±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 592
Total: 592
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Home
06: Community Forums
07: Home
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Home
16: Community Forums
17: Photo Gallery
18: Home
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Photo Gallery
26: Home
27: Community Forums
28: Home
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Downloads
33: Community Forums
34: Home
35: Photo Gallery
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Home
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Your Account
45: Photo Gallery
46: Community Forums
47: CPGlang
48: Home
49: CPGlang
50: Community Forums
51: Photo Gallery
52: Member Screenshots
53: Community Forums
54: Photo Gallery
55: CPGlang
56: Photo Gallery
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Downloads
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Home
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Home
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Photo Gallery
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Photo Gallery
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: News Archive
88: Community Forums
89: Home
90: Photo Gallery
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Photo Gallery
94: Home
95: Photo Gallery
96: Photo Gallery
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Member Screenshots
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Home
108: Home
109: Home
110: Community Forums
111: CPGlang
112: Photo Gallery
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Home
119: Community Forums
120: Photo Gallery
121: Community Forums
122: Member Screenshots
123: Photo Gallery
124: Downloads
125: Photo Gallery
126: Home
127: Community Forums
128: CPGlang
129: Downloads
130: Downloads
131: Photo Gallery
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: Your Account
140: Home
141: Community Forums
142: Home
143: Your Account
144: CPGlang
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Photo Gallery
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Photo Gallery
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Downloads
154: Community Forums
155: Photo Gallery
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Photo Gallery
163: Member Screenshots
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Your Account
167: Photo Gallery
168: Community Forums
169: Member Screenshots
170: Photo Gallery
171: Community Forums
172: Downloads
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Photo Gallery
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Photo Gallery
184: Home
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Community Forums
192: Photo Gallery
193: Member Screenshots
194: Home
195: Home
196: Photo Gallery
197: Photo Gallery
198: Your Account
199: Community Forums
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Photo Gallery
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Home
209: Photo Gallery
210: News
211: Downloads
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Community Forums
217: Community Forums
218: Photo Gallery
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Photo Gallery
224: Community Forums
225: Photo Gallery
226: Photo Gallery
227: Community Forums
228: Downloads
229: Photo Gallery
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Photo Gallery
233: Photo Gallery
234: Downloads
235: Community Forums
236: Community Forums
237: Downloads
238: Community Forums
239: News
240: Home
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Photo Gallery
244: Community Forums
245: Home
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Downloads
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Photo Gallery
257: Community Forums
258: Downloads
259: Photo Gallery
260: Home
261: Downloads
262: Photo Gallery
263: Community Forums
264: Downloads
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Statistics
272: Photo Gallery
273: Community Forums
274: Home
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Photo Gallery
279: Home
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Member Screenshots
283: Community Forums
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Photo Gallery
288: Community Forums
289: Home
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: CPGlang
293: Community Forums
294: Photo Gallery
295: Community Forums
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Home
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Photo Gallery
302: Community Forums
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Photo Gallery
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Community Forums
311: Community Forums
312: Home
313: Community Forums
314: Home
315: Community Forums
316: Photo Gallery
317: Downloads
318: Community Forums
319: Member Screenshots
320: Community Forums
321: Member Screenshots
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: Community Forums
325: Home
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Downloads
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Downloads
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Community Forums
344: Downloads
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: News Archive
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Your Account
351: Your Account
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Home
357: Photo Gallery
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Photo Gallery
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Downloads
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Photo Gallery
370: Community Forums
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Home
374: News
375: Community Forums
376: Your Account
377: Member Screenshots
378: Home
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Downloads
382: Community Forums
383: Photo Gallery
384: Community Forums
385: Home
386: Member Screenshots
387: Your Account
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Photo Gallery
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Community Forums
399: Community Forums
400: Photo Gallery
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Your Account
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Photo Gallery
407: Community Forums
408: Community Forums
409: Home
410: Community Forums
411: Downloads
412: Community Forums
413: Home
414: Photo Gallery
415: Community Forums
416: Community Forums
417: Your Account
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Community Forums
423: Community Forums
424: Member Screenshots
425: Photo Gallery
426: Community Forums
427: Photo Gallery
428: Photo Gallery
429: Home
430: Community Forums
431: Photo Gallery
432: Community Forums
433: Community Forums
434: Photo Gallery
435: Photo Gallery
436: Community Forums
437: Community Forums
438: Community Forums
439: Community Forums
440: Photo Gallery
441: Community Forums
442: Community Forums
443: Community Forums
444: Photo Gallery
445: Community Forums
446: Photo Gallery
447: Community Forums
448: Community Forums
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Home
454: CPGlang
455: Photo Gallery
456: Photo Gallery
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Photo Gallery
460: Community Forums
461: Community Forums
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Downloads
470: CPGlang
471: CPGlang
472: Your Account
473: Home
474: Community Forums
475: Home
476: Photo Gallery
477: Community Forums
478: Photo Gallery
479: Community Forums
480: Photo Gallery
481: Photo Gallery
482: Community Forums
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Downloads
486: Statistics
487: Community Forums
488: Photo Gallery
489: Community Forums
490: Community Forums
491: Photo Gallery
492: Downloads
493: Community Forums
494: Community Forums
495: Community Forums
496: Photo Gallery
497: Home
498: Community Forums
499: Community Forums
500: Photo Gallery
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: Community Forums
506: Community Forums
507: Photo Gallery
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: Home
513: Home
514: Community Forums
515: Photo Gallery
516: Photo Gallery
517: Photo Gallery
518: Photo Gallery
519: Community Forums
520: Photo Gallery
521: Your Account
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: CPGlang
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Community Forums
528: Photo Gallery
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Downloads
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Community Forums
537: Downloads
538: Home
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Home
543: Community Forums
544: Community Forums
545: Downloads
546: Member Screenshots
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: CPGlang
550: Community Forums
551: Photo Gallery
552: Statistics
553: Community Forums
554: Community Forums
555: Community Forums
556: Photo Gallery
557: Community Forums
558: Photo Gallery
559: Community Forums
560: Downloads
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Community Forums
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Your Account
571: Home
572: Photo Gallery
573: Community Forums
574: Downloads
575: Community Forums
576: Community Forums
577: Community Forums
578: Community Forums
579: News Archive
580: Community Forums
581: Your Account
582: News
583: Community Forums
584: Your Account
585: Community Forums
586: CPGlang
587: Community Forums
588: Photo Gallery
589: Home
590: Community Forums
591: Photo Gallery
592: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:49 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Hi Folks!

