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Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:29 am Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- JimWeb

- Doug_Kibbey

Your avatar makes you look much younger.

D.

For some reason it reminds me of a pest controller...

In a manner of speaking, you're correct. Wink

JimWeb · Posted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:01 am Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- Doug_Kibbey

Your avatar makes you look much younger.

D.

For some reason it reminds me of a pest controller...

Michel_Krauss · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:56 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

Hi folks,

- the_sahdock

a kind of Maginot line

that is rigth in the sense that it was an fixed defence line

For everything else you cannot compare the IJssellinie with the Maginot line or even the German Siegfriedlinie (in English the Westwall Confused

)

The IJssellinie is more an thin line of fixed emplacements that are mainly placed at strategic locations
For example river crossing or along main roads

If some one needs an challenge
In google maps: N 52 1.202, E 6 7.67
There will be an marker and you able to move to the road with streetview
If you are standing on the road start moving in the direction of the bridge
You will see an Firefly turret standig on the left side of the road, overlooking the bridge and the mainroad

Michel

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:02 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- Joe_D

Hey, that pretty close to my age, but the concept is quite valid.

Joe,

Your avatar makes you look much younger. Wink

D.

Joe_D · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:54 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

I forgot about the "Flood" capability

Would make a very tough nut to crack with those turrets over watching.

some 50 year old......

Hey, that pretty close to my age, but the concept is quite valid. Although I'd like to think my skills and hopefully my physical condition would still get me a Tank if all hell broke loose Laughing

There are still plenty extra in the US sitting around.

L.Delsing · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Feb 10, 2006 Posts: 960

An area of 3-15 km width would be inudated in front of the turrets and other parts of the IJssellinie. From the early sixties it was not used in the NATO defence strategy anymore, although the systems (locks, dams etc)were maintained for sometime.

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

Makes sense. A trail of frags as a "contact breaker" might figure well into the plans. Laughing

JimWeb · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:29 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- Doug_Kibbey

Was there typically any "alternative" escape routes from these apart from the visible hatches?

Being overrun in one of these while rendered inoperable would be most unenviable.

The usual 'escape route' was a box of smoke grenades I think Smile

JimWeb · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

The point of these things (IMHO) is that they use up useful obsolete tank turrets that you can stick some 50 year old reservist in that actually served on the tank version with minimal training. Put them in a nice defilade position and they can be quite effective - not so sure about the wide open dutch countryside though....

While a few countries are busy removing/downgrading them the concept isn't entirely dead and is still used in some countries. Some of Georgia's recent purchases tend to give one the impression that they are busy building them even today.

Joe_D · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:12 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

The whole concept of static defense just don't sit right with me, especially when your weapon doesn't have a significant range improvement over your adversary.

Much rather fight it out in a tank using the local terrain. That way I can pop a few rounds, displace to another position, pop some more, move, and so on. Never giving them a chance to fix me. Stay too long in one place and a volley of 125mm will get you the next time you expose yourself to engage. Things get too hot displace to the next line of defense, hoping you don't get whacked by your own when doing the passage of lines. Usually you get overrun but if you take out enough (5-8 depending on where you were), you've done your job.

Memories of a Cold War Tanker training for the Soviet or North Korean Horde Wink

.

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:56 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

Was there typically any "alternative" escape routes from these apart from the visible hatches?

Being overrun in one of these while rendered inoperable would be most unenviable.

JimWeb · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:43 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- bsmart

Is the second picture a Ram turret?

Yes - sat on top of a RAM tank as well albeit a little stripped...

bsmart · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:04 pm Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- the_shadock

- bsmart

What is an ijssellinie turret?

that's a turret that was installed on the IJssel linie ( a kind of Maginot line built in Netherlands between 1950 and 1955):

Is the second picture a Ram turret?

JimWeb · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 9:19 am Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

THe thing that attracted my eye was the welded up Co-ax mg port. I am almost sure I saw something similar on a couple of of those turrets about 15 years ago..

the_shadock · Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 7:36 am Post subject: Re: Axvall armour museum

- bsmart

What is an ijssellinie turret?

that's a turret that was installed on the IJssel linie ( a kind of Maginot line built in Netherlands between 1950 and 1955):

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