±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 806
Total: 806
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Photo Gallery
02: Community Forums
03: Downloads
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Photo Gallery
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Home
12: Community Forums
13: Photo Gallery
14: Photo Gallery
15: Community Forums
16: Home
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: Downloads
21: Home
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Home
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Photo Gallery
32: Community Forums
33: Photo Gallery
34: Your Account
35: Photo Gallery
36: Photo Gallery
37: Your Account
38: Downloads
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Member Screenshots
43: Downloads
44: Photo Gallery
45: Home
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Your Account
51: Photo Gallery
52: Photo Gallery
53: Photo Gallery
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Downloads
58: Community Forums
59: Member Screenshots
60: Community Forums
61: Photo Gallery
62: Home
63: Community Forums
64: Your Account
65: Community Forums
66: CPGlang
67: Home
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Photo Gallery
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Member Screenshots
74: Photo Gallery
75: Statistics
76: Community Forums
77: Your Account
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Home
81: Community Forums
82: CPGlang
83: Photo Gallery
84: Photo Gallery
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Photo Gallery
88: Photo Gallery
89: Community Forums
90: Downloads
91: Downloads
92: Community Forums
93: Home
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: Member Screenshots
98: Statistics
99: CPGlang
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Home
103: Statistics
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Photo Gallery
112: Photo Gallery
113: Your Account
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Photo Gallery
124: Community Forums
125: Photo Gallery
126: Community Forums
127: Downloads
128: Photo Gallery
129: Home
130: Community Forums
131: Photo Gallery
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: CPGlang
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: Photo Gallery
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Photo Gallery
156: Community Forums
157: Home
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Home
162: Home
163: Community Forums
164: Home
165: Downloads
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Downloads
169: Home
170: Community Forums
171: Home
172: Photo Gallery
173: Community Forums
174: Home
175: Photo Gallery
176: CPGlang
177: Photo Gallery
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Your Account
181: Community Forums
182: Home
183: Community Forums
184: Home
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Home
189: Community Forums
190: Treasury
191: CPGlang
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Community Forums
195: Downloads
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Downloads
199: Photo Gallery
200: Community Forums
201: Home
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Home
205: Community Forums
206: Home
207: Downloads
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Your Account
211: Community Forums
212: CPGlang
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Photo Gallery
217: Member Screenshots
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Home
223: CPGlang
224: Home
225: Photo Gallery
226: Statistics
227: Photo Gallery
228: Photo Gallery
229: Downloads
230: Community Forums
231: Photo Gallery
232: Home
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Photo Gallery
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Downloads
239: Community Forums
240: Your Account
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Photo Gallery
244: Community Forums
245: Statistics
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Community Forums
249: Community Forums
250: Your Account
251: Home
252: Community Forums
253: Photo Gallery
254: Community Forums
255: Downloads
256: Community Forums
257: Home
258: Community Forums
259: Photo Gallery
260: Community Forums
261: Downloads
262: CPGlang
263: Downloads
264: Downloads
265: Photo Gallery
266: Home
267: CPGlang
268: Home
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: CPGlang
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Home
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Community Forums
294: Community Forums
295: Community Forums
296: CPGlang
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Downloads
300: Home
301: Home
302: Community Forums
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Downloads
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Home
310: Community Forums
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: News
315: Photo Gallery
316: Community Forums
317: Photo Gallery
318: Home
319: Photo Gallery
320: Community Forums
321: CPGlang
322: Community Forums
323: Photo Gallery
324: Community Forums
325: Photo Gallery
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Photo Gallery
329: Photo Gallery
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Photo Gallery
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: CPGlang
338: Community Forums
339: News
340: Photo Gallery
341: Photo Gallery
342: Community Forums
343: News Archive
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Your Account
350: Home
351: Community Forums
352: Photo Gallery
353: Photo Gallery
354: Photo Gallery
355: Community Forums
356: Community Forums
357: Community Forums
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Member Screenshots
361: Photo Gallery
362: Community Forums
363: Photo Gallery
364: Downloads
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Your Account
369: Photo Gallery
370: Community Forums
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Community Forums
374: Downloads
375: Home
376: Home
377: Community Forums
378: Community Forums
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Home
383: Downloads
384: Member Screenshots
385: Home
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Photo Gallery
391: Statistics
392: Photo Gallery
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Photo Gallery
398: Community Forums
399: Community Forums
400: Your Account
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Statistics
404: Community Forums
405: Home
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Community Forums
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: Photo Gallery
412: News Archive
413: Community Forums
414: Community Forums
415: Member Screenshots
416: Community Forums
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Photo Gallery
421: Community Forums
422: Community Forums
423: Home
424: Photo Gallery
425: Community Forums
426: Community Forums
427: Community Forums
428: Photo Gallery
429: CPGlang
