±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: JerryH
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6595

People Online:
Members: 1
Visitors: 288
Total: 289
Who Is Where:
 Members:
01: RCAF_Wingnut > News
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Home
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Home
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: News Archive
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Photo Gallery
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Photo Gallery
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Photo Gallery
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: Community Forums
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Photo Gallery
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Community Forums
63: Photo Gallery
64: Photo Gallery
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Photo Gallery
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Downloads
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Photo Gallery
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Home
110: Community Forums
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Statistics
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Photo Gallery
117: Home
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Photo Gallery
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Photo Gallery
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Community Forums
163: Community Forums
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Photo Gallery
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Home
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Photo Gallery
181: Home
182: Community Forums
183: Community Forums
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Photo Gallery
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Home
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Community Forums
211: Community Forums
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Community Forums
217: Community Forums
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Photo Gallery
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: Downloads
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Community Forums
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Community Forums
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: News
259: Community Forums
260: Community Forums
261: Photo Gallery
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Community Forums
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Photo Gallery
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Surviving Panzers website
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 8, 9, 10 ... 52, 53, 54  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Michel_Krauss
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 30, 2009
Posts: 953
Location: Zuid-Holland, The Netherlands
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 2:35 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)


Array:
I also found an 4-digit number on the left front tow hook of the M48A5
Is this correct, or should there be some more digits?

If you mean left front as if you are seated in the drivers position, yes that should be it.


that is the one

Would you like to have it?

Michel

_________________
I'm Not Crazy, I'm Just Not You
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: 2024
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Yes,

I can add it to my data base, thanks.

_________________
Joe D
*****************
My M60 Gallery
*****************
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Michel_Krauss
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 30, 2009
Posts: 953
Location: Zuid-Holland, The Netherlands
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Hi Joe,

serial number is 2128



This M48A5 has been "converted" to instruction model
Meaning that big pieces of turret and hull armour have been cut away to give an view of the inside

It was already like that when the vehicle it was bought

Because it is quite difficult to export military armed and armored vehicle from the US to Europe (US laws) this tank most likely belonged to an European country

Michel

_________________
I'm Not Crazy, I'm Just Not You
Back to top
View user's profile
L.Delsing
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 09, 2006
Posts: 941

PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 1:11 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Thanks Michel!
Back to top
View user's profile
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 3941
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 8:05 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

- Joe_D
I also found an 4-digit number on the left front tow hook of the M48A5
Is this correct, or should there be some more digits?


If you mean left front as if you are seated in the drivers position, yes that should be it. Sometimes they will end with a "C" when stamped on the back deck and hull, but not always.


But Joe, dont normally A5s have an SN that starts with an A followed by a 4-digit number?

M48A5 SNs I have so far:

SN A3008 Armed Forces Retirement Home – Washington, DC
SN A3055 DAV Chapter 76, Hanceville, AL
SN A3177 American Armored Foundation (AAF) Tank Museum, Danville, VA
SN A3473 Museum Storage Lot, Fort Campbell, KY
SN A10617 War Memorial Park, Linton, ND
SN A10848 VFW Post 7377, Cresson, PA (Unconfirmed)
SN A10927 Richardson Motor Pool Patton Museum Annex, Fort Knox, KY

SN A1B072 (AVLB) 58th Engineer Battalion HQ, Fort Irwin, CA

But I also have the following for M48A5s:

SN 2872 Veterans' Memorial Park, Ooltewah, TN
SN 3016 American Legion Post 162, Luzerne, MI (Unconfirmed)
SN 4494 (M48A5E1 Patton) Richardson Motor Pool Patton Museum Annex, Fort Knox, KY
SN 5934 (M48A5 hull with M60A2 turret) VFW Post 1181, Valley Station, KY
SN 10960 Arcadia Memorial Park, Arcadia, WI

Similar to M60A3s, do the SNs without an A signify "new build" (as opposed to upgraded) A5s?

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: 2024
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 12:10 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

IAW the TM all the SN's for M48A5's start with an "A".