- SFC_Jeff_Button

I snapped a picture down the muzzle and was suprised to see it was smooth bore. The other M60 I took pics of had a rifled barrel. Is this another clue to it being a "Slick 60"?



SMOOTH BORE 105mm gun tube!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Am I the only one who noticed this?

The profile of that tube makes me think it is a normal rifled barrel and not a mock up.

Why would a M60A0 or any other M60 type have a SMOOTH BORE?

Very confuzed!
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:58 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

[quote="Roy_A_Lingle"]Hi Folks!

- SFC_Jeff_Button

I snapped a picture down the muzzle and was suprised to see it was smooth bore. The other M60 I took pics of had a rifled barrel. Is this another clue to it being a "Slick 60"?

SMOOTH BORE 105mm gun tube!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Am I the only one who noticed this?
The profile of that tube makes me think it is a normal rifled barrel and not a mock up.

Why would a M60A0 or any other M60 type have a SMOOTH BORE?

Very confuzed!
Sgt, Scouts Out!


Nope...and I've been wracking my brain trying to recall any Board experiments with smooth bore experiments on older model Pattons...and coming up dry. Found nuttin' in Hunnicutt yet either. Doesn't mean there weren't any though. Maybe Bob knows of something from the APG archives. I can imagine an interest in this concept, but I'm suspicious.
We need a look-see inside at this gun. Wink

Jeff, can you get a view of the muzzle of this gun? Does it have the boresight "notches"? (four of them, for attaching thread or string across the end of the muzzle on the outside, might let us know if this is even a real gun barrel or not, though it certaionly looks to be)
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 8:52 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

I just found my ealier pictures of this "Slick 60" that I took in good sunlight. This may help with identifying some features and looking for those glacis grind marks and muzzle end? Here are also the inside gun data plate and information. The breech area said; "TUBE No 11041, CANNON 105mm, Gun M68, MFR. 9208, 1971, 1660LBS, INS", from there I couldn't make out any more. I sure thought it was a real cannon/muzzle, but I'm not the tank expert.














_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:03 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Jeff,
It sure looks real to me, too. If you have found some sort of early smoothbore 105mm experimental piece 'o ordnance, then that's truely a signficant historical item and we've got some homework to do. I've very curious to hear others' take on this, because to the best of my knowledge, there's nothing you can do to the rifled version of that gun to cause what you've found in the normal course of events. A precise measurement across the inside diameter of that bore would be interesting.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:26 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

I wonder if some kind of de-milling involved grinding the rifling out for a certain distance in from the muzzle? Getting a light further down the barrel so we could see if there was rifling further down the bore would be interesting (as would getting a measurement of the bore diameter at the muzzle)

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:30 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Its definately a mystery... I suspect it had a smoothbore cannon - ie a weight/barrel instead of a real gun - because it was meant to be a training tank, but otherwise had all the right components.... The Army did consider a 105mm smoothbore gun called the T210E4 for the T95E4 tank, but the barrel looked considerably different with the bore extractor well forward compared to the M68...

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:04 am
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

This M60A3 was one of the first I saw while driving around Ft Hood that wasn't in a museum. This one sits in the 4th ID area, at a three street, pie-wedge intersection of Battalion Ave and 19th and 20th Streets. Serial number is 3293A, ("A" in believed to stand for Anniston rebuild).





_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:19 am
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Jeff, thanks again for all the pics. I'll add it to the register.

BTW, I hope those fires didnt force ya'll to evacuate?

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:23 am
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Looks like the original SN was 9190?

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:43 am
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Yes, 9190 was the original serial, should have said that before. The fire was worse than first thought, not a grass fire but a run away brush fire where flames were 30-40 ft high. Commanchee 1,2, and 3 were all evacuated. People were not aloowed back into houseing by car, and were parking along the edge of housing running in on foot to get pets while the MP's watched. I live about 5-6 miles away to the west, and my car and truck were covered on ash and dust this morning. Spent the morning washing them. I had a family get ready to spend the night at my house last night with their dog, cat, and even a rat, but they were finally allowed to go home around 9pm. Rumor has it the fire was started by one of two ways; a power line blew down in the winds and sparked, or a local burn got out of control in the high winds. Killeen registered a high wind gust of 48mph, Waco hit 55mph.
How are your weekends looking around mid-late March? How long a trip is it fron Eustis to APG? PM me with the info.

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:58 am
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Jeff

Just popped you and Neil PMs. But for both you and everyone else, check out the 'Aberdeen in April' thread that is in the 'sticky area'.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 10:48 am
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

- SFC_Jeff_Button
This M60A3 was one of the first I saw while driving around Ft Hood that wasn't in a museum. This one sits in the 4th ID area, at a three street, pie-wedge intersection of Battalion Ave and 19th and 20th Streets. Serial number is 3293A, ("A" in believed to stand for Anniston rebuild).






Jeff
'Death Dealers' was for 1/67 & 2/67 Ar Bns ( formally 2nd AD ).

That is where a snack stand was, if I remember correctly.

Don
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:31 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Hi everyone,
I'm kinda wish I had commented on the "Smooth Bore" earlier but I initially thouht the picture was taken from the breech, Duh!!! . Very interesting discovery. Based on the information Jeff posted:
The breech area said; "TUBE No 11041, CANNON 105mm, Gun M68, MFR. 9208, 1971, 1660LBS, INS",


This leads me to believe it's a standard 105 rifled tube. The manufacture date being 1971 also says this is not the original tube for this tank, not surprising since they were only good for about 1000 EFC rounds. I looked a lot closer at the interior pictures Jeff posted and one thing that stands out is the Nylon sheild is missing inside the turret along with the large counter weight to the right of the breech. The Auxillary sight also does not look original, It should be a 105C for it's age. Can't tell by the sight picture because it looks like the HEAT reticle is indexed. By the looks of the inside I think the whole gun and maybe breech have been replaced in this tank. It also looks like the breech is covered in Grease to preserve it. The breech would have it's own serial number and manufacture date located at the 6 o'clock looking at it from the back, just under the breech block. Those generally were good for at least 3000 rounds from what I remember, no reason why it wouldn't be the original unless the whole assembly was replaced as I suspect. I have no idea why the the rifle groves are removed, demilling is a good guess but that takes a lot of work compared to just welding a plug. Might be a tube they got that was defective from Watervliet Arsenal that was identified as defective before they rifled it. This tank is a real brain teaser, the more Jeff posts on it, the more questions I have. Maybe we need an AFV "CSI" team to fly down and investigate it Laughing . Who knows, could be a new TV show on the History Channel.

Stumped and Frustrated Mad because I ain't there,

Joe D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:41 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

- Joe_D
This tank is a real brain teaser, the more Jeff posts on it, the more questions I have. Maybe we need an AFV "CSI" team to fly down and investigate it Laughing . Who knows, could be a new TV show on the History Channel.

Stumped and Frustrated Mad because I ain't there,

Joe D


"Scramble your best Curmudgeon Team! This is not a drill!" ...and let's not spoil any facts we might elucidate with any "helpful" editting by a H-C crew, eh, Joe?

This vehicle is, indeed, the most interesting enigma to come our way in a while...and don't we love a good mystery?
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:59 pm
Post subject: Re: M60 at Ft Hood for Joe D...

Joe,
Not to divert from a good enigma... But I have an M60 SN question. If it ends in an A its the Anniston Army Depot rebuild SN... What if it ends in an M???

Neil
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 4 of 5
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum