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Elefant tank overhaul history
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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SHAWN
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:10 pm
Post subject: Elefant tank overhaul history

(Has this been discussed before?) What is the specific history for the APG Elefant? What is known and can be verified aside from its capture at Anzio? What can be verified for its history prior to its capture-- its manufacture and rebuild history?
SR
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SHAWN
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:12 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Okay, leads me to another question, what is/are the dates for the production run of the Elefant?
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JeffStringer
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:18 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

From what I remember, March to May of 1943.

90 Porsche Tiger chassis's were modified to become the Elefant.
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TrevorLarkum
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 8:56 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

This is what I have on the APG Elefant from my 1995 book:

preservedtanks.com/Typ...0&Select=1

If anyone knows any more (Neil?) I'd love to hear it.

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SHAWN
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Thank you.
Yeah, I was wondering about the initail manufacturing and the rebuild as the t.v. show said it had fought in Kursk, but had all of the later modifications.

SR
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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:47 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

I'm sure they were speaking in general, and hopefully not of that particular vehicle.

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TrevorLarkum
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:45 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Shawn, as I understand it, they all fought at Kursk, and the 50 that survived were rebuilt, including the APG one. For example Spielberger's Tiger and King Tiger Tanks, p149:

"The ninety Ferdinand (Jagdpanzer) Hunting Tanks comprising the 656 Jagdpanzer Regiment suffered heavy casualties in the Kursk Offensive (Operation Citadel) which started in July 1943."

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SHAWN
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

I understand that and came to the same conclusion. I had wondered if there was any substantial proof ("pow" crewmember accounts, paperwork) to back up the assumption. Since the initial production run was before the offensive it only makes sense that it was involved in the Kursk battles.
Thanks all,
SR
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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:11 pm
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Did not know that,

The other statement "Survived Kursk" is an accomplishment in itself, not to mention fifty did. Must have been some really great recovery teams working the battlefield.

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SHAWN
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:11 am
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

a feat indeed considering the Germans had no recovery vehicles or CEVs (at that time 1943)-- aside from other vehicles of the same weight or that B.A. half-track...

logistics and support are very important arent they JoeD
(wow, even my job was logistics, it takes alot of personnel to keep an jet in the air! Bob Smart can agree to that...)


You know, did the Russians even have any type of recovery vehicles, etc. for their heavy armor? What did they have for heavy maintenance and logistics, etc.?
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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:20 am
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Hey,

Part of my last real job believe it or not was advising logistics and maintenance, go figure. Then again, Chevy Pick-ups and old 2 1/2 tons along with AK's, PPSK's and Glocks aren't that difficult to maintain/ track, or you'd think so Rolling Eyes

Those big old SdKfz 7's were pretty BA. But when those Tigers starting coming out they were kinda over taxed. Seen pictures of 3-4 doing recovery of a single tank. Makes you appreciate the M88 all the more.

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:22 am
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

- SHAWN


logistics and support are very important arent they JoeD
(wow, even my job was logistics, it takes alot of personnel to keep an jet in the air! Bob Smart can agree to that...)


Nah - It takes a lot of folks to Get a plane ready to get in the air There is only one person that can Keep an airplane (at least an Eagle) in the air that's the pilot! No matter how how many people get it ready, the pilot seems to be able to break it all by himself Mr. Green

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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:41 am
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Can't say that about a tank,

It takes a crew to break a tank, crew of idiots that is. But as always, the driver get's the blame. There is always that one crew in the company/troop that everyone knows is the accident waiting to happen. Some how the stars lined up or the moon was in sync with Venus or whatever, but you just wonder why they came together. They are the crew that gets lost at night going to get fuel (which is only 2 k's down the road), they are the crew who manages to throw track at the front gate as the lead tank during an alert, they are the crew that does their best Wil E. Coyote imitation by leaving the Bore sight device in the tube when firing, They are the crew who lost control and drive through someone's house, they are the crew that launches a round out of the impact area, They are the crew that fires a main gun round into their battle position berm, It goes on and on.

I'm sure Dontos can add more to the list Laughing .

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Dontos
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:55 am
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

WHAT...THAT WASN't MY FAULT!!! It was the damn driver...hahaha

As a tanker, I loved the British SAS saying 'Who Dares Wins'. But Joe is right about 'THAT' crew.

The worst being 'first on the plane home from NTC' while someone else turns in their tank. Shocked

Don
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Joe_D
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:03 am
Post subject: Re: Elefant tank overhaul history

Yeah,

And usually that TC ends up with a new job fitting his skill set. Can any one say "Post Clean-Up" or "R and U". If the command does their job he'll never get a tank again. Unfortunately these guys are like weeds. New command comes in and they are reborn out of a perceived shortage of SSG's. Give me a high speed Buck Sergeant any time over one of these re-treads. Nothing worse than being a gunner and having to train your tank commander Evil or Very Mad

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