New numbers assigned when converted from A1's and A3's. That number doesn't look right either. Normally they are stamped top to bottom of the lug, not across or that high. I'm wondering if this one started off as an A2 with the German Army and was converted to A5 standards by them. A good indicator would be the front hull mount for the compensating idlers. If she didn't have the adapter mount welded on when upgraded to A5 then she started life as an A2 and most likely was from Germany. Got to see more pictures of her to tell.

_________________
Joe D
*****************
My M60 Gallery
*****************
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Michel_Krauss
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 30, 2009
Posts: 953
Location: Zuid-Holland, The Netherlands
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:13 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Got to see more pictures of her to tell


I can help out with that part

Will upload some picture's of the tank

Concerning the version of the M48, I don't know if this is correct

Some of the forum experts told me that it was an M48A5 version,
because of some thingy some where.... Confused

That was before the "BIG BLACK-OUT"

I was not even sure if it was an M48...

Michel

_________________
I'm Not Crazy, I'm Just Not You
Back to top
View user's profile
Michel_Krauss
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 30, 2009
Posts: 953
Location: Zuid-Holland, The Netherlands
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:08 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Hi folks,

got some picture's to show of the M48
If you have figured it out, let me know

There are no plates on the tank, so I can not tell you what is the country of origin



Michel

_________________
I'm Not Crazy, I'm Just Not You
Back to top
View user's profile
JimWeb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 1434
Location: The back of beyond
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 7:08 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Its an M48A5T2... ex-turkish army.

_________________
TTFN
Jim

If your not a member of JED then your
not serious about anything military..

***********************
www.jedsite.info
JED Military Equipment
***********************
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: 2024
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 1:20 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Yep,

M48A2 converted from US supplied kits. Although to be 100% sure she was an A2, you need to see the idler mounting lug on the hull. She still could be an A1 convert where they removed the 2nd and 4th support roller (can't tell from the picture).

M48 and M48A1 idler mount (This is from an A1)
M48A2,%20notice%20how%20much%20further%20the%20mount%20extends%20from%20the%20hull%20and%20the%20off%20set%20adjusting%20link%20mount.%20This%20was%20done%20to%20correct%20a%20weakness%20discovered%20during%20testing%20and%20was%20applied%20to%20the%20A2%20hull%20castings. [img]http://com-central.net/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/10605/normal_m48a2%7E0.jpg[/img] M48A3,%20which%20were%20made%20by%20converting%20old%20M48A1's.%20An%20adapter%20lug%20was%20welded%20to%20the%20hull%20during%20the%20conversion.%20Also%20found%20on%20A5's,%20since%20they%20were%20made%20by%20converting%20A1's%20and%20A3's. [img]http://com-central.net/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/10605/normal_m48a3%7E0.jpg[/img] M48A5.

This lug was also used on the M103 series when upgraded to A1/A2 standard, since She also suffered from the same design defect as the early M48's.

Hope this helps

_________________
Joe D
*****************
My M60 Gallery
*****************
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Michel_Krauss
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 30, 2009
Posts: 953
Location: Zuid-Holland, The Netherlands
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Hi folks,

I don't have an picture of the idler mounting, so I can not say what version the original might have been

However I was planning to go back to the museum in about one month, so I could check (if I don't forget)
They are rebuilding an International Harvester M-1-4 1/2 ton truck and I want to check how it looks like when finished

Michel

_________________
I'm Not Crazy, I'm Just Not You
Back to top
View user's profile
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: 2024
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:05 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Neil,

I was curious about your A5 list of SN's and looked at it again. This is what I got:

SN 2872 Veterans' Memorial Park, Ooltewah, TN

That's the M48A1 SN. The A5 number is A1056C. I didn't recognize the location at first. I have her at College Park TN just down the road from the Little Debbie Snack Cake Bakery, 35.062555,-85.069135.

SN 4494 (M48A5E1 Patton) Richardson Motor Pool Patton Museum Annex, Fort Knox, KY

This one retains her original SN, That's because she's a one off using an M60A2 hull with M48A5 turret.

SN 5934 (M48A5 hull with M60A2 turret) VFW Post 1181, Valley Station, KY

The SN for her is for an M48A1 hull, which is correct since that's what she is.

Can't comment on the other two since I haven't seen them. I willing to bet the SN's were copied wrong or they aren't A5's.

Similar to M60A3s, do the SNs without an A signify "new build" (as opposed to upgraded) A5s?


By the end of 1959 all new production of M48's ceased and M60 commenced. Turret and hull castings were no longer available for new production. All A3's and A5's were made from what was originally M48/A1/A2 hulls and turrets. US models using A1 and A3 models for tanks and later some A2's for AVLB's. So no technically, no "New" A5's were made, although you can argue that they were new tanks since all that really remained was the hull and turret casting from the A1's, everything else inside and out being removed and replaced with newer components. Anniston and Red River did a lot of A3 conversions along with BMY. Then Anniston made all the A5's from these and A1's. "A" being Anniston build. No idea why it was later moved to the end of the SN with M60A3 production.

_________________
Joe D
*****************
My M60 Gallery
*****************
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 22, 2006
Posts: 2516
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 8:52 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

- Joe_D
Neil,

SN 4494 (M48A5E1 Patton) Richardson Motor Pool Patton Museum Annex, Fort Knox, KY

This one retains her original SN, That's because she's a one off using an M60A2 hull with M48A5 turret.

SN 5934 (M48A5 hull with M60A2 turret) VFW Post 1181, Valley Station, KY

The SN for her is for an M48A1 hull, which is correct since that's what she is.



Well we have nicknamed the M48 with an M60A2 the 'Frankentank' so what do we call an M60A2 with an M48 turret??

And I think we have the key to the whole Frankentank story -

A 2LT got confused in the shop one morning and didn't listen to his sergeant
[A Friday morning the 2LT comes back form officers call where he has found out what was supposed to be a routine friday has suddenly changed]
2LT - Sergeant we need at least one of those two tanks put back together right away. The colonel has decided that he wants a platoon of tanks in the background for the press conference with the congressman who is coming to visit this afternoon

Sergeant - But sir the M48 hull is still being worked on and the M60A2 turret still has problems

2LT - So put the gun turret on the M60 hull and we'll park it in the back of the picture. No one will really notice.

Sergeant - But sir?!?!

2LT - Sergeant The Colonel thinks it's important and I'm not going to disappoint the Colonel. we'll fix it next week

1 PM - Advance man for congresscritter shows up to make sure site is ready for 4 PM press conference

Adv Man - We can't have 5 tanks in the background it isn't balanced. I need another tank to balance the picture here in an hour. Colonel you realize how important this photo op is for the Congressmans support of the Defense Budget? And that includes the approval of the new general Officers list.

Colonel - Lieutenant get another tank over here NOW

2 LT - But Sir ---

Col - No but's lieutenant get your section to put a deadline tank here if you have to but get one over here

2LT running to phone to call the shop - Sergeant get the M60A2 turret on the M48 Hull and get it over to the parade ground in the next hour.

Sergeant - But Sir ---

2 LT - No buts sergeant we only need it for a photo op this afternoon - The colonel thinks it's important and I won't let him down and I know you won't let me down [hangs up the phone]

an hour later a 'Frankentank' is delivered on a transporter and gently unloaded to make sure the turret doesn't move

Next Monday other priorities get in the way and the two monstrosities are left in the back row of the maintenance yard. A month later the sergeant retires. a week after that the lieutenant rotates to a staff assignment. No one else wants to take a chance on undoing what was obviously a secret test modification until they find the documentation.

The rest as they say is history Mr. Green Mr. Green

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 3941
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 9:11 pm
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

- Joe_D


SN 5934 (M48A5 hull with M60A2 turret) VFW Post 1181, Valley Station, KY


The SN for her is for an M48A1 hull, which is correct since that's what she is.


Joe, actually I also have a rebuild SN 923B for this one?

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 4641
Location: Lugano, Switzerland
PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 1:40 am
Post subject: Re: Surviving Panzers website (now incl. British tanks)

Well we have nicknamed the M48 with an M60A2 the 'Frankentank' so what do we call an M60A2 with an M48 turret??

Frankentank Junior Laughing Laughing Laughing

Massimo
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 9 of 54
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 8, 9, 10 ... 52, 53, 54  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum