±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 671
Total: 671
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Photo Gallery
02: Community Forums
03: Photo Gallery
04: Downloads
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Photo Gallery
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Photo Gallery
13: Community Forums
14: Home
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Home
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: CPGlang
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Photo Gallery
24: CPGlang
25: Home
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Home
31: Community Forums
32: Home
33: Community Forums
34: Home
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Home
40: Community Forums
41: Photo Gallery
42: Community Forums
43: CPGlang
44: Photo Gallery
45: Home
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Downloads
50: Statistics
51: Community Forums
52: Home
53: Photo Gallery
54: Community Forums
55: Home
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Photo Gallery
59: Community Forums
60: Home
61: Home
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Home
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Photo Gallery
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: CPGlang
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Home
80: Community Forums
81: Home
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Member Screenshots
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Downloads
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Home
95: Home
96: Community Forums
97: Home
98: Photo Gallery
99: Home
100: Photo Gallery
101: Home
102: Photo Gallery
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Photo Gallery
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Home
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Statistics
112: Community Forums
113: Home
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Photo Gallery
118: CPGlang
119: Home
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Downloads
123: Home
124: Home
125: Community Forums
126: Photo Gallery
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Home
133: Photo Gallery
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Photo Gallery
138: Home
139: Community Forums
140: News
141: Photo Gallery
142: Home
143: Community Forums
144: Member Screenshots
145: Home
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Your Account
149: Community Forums
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: CPGlang
153: Photo Gallery
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Downloads
157: Home
158: Home
159: Community Forums
160: Photo Gallery
161: Photo Gallery
162: CPGlang
163: Community Forums
164: Home
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Home
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Home
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Photo Gallery
177: Community Forums
178: Photo Gallery
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Statistics
182: Photo Gallery
183: Photo Gallery
184: Community Forums
185: Your Account
186: Photo Gallery
187: Photo Gallery
188: Community Forums
189: Photo Gallery
190: Photo Gallery
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Home
194: Downloads
195: Home
196: Home
197: Photo Gallery
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Home
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Home
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Member Screenshots
211: Community Forums
212: Photo Gallery
213: Downloads
214: Community Forums
215: Downloads
216: Community Forums
217: Your Account
218: Downloads
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: CPGlang
223: Home
224: Home
225: Community Forums
226: Downloads
227: Community Forums
228: Photo Gallery
229: Community Forums
230: Member Screenshots
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Home
234: Community Forums
235: Photo Gallery
236: Home
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Home
244: Community Forums
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Home
248: Photo Gallery
249: Community Forums
250: Downloads
251: Community Forums
252: Downloads
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Home
256: Home
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Community Forums
260: Home
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Photo Gallery
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Community Forums
272: Photo Gallery
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Photo Gallery
277: News Archive
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: CPGlang
281: Photo Gallery
282: Community Forums
283: Photo Gallery
284: Home
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: News Archive
288: Home
289: Community Forums
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Photo Gallery
294: Photo Gallery
295: Home
296: Home
297: Home
298: Photo Gallery
299: Community Forums
300: Photo Gallery
301: Community Forums
302: Home
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Home
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Home
311: Community Forums
312: Home
313: Photo Gallery
314: CPGlang
315: Community Forums
316: Community Forums
317: Home
318: Community Forums
319: Photo Gallery
320: Photo Gallery
321: Community Forums
322: Photo Gallery
323: Photo Gallery
324: Home
325: Community Forums
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Photo Gallery
329: Member Screenshots
330: Community Forums
331: Home
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Home
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Downloads
340: Home
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Community Forums
344: Home
345: Home
346: Community Forums
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Statistics
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Home
356: Home
357: Community Forums
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Home
361: Community Forums
362: Photo Gallery
363: Home
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Home
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Photo Gallery
374: Home
375: Photo Gallery
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Community Forums
379: Photo Gallery
380: Community Forums
381: Home
382: Community Forums
383: Photo Gallery
384: Community Forums
385: News Archive
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Photo Gallery
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Downloads
392: Photo Gallery
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Home
399: Photo Gallery
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Community Forums
405: Home
406: Community Forums
407: Photo Gallery
408: CPGlang
409: Downloads
410: Downloads
411: Community Forums
412: Photo Gallery
413: Photo Gallery
414: CPGlang
415: Community Forums
416: Community Forums
417: Photo Gallery
418: CPGlang
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Home
422: Community Forums
423: Photo Gallery
424: Community Forums
425: Photo Gallery
426: Photo Gallery
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: CPGlang
430: Community Forums
431: Home
432: Photo Gallery
433: Community Forums
434: Downloads
435: Community Forums
436: Community Forums
437: Photo Gallery
438: Community Forums
439: Community Forums
440: News
441: Community Forums
442: Your Account
443: Community Forums
444: Home
445: Member Screenshots
446: Community Forums
447: Community Forums
448: Home
449: Community Forums
450: Photo Gallery
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Photo Gallery
454: Community Forums
455: Home
456: Home
457: Community Forums
458: Home
459: Community Forums
460: Community Forums
461: Community Forums
462: Your Account
463: Community Forums
464: Home
465: Home
466: Community Forums
467: Home
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Community Forums
471: Community Forums
472: Photo Gallery
473: Community Forums
474: Member Screenshots
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Photo Gallery
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Home
483: Your Account
484: Community Forums
485: Home
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Community Forums
490: Member Screenshots
491: Home
492: Home
493: Community Forums
494: Home
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: News
498: Home
499: Community Forums
500: Home
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Photo Gallery
505: Photo Gallery
506: Community Forums
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: News
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: Community Forums
513: CPGlang
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Downloads
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Community Forums
520: Home
521: Community Forums
522: Home
523: Downloads
524: Photo Gallery
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Photo Gallery
528: CPGlang
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Your Account
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Community Forums
537: Community Forums
538: Community Forums
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Home
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Community Forums
550: Home
551: Photo Gallery
552: Your Account
553: Community Forums
554: Your Account
555: Home
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Home
561: Community Forums
562: Member Screenshots
563: Community Forums
564: Photo Gallery
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Home
568: Home
569: Home
570: Community Forums
571: CPGlang
572: Community Forums
573: Your Account
574: Community Forums
575: Community Forums
576: Community Forums
577: Your Account
578: Your Account
579: Home
580: Community Forums
581: Photo Gallery
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: Your Account
586: Community Forums
587: Community Forums
588: Community Forums
589: Photo Gallery
590: Community Forums
591: CPGlang
592: Downloads
593: Community Forums
594: Community Forums
595: Community Forums
596: Community Forums
597: Community Forums
598: Community Forums
599: Community Forums
600: Community Forums
601: Home
602: Photo Gallery
603: Community Forums
604: Community Forums
605: Community Forums
606: Community Forums
607: Photo Gallery
608: Community Forums
609: Community Forums
610: Photo Gallery
611: Community Forums
612: Home
613: Community Forums
614: Photo Gallery
615: Home
616: Community Forums
617: Home
618: Home
619: Photo Gallery
620: Community Forums
621: Community Forums
622: Photo Gallery
623: Photo Gallery
624: Community Forums
625: Photo Gallery
626: Community Forums
627: Community Forums
628: Community Forums
629: Community Forums
630: Community Forums
631: Photo Gallery
632: Community Forums
633: Downloads
634: Community Forums
635: Community Forums
636: Community Forums
637: Photo Gallery
638: Community Forums
639: Community Forums
640: Photo Gallery
641: Community Forums
642: Photo Gallery
643: Community Forums
644: Community Forums
645: Photo Gallery
646: Community Forums
647: Downloads
648: Home
649: Community Forums
650: Community Forums
651: Photo Gallery
652: Community Forums
653: Community Forums
654: Community Forums
655: Community Forums
656: Home
657: Community Forums
658: Community Forums
659: Community Forums
660: Photo Gallery
661: Community Forums
662: News
663: Community Forums
664: Community Forums
665: Community Forums
666: Home
667: Home
668: Community Forums
669: Community Forums
670: Community Forums
671: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
MVTF M48 Prototype
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
toadmanstankpictures
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 10:02 pm
Post subject: MVTF M48 Prototype