430: News
431: Photo Gallery
432: Photo Gallery
433: Community Forums
434: Community Forums
435: Downloads
436: Downloads
437: Member Screenshots
438: Home
439: Community Forums
440: Home
441: Photo Gallery
442: Photo Gallery
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: News
446: Community Forums
447: Home
448: Photo Gallery
449: Home
450: Community Forums
451: News
452: Downloads
453: Downloads
454: Photo Gallery
455: Photo Gallery
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Photo Gallery
460: Home
461: Photo Gallery
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Home
465: Home
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Home
469: Community Forums
470: Downloads
471: Photo Gallery
472: Photo Gallery
473: CPGlang
474: CPGlang
475: Statistics
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Home
479: Community Forums
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Photo Gallery
483: Downloads
484: Downloads
485: Member Screenshots
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Downloads
489: Community Forums
490: Home
491: Community Forums
492: Downloads
493: Community Forums
494: Community Forums
495: Home
496: Community Forums
497: Community Forums
498: Community Forums
499: Community Forums
500: Community Forums
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Member Screenshots
505: Community Forums
506: Member Screenshots
507: Community Forums
508: Home
509: Community Forums
510: Photo Gallery
511: Community Forums
512: Community Forums
513: Community Forums
514: News Archive
515: Statistics
516: Downloads
517: Photo Gallery
518: Downloads
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Community Forums
528: Your Account
529: Downloads
530: Photo Gallery
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Community Forums
537: Community Forums
538: Home
539: Member Screenshots
540: News
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Community Forums
546: Photo Gallery
547: Photo Gallery
548: Community Forums
549: Photo Gallery
550: Photo Gallery
551: Community Forums
552: Photo Gallery
553: Community Forums
554: Your Account
555: Community Forums
556: Home
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Home
563: Photo Gallery
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Home
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Community Forums
572: Community Forums
573: Your Account
574: Community Forums
575: Your Account
576: Community Forums
577: Community Forums
578: Community Forums
579: Downloads
580: Photo Gallery
581: Community Forums
582: Photo Gallery
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: Community Forums
586: Downloads
587: Community Forums
588: Community Forums
589: Downloads
590: Community Forums
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Community Forums
595: Home
596: Community Forums
597: Home
598: Member Screenshots
599: Downloads
600: Photo Gallery
601: Community Forums
602: Community Forums
603: Community Forums
604: Photo Gallery
605: CPGlang
606: Community Forums
607: Community Forums
608: Community Forums
609: Home
610: Photo Gallery
611: Community Forums
612: Community Forums
613: Home
614: Community Forums
615: Home
616: Community Forums
617: Community Forums
618: Community Forums
619: CPGlang
620: Community Forums
621: Downloads
622: Community Forums
623: Community Forums
624: Photo Gallery
625: Community Forums
626: Community Forums
627: Photo Gallery
628: Community Forums
629: Photo Gallery
630: Home
631: CPGlang
632: CPGlang
633: Community Forums
634: Photo Gallery
635: Community Forums
636: Photo Gallery
637: Community Forums
638: Community Forums
639: Community Forums
640: Your Account
641: Member Screenshots
642: Community Forums
643: Community Forums
644: Community Forums
645: Community Forums
646: Photo Gallery
647: Community Forums
648: Downloads
649: Community Forums
650: Community Forums
651: News
652: Community Forums
653: Home
654: Photo Gallery
655: Community Forums
656: Community Forums
657: Community Forums
658: Community Forums
659: Community Forums
660: Photo Gallery
661: Photo Gallery
662: Community Forums
663: Member Screenshots
664: Community Forums
665: Downloads
666: Community Forums
667: Community Forums
668: Community Forums
669: Community Forums
670: Member Screenshots
671: Photo Gallery
672: Community Forums
673: Community Forums
674: Community Forums
675: Community Forums
676: Community Forums
677: Community Forums
678: Member Screenshots
679: Community Forums
680: Photo Gallery
681: Community Forums
682: Community Forums
683: Community Forums
684: Community Forums
685: Community Forums
686: Home
687: Photo Gallery
688: Photo Gallery
689: Photo Gallery
690: Community Forums
691: Downloads
692: Photo Gallery
693: Community Forums
694: Community Forums
695: Community Forums
696: Community Forums
697: Community Forums
698: Community Forums
699: Community Forums
700: Community Forums
701: Community Forums
702: Photo Gallery
703: Community Forums
704: Community Forums
705: Community Forums
706: Community Forums
707: Community Forums
708: Community Forums
709: Community Forums
710: Downloads
711: Community Forums
712: Downloads
713: Community Forums
714: Community Forums
715: Home
716: Community Forums
717: Community Forums
718: Downloads
719: Photo Gallery
720: Community Forums
721: Community Forums
722: Home
723: Photo Gallery
724: Community Forums
725: Community Forums
726: Community Forums
727: Photo Gallery
728: Photo Gallery
729: Home
730: Photo Gallery
731: Community Forums
732: Home
733: Photo Gallery
734: Community Forums
735: Home
736: Community Forums
737: CPGlang
738: Downloads
739: Home
740: Community Forums
741: Community Forums
742: Community Forums
743: Community Forums
744: Community Forums
745: Community Forums
746: Photo Gallery
747: Member Screenshots
748: Community Forums
749: Photo Gallery
750: Home
751: Community Forums
752: Community Forums
753: Community Forums
754: Photo Gallery
755: Photo Gallery
756: Community Forums
757: Community Forums
758: Community Forums
759: Community Forums
760: Community Forums
761: Downloads
762: Community Forums
763: Photo Gallery
764: Photo Gallery
765: Member Screenshots
766: Community Forums
767: Community Forums
768: Community Forums
769: Community Forums
770: Photo Gallery
771: Community Forums
772: Community Forums
773: Community Forums
774: Community Forums
775: Photo Gallery
776: Home
777: Community Forums
778: Community Forums
779: Community Forums
780: Home
781: Community Forums
782: Community Forums
783: Community Forums
784: Home
785: Community Forums
786: Community Forums
787: Home
788: Community Forums
789: Photo Gallery
790: Community Forums
791: Downloads
792: Home
793: Photo Gallery
794: CPGlang
795: Community Forums
796: Photo Gallery
797: Photo Gallery
798: Photo Gallery
799: Community Forums
800: Home
801: Community Forums
802: Downloads
803: Community Forums
804: Community Forums
805: Community Forums
806: Member Screenshots

