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Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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Dontos
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Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:35 pm
Post subject: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

For all you detail driven individuals, here is a test. I'm going thru some old personal photos and thought this would really interest someone, besides myself.... Mr. Green

Can you spot a problem with something in this photo? Twisted Evil

(Hint: Look closely..!!)



BIG BONUS points go to anyone who might know why it is so,.....

Note: I was the gunner on this tank for a short period of time.

Regards
Don
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:54 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Well I only see 3 crew helmets

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Doug_Kibbey
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

3 helmets = autoloader?
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:11 am
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Good guess. Not the answer though.

Actually the CVC shortaged was due to my LT (the TC) forgot his,.....

Not that unusual,....but on the right path.

Regards
Don
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Roy_A_Lingle
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Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:35 am
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Hi Folks!

This is out in left field. There are only three helments because the tank doesn't need a loader. There is no breach inside the turret.
The items lined up on ground don't make a lot sense. Canteens without the carrier? What are those large items at both edges of the layout?

Dontos you got me.........
Sgt, Scouts Out!

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Dontos
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:36 am
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

A WAG for sure, but not the answer. (Gotta look closer & a little higher....?!)

The tank is a normal, fully operational M1A1. It has a full set BII.

The PCI required only Chalk Blocks(4), lateral loaders(4), CVC with 'bail out' cord(4 each), Vehicle issued first aid kits(2), muzzle plug(1), tank tarp(1), and individual web belt with canteen & carrier(Initial CAT Field Gear). The Company was preparing for railload to Graffenwohr.

In Aug 1988, It was the first official 'deployment' for the newly formed 3rd AD 'CAT 89' Competition Team.

Regards
Don
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Buq-Buq
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 5:57 am
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Well, the bumper number appears to be "CAT-51" which [presumably] would not be normal . . .




Mark
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 6:58 am
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

"DING DING DING", you are correct !!!

I'm sure that would tend to really confuse a casual observer in West Germany in 1988....

In Aug (88), when the team was formed, the Company was made up of FIVE(5) Tank Platoons with 20 tanks & full 4 man crews.

Regards
Don
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 4:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Five platoons with four tanks each? Normal platoon back then was 5 tanks wasn't it?

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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:35 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

HI Dontos! Hi Folks!

- Dontos
"DING DING DING", you are correct !!!

I'm sure that would tend to really confuse a casual observer in West Germany in 1988....

In Aug (88), when the team was formed, the Company was made up of FIVE(5) Tank Platoons with 20 tanks & full 4 man crews.

Regards
Don


Crying or Very sad I noticed that, but didn't think it was odd for a vehicle going to a CAT meet.

Sgt, Scouts out!

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"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:39 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Hi Folks!

- bsmart

Five platoons with four tanks each? Normal platoon back then was 5 tanks wasn't it?


No....? I don't think so. Dontos?
When the Army started fielding the M1 105mm tanks, the Division 86 reorg changed tanks platoons from five tanks to four and changed the tank company from three tank platoons to four and moved all non-tankers out of the tank companies into Battalion level units. That would leave the company leadership with just one MOS to train.

Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
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Dontos
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

Roy

You are correct. Division 86 cut the overal number of tanks in a platoon to 4.

I always believed it was done more to save money on M1 purchase, lowering the number of vehicles needed to fill a Division and enabling all units to eventually field the newer Abrams.

In the summer of 1982, I was an ROTC cadet assigned to B Co 2/67 Armor, 2nd AD (Tiger Bde) Ft Hood. The Bn was the first M1 Battalion in the Army. The men & Equipment had previously been 2/5 CAV 1st Cav Div when they initially drew the M-1's but were 'swapped' to 2AD.

For the 3 weeks I was there, all the tank platoons had 5 M-1's. 2AD was the first complete Division which fielded the Abrams, and I believe the only Abrams equipt unit to actually have ever had 5 vehicle tank platoons.

As for the 5 platoon deal from the above photo....

When the 3rd AD CAT Team was formed, 'candidates' were moved to C Co. Initially 5 Platoons worth of personnel were assigned to the Company. Crews were drawn up and began to train, locally. Meanwhile each individual was 'screened' and then evaluated. The Company went to Graf & shot a qualification Tank Table VIII. Following return to homestation, the first 'cuts' were made. The Company was reduced to 3 Tank Platoons (firing platoons) & HQ Plt. Basically a normal MTOE. Except ALL personnel in the COmpany were 19K. This gave the Company the ability to have extra personnel to make 'spot' replacements.

In the first cut, almost my entire platoon was eliminated. I was fortunate. I was assigned as the gunner of CAT 21. During the course of the year train up for the competition, I went through 3 loaders. It seems I was too fast firing, and finally found a loader who didn't mind firing the main gun when he armed it.(!!??)

Anyway,.... it was quite an adventure to participate. If you were a tanker during the Cold War,.....'CAT' was THE Suuperbowl of 'Tanking'.

I was lucky to have been in the right place at the right time.

Regards
Don
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Doug_Kibbey
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:02 pm
Post subject: Re: Quiz Time (The Mystery is in the detail)

- bsmart
Five platoons with four tanks each? Normal platoon back then was 5 tanks wasn't it?


Whew! For a minute there, I though I was suffering from a memory lapse...not that it's ever happened before..... Laughing
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