.

This proposed sale will contribute to the foreign policy and national security of the United States by helping to improve the security of a friendly country. This proposed sale directly supports the Government of Iraq and serves the interests of the people of Iraq and of the U.S.

This proposed sale would advance Iraq’s effort to develop a strong, well-equipped, trained, and dedicated military force, to establish security and stability throughout Iraq, and to promote the stability and development of a friendly, democratic central government.

The proposed sale and upgrade will allow Iraq to operate and exercise a more lethal and survivable M1A1M tank for the protection of critical infrastructure. Iraq will have no difficulty absorbing these tanks, including the support vehicles, into its armed forces.

The proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter the basic military balance in the region.

The prime contractors will be General Dynamics Land Systems Division of Sterling Heights, Michigan; Honeywell International, and General Motors Allison Transmission Division of Detroit, Michigan. There are no known offset agreements proposed in connection with this potential sale.

Implementation of this proposed sale will require the assignment of approximately 8 U.S. Government and 35 contractor representatives to Iraq for up to four years.

There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.

This notice of a potential sale is required by law; it does not mean that the sale has been concluded.

Iraq – Light Armored Vehicles

US Defense Security Cooperation Agency: Dec. 11, 2008

WASHINGTON --- On Dec. 9, the Defense Security Cooperation Agency notified Congress of a possible Foreign Military Sale to Iraq of 400 M1126 STRYKER Infantry Carrier Vehicles as well as associated equipment.

The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $1.11 billion.

The Government of Iraq has requested a possible sale of 400 M1126 STRYKER Infantry Carrier Vehicles (ICVs), 400 M2 HB 50 cal Browning Machine Guns, 400 M1117 Armored Security Vehicles (ASVs), 8 Heavy Duty Recovery Trucks, spare and repair parts, support equipment, publications and technical data, personnel training and training equipment, contractor engineering and technical support services, and other related elements of logistics support. The estimated cost is $1.11 billion.

This proposed sale will contribute to the foreign policy and national security of the United States by helping to improve the security of a friendly country. This proposed sale directly supports the Iraq government and serves the interests of the Iraqi people and the U.S.

The proposed sale of the Stryker ICVs, along with the munitions and support vehicles, will be used to develop a viable police force which will ensure that the Iraq Army can sustain themselves in their efforts to bring stability to Iraq and to prevent overflow of unrest into neighboring countries.

The proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter the basic military balance in the region.

The principal contractor is General Dynamics Land Systems Defense Group in Sterling Heights, Michigan. There are no known offset agreements proposed in connection with this potential sale.

With the volume and wide range of items and equipment in this proposed sale, levels of U.S. Government and Contractor technical assistance will be required but cannot be fully defined at this time. The use of existing, deployed U.S. military personnel will be maximized.

There will be no adverse impact on U.S. defense readiness as a result of this proposed sale.

This notice of a potential sale is required by law; it does not mean that the sale has been concluded

More on this from Defense Industry Daily
www.defenseindustrydai...#more-5009

Iraq: Looking for LAVs in All the Right Places
11-Dec-2008 16:13 EST

In July 2008, Iraq submitted a slew of official requests to buy over $10 billion worth of American defense equipment, in order to equip its forces with tanks, armored cars, weapons, and even key infrastructure. In December 2008, additional requests reached the formal notification stage, while some of their July 2008 requests have been clarified or modified.

The volume of these announcements, and their content, strongly suggests an Iraqi military that is making significant strides in organization and responsibilities, and is beginning to order the equipment to match. Gen. David Petraeus’ December 2008 presentation in Washington [Transcript | Slideshow] regarding the less recognized aspects of “the surge,” and the current situation in Iraq, would appear to back that up. Time will tell.

One of the requests that was modified by the December announcements was Iraq’s request for LAVs, similar to the amphibious vehicles used by the US Marine Corps…

Dec 10/08: The US DSCA announces [PDF] Iraq’s formal request for 400 Stryker (modified LAV-III) vehicles, as part of a larger order. The total value, if all options are exercised, could be as high as $1.11 billion.

The new request includes: 400 M1126 Stryker Infantry Carrier Vehicles (ICVs), which replace the array of LAVs Iraq had been seeking. An accompanying request for 400 M2HB .50 cal Heavy Machine Guns would equip the Stryker ICVs with their standard defensive weapon, which is usually mounted in one of Kongsberg M151 Protector remote-controlled weapon turrets. Note that an order for those turrets would not require a US DSCA announcement, if it is placed with the Norwegian firm for manufacture in Norway.

This request also includes 400 M1117 Armored Security Vehicles (up from 160 in July 2008), and 8 Heavy Duty Recovery Trucks, in addition to spare and repair parts, support equipment, publications and technical data, personnel training and training equipment, contractor engineering and technical support services, and other related elements of logistics support.

General Dynamics Land Systems representatives have confirmed to DID that the previously-requested LAV-25s and associated specialty variants are no longer an item of interest for Iraq. While this might seem to be a straightforward swap of LAV-III Strykers for LAV-25s etc., the destination is different. The LAV-25s and other vehicles were intended to equip Iraqi Army armored reconnaissance – but this order is specifically for Iraq’s National Police, as it seeks to expand its number of mechanized brigades:

“The proposed sale of the Stryker ICVs, along with the munitions and support vehicles, will be used to develop a viable police force….”

If true, DJ Elliott of The Long War Journal points out that the Iraqi National Police already have 4 mechanized battalions, and 800 vehicles would equip 20 more. At 4 battalions per brigade, and 3 brigades per division, that’s 2 mechanized divisions of INP.
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MarkHolloway
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 10:26 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

Can't help but think that some day this could be used against us. Crying or Very sad

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JeffStringer
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 10:38 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

- MarkHolloway
Can't help but think that some day this could be used against us. Crying or Very sad


I was thinking the same dang thing. Rolling Eyes
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 11:20 am
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

- JeffStringer
- MarkHolloway
Can't help but think that some day this could be used against us. Crying or Very sad


I was thinking the same dang thing. Rolling Eyes


.....Do you really think those 'export' tanks are equal ??

I truely doubt it. (just in case,..... Cool )


Don
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JeffStringer
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

- Dontos
- JeffStringer
- MarkHolloway
Can't help but think that some day this could be used against us. Crying or Very sad


I was thinking the same dang thing. Rolling Eyes


.....Do you really think those 'export' tanks are equal ??

I truely doubt it. (just in case,..... Cool )



Nope, but they won't know that. Mr. Green
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Maple_Leaf_Eh
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 5:37 pm
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

"8 of BAE's tracked M88A2 HERCULES (Heavy Equipment Recovery Combat Utility Lift and Evacuation System)"

Why does every name have to be a cheesy acronym? The name 'Hercules' is clear enough for me to get the idea it is big and strong.
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MarkHolloway
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 7:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

- Maple_Leaf_Eh
"8 of BAE's tracked M88A2 HERCULES (Heavy Equipment Recovery Combat Utility Lift and Evacuation System)"

Why does every name have to be a cheesy acronym? The name 'Hercules' is clear enough for me to get the idea it is big and strong.


You're right. I noticed an M548 "Logistics Vehicle". Guess that's better than a cargo carrier.

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Dontos
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 7:27 pm
Post subject: Re: Abrams, _now_ Strykers for Iraqi Army

- Maple_Leaf_Eh
"8 of BAE's tracked M88A2 HERCULES (Heavy Equipment Recovery Combat Utility Lift and Evacuation System)"

Why does every name have to be a cheesy acronym? The name 'Hercules' is clear enough for me to get the idea it is big and strong.


You know, ....

I never knew the name 'Hercules' was an acronym. I always figured Hercules was a good nickname since it addresses that the vehicle is so powerful. It seemed fitting.

Regards
Don
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