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Pzkpfw-e
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jul 21, 2010
Posts: 1202

PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 4:23 pm
Post subject: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

wyborcza.pl/1,75248,92...o_USA.html

Rough translation

The extraordinary story of the tank, which disappeared 20 years ago, immediately after extraction from the Black Nida near Bieleckich Mills. There are many indications that the panther was exported to the United States, where it is to be renovated and run as a great attraction. In Poland, the prosecutor's office investigated the matter, it also took the CBS

This story begins in mid-January 1945, when the Red Army advanced along the direction of Kielce, and its offensive on the Nida tried to stop the German armored units. During these struggles Pz.Kampf.V Tank Ausf. A Panther is stuck in the river near Bieleckich Mills (gm. Morawica). In the 50s Polish People's Army under the orders blasted its turret, but the nearly complete hull remained in place until 16 November 1990. Then, weighing around 30 tons, the wreckage was brought out on behalf of a private company. With helped from the technical security carts with a military unit Bukowiec. It turned out that the wreck is in a surprisingly good condition - it had all-wheel drive, all equipment inside. Experts have noted that it is quite unusual version of the panther, it is possible that a prototype.

The tank on the carriage was transported to Warsaw, then virtually disappeared. Even in 1991 there were some reports that it could get abroad as scrap, and journalists "Words of the People" described that involved the extraction of such operating in Kielce an association, while the army has made the extraction of the exercise.