Here are a few pics that I took today. I have to dig the others out of my files. If I can't find them, I'll shoot additional ones next week.




You'll notice that two of the return roller stations have been plated over.

_________________
Chris "toadman" Hughes
www.toadmanstankpictures.com
www.cafepress.com/toad...ksandstuff
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 3:48 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

I think there is more than one broken torsion bar.

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 3:38 am
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Hi,

According to Joe D.'s treatise on M48 turret part numbers, this turret is one of the earlier types. The "Ser NO-1" might lead one to believe that this is actually the first of them. The hull is a gasser, which fits with the early turret type, but the business with the return rollers and short gun tube is mystifying.

Chuck

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:56 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

I wonder if the 'gub' is actually just a weighted tube put in place to balance the vehicle that was used as part of a test program. If the vehicle was being used for automotive tests it wouldn't need a working gun but may need a balanced turret

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 6:24 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

There's a lot of contradictions with this tank,

As far as Chuck's "SER-1" idea about that identifying her as a prototype, I have to disagree, The Casting mark is from the Wheeling West Virginia foundry, so most likely this turret was their first in the series of "7364154" turrets they produced. The Stowage brackets in the front of the turret clearly indicate it's an M48 Turret. T48 turrets had them in the rear.



Notice She doesn't have the tension wheels between the sprocket and #6 road wheels. Another T48 ID feature along with the earlier bustle rack design. Below is a picture of a T48 turret to include the casting marks. Notice it's the same PN but the Series is 28. This turret is on the T95 at Fort McCoy. The stowage bracket is damaged from the impact of a round but most of it still remains. They used T48 turrets on some of the T95 prototypes during testing.



What's weird is this tank has what appears to be a .50 cal barrel protruding from the Co-Ax port. T48's did use the .50 Cal for a Co-Ax on the left side and had a .30 cal on the right. M48's dropped the .50 and replaced it with the .30 Cal, the port for the .30 Cal was then used for the Gunners telescope, something the T48 did not have. It could be a mock up done for display, seen M2 barrels protruding from M60A3 Co-Ax ports before.

