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Chicago Trip Report
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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binder001
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Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 2:34 am Post subject: Chicago Trip Report
Did a hort trip to a toy oldier meet near Chicago. The weather was often cloudy and I had many activities, but I did get to follow up on three item from the Register. First, I couldn't find any M4A3E8 near Jefferon, IA at the Spring Lake County Park. Second, I dd get a chance to visit the M46 at Northlake, IL. She is in very good shape and nicely displayed.

binder001
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Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 2:37 am Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
I also went down to South Holland to see the M4A3 105mm Howitzer, HVSS tank there. he has a serial number on the left rear = 18780 (if I read correctly through all the years of paint). Tank has been painted and cared for - looks nice! I'll be adding this one to my Picasa web album. Gary B. Last edited by binder001 on Tue Sep 28, 2010 1:00 am; edited 1 time in total

TrevorLarkum
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Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
Good results! _________________ Trevor Dr Trevor Larkum Preserved Tanks: PreservedTanks.com Armour Archive: ArmourArchive.co.uk EVs

Kurt_Laughlin
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Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 1:42 am
Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report

Thanks Gary!

It's almost certain that this tank was built as HVSS because the Army disliked 105s and would not have converted it to HVSS after the war. In fact, it's surprising that this one still exists because most were converted to 76mm tanks with M4A2 turrets. The range of serials for M4A3(105) HVSS tanks was 57623-58207, 64000-64131, 65258-65713, 72892-73435, 74046-75067. What you read was some paint-globbed version of these.

KL

binder001
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Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 12:50 pm
Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report

Thanks Kurt,

I agree that she seems built as HVSS, the return rollers were bolted to the hull (I actually remembered to look for a change).

Oddly, the "one" as a first digit was the one I was confident of Smile

Fortunately I took a photo, albeit a poor one, of the number stamping. I'll look again when I am transferring the photos from the camera to the primary computer - I originally posted via my wife's laptop unit.

GB

PS - now that it's too late - where would I have looked forthe s/n on the M46?

binder001
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Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 5:34 pm Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
I posted about 53 photos of the M4A3 105mm HVSS to my Picasa album. Here is a direct link to a shot of the number stamped into the rear of the hull. picasaweb.google.com/g...6754201074 I am open to other interpretations of this number GB

Kurt_Laughlin
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Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 11:57 pm Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
Gary, I saw the pics you posted. That looks to be some individual part's ID. On large hatch, welded hulls, the rear tow lugs are the place to look. On an M46 it is the fron lug (like an M60). I have the SN for the Nothlake tank as 246. KL

vagabond
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Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2010 2:05 am Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
These are shots of the tow lug on the M46 taken 8/2/10. I had to crank up the contrast to get the numbers to show. Looks like 248 to me. What do you all think? Cheers!

binder001
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Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2010 2:59 pm
Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report

I noticed that the M4A3 105mm tanks in Tekama, NE, Forest City, IA and South Holland, IL have turret cast by Continental Foundry & Machine Company, Wheeling, West Virginia. They have a pronounced offset of the commander's cupola creating a "lip" at the edge of the turret. Does anybody know if this was unique to the Wheeling turrets or was there a general mofification to the turret (perhaps to get another couple inches of room inside?).

Gary B.

Kurt_Laughlin
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:17 am
Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report

As best I can tell the lip was added to provide additional protection to the cupola. Without it the cupola/turret joint is fully exposed. This was a late feature on the casting. It's more likely to be on M4A3(105)s because they were made for two months after the M4A3(75) Ws. I imagine that the other turret foundries supplying these turrets also had this feature, if there were any left at that date.

KL

Dontos
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:37 am Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
The Iraqi/Iranian M4A3(105) HVSS, captured in OIF 1 is SN 72312. It is currently in RMP. Regards Don

Kurt_Laughlin
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:11 pm Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
- Dontos The Iraqi/Iranian M4A3(105) HVSS, captured in OIF 1 is SN 72312. It is currently in RMP. Don, can you check that SN? My records show 72312 was assigned to a Fisher M4A2(76) on an order that was cancelled. Also, does this tank have the modified turret contour around the cupola that Gary mentioned? Thx, KL

Dontos
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
Kurt That is a good SN. I just got back from a quick trip to RMP. I climbed thru the interior and was able to get some good SN (stamped & Cast) photos. I'll post those in a new thread. Regards Don

Alf_Adams
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 8:18 pm
Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report

The discussion about the lip on the edge of the M4(105)HVSS turret got me thinking about the ones that I just saw on my fall trip. So here are a couple more shots of the examples in Tomahawk and Wabeno Wisconsin. It appears that one has the lip and one doesn't. If it helps I can also post pictures of the hull and turret casting numbers for the Wabeno tank. It was raining on the day I was in Tomahawk, and I decided not to climb on a very slippery tank to get the numbers.

Kurt_Laughlin
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Posted: Fri Oct 01, 2010 8:32 pm Post subject: Re: Chicago Trip Report
Alf, pix would help, even ones of the rear or sides of the T-hawk turret can show if they have the "cross-hairs" seen on CFM-W turrets. KL

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