Surprisingly, late last year began to investigate the matter Tank Central Bureau of Investigation. - Sam, I was surprised because it's so many years. But police said that the case was classified as a theft of cultural property, and it is not barred - anonymous informant tells Gazeta. For closure of this issue Police Chief spokesman did not respond to questions on this matter.

There are many indications that the procedure is carried out after doniesieniu made by Piotr Lewandowski, a lawyer, a private military enthusiast. - For several years trying to interest various authorities in this matter. After all, our country illegally were taken away a very valuable exhibit, and the circumstances in which this occurred, is at least strange - says Lewandowski. He argues that the tank completely excavated illegally on behalf of a private company from Warsaw. Interestingly, this would help, among others positive opinion of experts, the Higher Military School of Automobile, who found that it is worthless scrap. The documents, which arrived Lewandowski, shows that in return promised to provide some exhibits for the Museum. White Eagle in Skarzysko. - But the general conservator had agreed to deportation tank. Nevertheless, the wreck disappeared - emphasizes Lewandowski. Interestingly, after the interventions studied the matter twice in Kielce District Prosecutor. Last time last year. In April, interviewed, among others owners of a company that would handle the extraction of the wreck. - Indeed, the District Prosecutor Kielce-West to pursue a case on the illegal deportation tank, but they were dismissed because the case is przedawni?a - says S?awomir Mielniczuk, a spokesman for District Prosecutor's Office in Kielce.

- After that I made subsequent redemption notice, but this time the group, which probably deals with the wholesale export of such cultural property. Letter was sent to the chief of police, suggesting that the issue addressed by the Central Bureau of Investigation and the national team to fight crime against national heritage. I suspect that this resulted in a visit to CBS in the region Swietokrzyskie - says Lewandowski.

"Kielce" panther, probably around 2000 by Britain came to the United States. He bought it for his collection of Jacques Littlefield, a millionaire and passionate. On the internet you can find videos and photos of the tank and the information that has been redeemed from the Polish owner, and recovered from the Black Nida. With over 2 million dollars had been carefully renovated, reconstructing the tower, and even installed the original engine. Today, this tank is a lot of rides and attractions. - My dream is that once the tank returned to Polish - not hide Lewandowski.
Back to top
View user's profile
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 1:01 am
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

Hmmm...

It's hard to be sure, but it sounds to me like it was recovered and sold by (possibly corrupt?) officials in the 90s. Now 20 years later someone powerful has decided that they want to undo the deal. It sounds a lot like 'sour grapes'.

I suspect that even if the investigators manage to gather a case, this will spend at least another 20 years in court. Winning the case in an American court is going to be an uphill battle. At the end, even if they win, the Poles will have to buy the restored Panther back for whatever Littlefield has sunk in the project. That's likely to be a lot of cash.

Chuck

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:29 am
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

- C_Sherman
Hmmm...

It's hard to be sure, but it sounds to me like it was recovered and sold by (possibly corrupt?) officials in the 90s. Now 20 years later someone powerful has decided that they want to undo the deal. It sounds a lot like 'sour grapes'.

I suspect that even if the investigators manage to gather a case, this will spend at least another 20 years in court. Winning the case in an American court is going to be an uphill battle. At the end, even if they win, the Poles will have to buy the restored Panther back for whatever Littlefield has sunk in the project. That's likely to be a lot of cash.

Chuck


On the order of $2M, as I understand it, and that's probably low. The MVTF is likely pretty well-endowed even after Jacques' passing, and I wouldn't want to be the one to mount a legal challenge against whatever firm he'd worked with in this life.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Smashy
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Aug 05, 2010
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:34 am
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

- Doug_Kibbey

On the order of $2M, as I understand it, and that's probably low. The MVTF is likely pretty well-endowed even after Jacques' passing, and I wouldn't want to be the one to mount a legal challenge against whatever firm he'd worked with in this life.


There won't be much left of the 'well endowed' by the time the lawyers have finished. I would suspect some sort of compromise will be reached to avoid bankrupting the foundation.

_________________
Smashy
Back to top
View user's profile
Rikard_Hufschmied
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:32 pm
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

- Smashy
- Doug_Kibbey

On the order of $2M, as I understand it, and that's probably low. The MVTF is likely pretty well-endowed even after Jacques' passing, and I wouldn't want to be the one to mount a legal challenge against whatever firm he'd worked with in this life.