Looking at the support rollers, it's obvious all they did was unbolt the #2 and #4 assemblies and plated them over, since on M48's they weren't welded on like the M60 series.



Three support roller hulls (M48A2) would not have the bolt holes machined like the one below.



I think the hull was used for automotive tests. Which would explain the newer rear fenders first used on M48A2's. She's a large hatch hull (M48A1) with an M48 turret. So either she was never upgraded to the M1 cupola or more than likely a lash up of a hull using an excess turret that was laying around that they put on her to simulate weight, sorta like Bob said. The more I look at that tube though, the more I believe it's fake. It definitely isn't the 152mm test turret used at White Sands. Which leads me to believe this whole turret was just slapped on to make a display at one time. Only pictures of the inside will help clear this up.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Kurt_Laughlin
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 577

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:27 am
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

I was looking through Hunnicut and the photos of T48 #2 show it with a CFM-W turret. I can't tell which SER it is though. My guess is that several foundries were brought on board at the start in order to assure an adequate supply for production.

SER 1 might have even been mild steel, to prove out the patterns. It would weigh the same as an armor steel version, which would make it perfect for automotive tests.

I've been wondering if anyone has the PN off any of the T95/M48 turrets.

KL
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:40 am
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Kurt,

The McCoy T95 with M48 turret has two PN's,

7363851
7364154
Series 28.

McCoy T95 Turret PN's

Also the Foundry mark is unknown to me, being an octagon with a hash at the 6 o'clock position. Earlier discussions with Dontos confirmed this is the original turret she had when being shot at on the range. The unique smoke grenade brackets helped confirm this.

BTW, Thanks a million for all the stuff you sent.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Kurt_Laughlin
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 577

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 2:06 am
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Now that's bizarre . . .

A guy sent me photos of the M48 in Bodfish CA and it has the same dual numbering. It is SN 58 and 7363851-2, a not uncommon indicator that it was made to revision 2 of the drawing.

I have noticed that little leg on other postwar ASF-C symbols. Interestingly, it also appeared on early ASF Cast Armor plant symbols, such as this one on Pierre-Oliver's site:

the.shadock.free.fr/Ta...age21.html

but was clearly absent on the later version of the symbol:

the.shadock.free.fr/Ta...age11.html

It looks like they reverted to the old style after the war.

My guess is that this was an orientation mark for assembling the letter patterns. With the little serif on the top of the C, people might have thought it was a goofed up G or something . . .

the.shadock.free.fr/Ta...age31.html

I dunno.

KL
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:15 am
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

- Kurt_Laughlin


I've been wondering if anyone has the PN off any of the T95/M48 turrets.

KL


Kurt - I can dig through my pictures of the Weirton T95 ( I made a trip there a month or so ago that is still in the camera) and see if I have the markings off that turret if you haven't already captured them

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:18 am
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Not to throw a wrench in the works,.....I did have these images







They are (I assume...) taken of the T95 that ended up as a range target, which is rescued and then (& now) on display at Ft McCoy.

These were located in a T95 file which also had the 'discovery' images of the McCoy T95. Most seem to be circe the 1960's/70's.

Regards
Don
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 4:29 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Don,

Top image is of a T95 with an M48A1 turret. M1 cupola and newer style bustle rack makes it so. Also, on this turret you can barely make out what looks like the General Steel Foundries mark on the side (Shield with "G" and Stars above) below the grunt rail. The McCoy tank has a different turret, so unless they swapped them before she became a target, She's not the same tank.

Bottom two images are of an M19 cupola from an M60. PN 10873386 helps ID this. The turret contour is that of an M60 (A0). Images are interesting since they are demonstrating a simple interrupter for the searchlight. This is not the production version. It was hinged to allow it to fold down. Weld points are different. I believe these pictures got mixed in with the T95 file. M19 cupola would not fit on an M48 turret without an adapter ring (was tried), ring diameter is too large and the over hang interfered with the loaders hatch.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
toadmanstankpictures
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 6:38 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

So, if I were to take a bunch of pics of this beast, say tomorrow, how should I list it on my site? Hopefully, I'll be able to find a dataplate inside of it that will help us out. If not, should I title it "M48 Testbed"?

_________________
Chris "toadman" Hughes
www.toadmanstankpictures.com
www.cafepress.com/toad...ksandstuff
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:46 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Chris,

Beats me, Getting inside would determine a lot.

Waiting anxiously for results

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
toadmanstankpictures
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 8:16 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Quick update.
There weren't any plates that I could see in the vehicle interior. The main gun is a fake as there is a metal bar emplaced in the gunmount. I'm at work right now so I'll post some pics later tonight.

_________________
Chris "toadman" Hughes
www.toadmanstankpictures.com
www.cafepress.com/toad...ksandstuff
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 6:14 pm
Post subject: Re: MVTF M48 Prototype

Chris,
Did you ever post the interior pics? Did we come to any further resolution on this M48?

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum