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Armor penetration formula
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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blair
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 8:32 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Wheeeeee....
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piney
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 6:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

deja vu all over again Smile

Jeff Lewis
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clausb
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 3:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

At least the matter of the Sherman Comb have been solved..... Smile

Claus B
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Tanklord
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 9:27 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

And I raise you both: One pink Panther in Viet Nam! Twisted Evil Laughing

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Doug_Kibbey
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 8:38 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- bsmart
No I admit that there is a theory of "SHATTER GAP" that some believe and others don't . The concept of arguing SHATTER GAP is part of the basic religion of the AFVNews discussion group. Other key parts of the faith are

"Were there Green Tigers in Tunisia?"

and

"Did American units have Sabot rounds for the 57mm AT gun in Europe?"

It doesn't matter which side ogf the argument you are on you just need to have a strong opinion on at least two of them.

The faith is not in the belief but in the existence of passioned discussion


I'll see your "Shatter Gap Religion" and raise you one "AFV Paint Religion".... Mr. Green
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 10:14 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

No I admit that there is a theory of "SHATTER GAP" that some believe and others don't . The concept of arguing SHATTER GAP is part of the basic religion of the AFVNews discussion group. Other key parts of the faith are

"Were there Green Tigers in Tunisia?"

and

"Did American units have Sabot rounds for the 57mm AT gun in Europe?"

It doesn't matter which side ogf the argument you are on you just need to have a strong opinion on at least two of them.

The faith is not in the belief but in the existence of passioned discussion

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claude_GILLONO
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 5:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Twisted Evil So you all finally admit there is a SHATTER GAP... Mr. Green




Wink
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JimWeb
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 9:44 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- bsmart
I may have mentioned Lorrin, but I wasn't going to bring up the dreaded
Surprised Shatter GAP Shocked


Oh God I've got my twitch back....

Crying or Very sad

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Dennis_Smith
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Thanks Bob, I hoped that would be a clincher.


Last edited by Dennis_Smith on Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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Tanklord
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

PLEASE, not the "Shatter Gap" thread! AAAARGH

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:09 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

I may have mentioned Lorrin, but I wasn't going to bring up the dreaded
Surprised Shatter GAP Shocked

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Dennis_Smith
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 6:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

I remember that thread on the old forum. By the way, thinking back to the old forum, where's Vascilly (sp?) these days?

I remember the discussions about the geometric advantages, face hardened steels, thru hardened homogenous steels, etc.

All devised by science and all with counter-measures devised by science and spoken in the language of mathmatics. Velocity graphs and vector analyses that reveal convoluted "shatter gaps" that most mere mortals (like myself) don't understand.

Mabe there should be a "mathematically brilliant minds" forum.


Last edited by Dennis_Smith on Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
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clausb
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 9:47 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- JWB2
I got the info from C.G. Erickson a few years ago at one of the visits to Littlefields.


Well, maybe he can clarify it, if he sees this. Still sounds wrong to me.

Claus B
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blair
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 6:41 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Gentlemen,
Thank you all for your educated input.

I was wondering how long it would take for a "Lorrin" reference to appear.
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JWB2
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 12:50 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- clausb
That is the result of a firing test conducted by the US Army. IIRC it was 90mm vs Panther type armor so it probably has a lot to do with undermatch. Post war tank armor was desiged to deal with HVAP and early APDS.


But the T-34s armour wasn't.....

90mm projectile vs 80mm of Panther frontal armour gives a T/D of 0.88 which is not exactly a massive "undermatch", in fact it is in the same ballpark as, say, a German 75mm vs a late-war Sherman hull at 63mm (T/D 0.84). In the latter case, your logic would dictate that hitting the Shermans armour at an angle of 40 degrees from the side would have a better chance of penetring than a hit at 30 degrees from the side. That sounds rather counterintuitive to me.....
I've yet to see an actual test result, official penetration data or an emperically based penetration formula that would result in what you describe - resistance of armour degrading at angles over 56 degrees. So unless you can point to the exact tests, I'd have to say that it is either a fairy tale or at least a misunderstanding.

Claus B

I got the info from C.G. Erickson a few years ago at one of the visits to Littlefields.
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