There won't be much left of the 'well endowed' by the time the lawyers have finished. I would suspect some sort of compromise will be reached to avoid bankrupting the foundation.


For that to be the case, Poland will have to hire a high profile US law firm. That will not be cheap so I don't see that happening.

_________________
Frustra Nate Vive Devincere
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Michel_Krauss
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 30, 2009
Posts: 953
Location: Zuid-Holland, The Netherlands
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 5:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

- Rikard_Hufschmied
- Smashy
- Doug_Kibbey

On the order of $2M, as I understand it, and that's probably low. The MVTF is likely pretty well-endowed even after Jacques' passing, and I wouldn't want to be the one to mount a legal challenge against whatever firm he'd worked with in this life.


There won't be much left of the 'well endowed' by the time the lawyers have finished. I would suspect some sort of compromise will be reached to avoid bankrupting the foundation.


For that to be the case, Poland will have to hire a high profile US law firm. That will not be cheap so I don't see that happening.


That is something that could happen, depending if Poland is willing to create an example to scare others.

Even if it would cost Poland $100M over 20 years (and in comparison that is not much or a long time for a country), that is much more then the foundation is able to spend in time or money

And Poland is not the only country with such problems, they could be joined by some other countries to put up a statement

Michel

_________________
I'm Not Crazy, I'm Just Not You
Back to top
View user's profile
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:35 pm
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

Hi,

At least based on the facts here, Poland is unlikely to prevail if they do take this to court. I suspect that "the officials were corrupt and not allowed to do that" won't hold a lot of water, as long as the buyers can demonstrate good faith efforts to obtain clear title. Nations are expected to police their own bureaucracy, for the most part.

Living here on the border of Mexico, we've seen a lot of transactions involving corrupt Mexican officials, and the response is usually a matter of national law. The Mexicans haven't had much luck in overturning such transactions once it crosses the international border, unless an American law was also broken in the process.

Very expensive, and very long.

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Tichenor
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Dec 06, 2007
Posts: 461
Location: Antwerp
PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:46 am
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

- C_Sherman
Winning the case in an American court is going to be an uphill battle.

General consensus is that the trail takes place where de delict has occured, not where the accused or the goods in question are. In this case that would be Poland, and that makes it an entire other game to play.

At the end, even if they win, the Poles will have to buy the restored Panther back for whatever Littlefield has sunk in the project

Again not agree, the buyer has to prove he had no knowledge of the "history" of the goods. As there aren't many Panthers on the market its al going to depend on the judge.

However, as I conclude from the artikel its about a quest from a singel individual and far from a trail. I even think there already has been a trail in Poland about this case, maybe Rafal can shed some light on this.

Michel
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Pzkpfw-e
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jul 21, 2010
Posts: 1202

PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:22 am
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

If it does get dirty, I'm sure that the HMVF could offer them a tank or two for their museums.
Back to top
View user's profile
bialy-r
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: May 06, 2009
Posts: 1233
Location: POLAND
PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:20 am
Post subject: Re: Littlefield Panther - legal ownership challenge.

To cut this topic.

Nobody believe that the Panther come back to Poland.

In Poland the police shat down the investigation because flow of time.

In this case is only evolved one person Mr Lewandowski (none museum, foundation, institution). Is a little chance that this case get to court in USA and I think none chance that Foundation can loss the Panther or must paid for it.

There would be a chance if that would be a work of art which was lost during WWII or stolen in Poland. But we talk about wreck of tank which is now worth something only because Mr. Littlefield took a great effort to renovate it.

No institution in Poland will go to court because the cost of it are to expensive and the resolute is doubly. Even if in some impossible way the court say that the tank must go back to Poland, there won’t be no materials to give the money back that Mr Littlefield pumped it the wreck during renovation process.


Be honest we can get back the Polish TKS which is in Kubinka (Russia) so in what way we can get back something that was a wreck of a German tank.

In Poland are still two panther tanks hulls and 50% of people interested in history in Poland say that is good that the panther went to USA because in here it wouldn't be restored and still rusting on open air.


I suggest to close the topic
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum