±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 774
Total: 774
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Downloads
02: News Archive
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Home
07: Photo Gallery
08: Home
09: Photo Gallery
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Photo Gallery
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: News Archive
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Home
22: Photo Gallery
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Photo Gallery
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Photo Gallery
30: Community Forums
31: Photo Gallery
32: Your Account
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Home
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Home
40: Photo Gallery
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: News Archive
45: Downloads
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Photo Gallery
52: Photo Gallery
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Home
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Home
62: Home
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Photo Gallery
67: Community Forums
68: Photo Gallery
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Community Forums
72: Photo Gallery
73: Home
74: Community Forums
75: Photo Gallery
76: Home
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: CPGlang
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Downloads
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Community Forums
88: Your Account
89: Your Account
90: Community Forums
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Photo Gallery
95: Community Forums
96: Photo Gallery
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Member Screenshots
105: Photo Gallery
106: Home
107: Home
108: Photo Gallery
109: Community Forums
110: CPGlang
111: Home
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: CPGlang
115: Your Account
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Member Screenshots
119: Member Screenshots
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Photo Gallery
123: Community Forums
124: Your Account
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Home
132: Community Forums
133: Photo Gallery
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: Member Screenshots
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Home
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Home
146: Community Forums
147: Photo Gallery
148: Photo Gallery
149: Community Forums
150: CPGlang
151: Community Forums
152: Photo Gallery
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Home
160: Community Forums
161: Photo Gallery
162: Community Forums
163: Community Forums
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Photo Gallery
167: Downloads
168: Community Forums
169: Member Screenshots
170: Home
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Downloads
175: Member Screenshots
176: Photo Gallery
177: News Archive
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Home
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Downloads
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Photo Gallery
187: Downloads
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Photo Gallery
192: Community Forums
193: Photo Gallery
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: News Archive
199: Community Forums
200: Photo Gallery
201: Photo Gallery
202: Photo Gallery
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: CPGlang
206: Photo Gallery
207: Home
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Community Forums
211: CPGlang
212: Photo Gallery
213: Photo Gallery
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Home
217: Photo Gallery
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Photo Gallery
223: Community Forums
224: Community Forums
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: CPGlang
229: Community Forums
230: Member Screenshots
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Community Forums
236: Community Forums
237: Home
238: Downloads
239: Photo Gallery
240: CPGlang
241: Community Forums
242: Photo Gallery
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Statistics
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Community Forums
249: Photo Gallery
250: Community Forums
251: Community Forums
252: Photo Gallery
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Photo Gallery
259: Photo Gallery
260: Photo Gallery
261: Community Forums
262: CPGlang
263: Community Forums
264: Downloads
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Home
269: News Archive
270: Home
271: Downloads
272: Photo Gallery
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Downloads
278: Photo Gallery
279: Photo Gallery
280: Photo Gallery
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Member Screenshots
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Community Forums
290: Home
291: Community Forums
292: Home
293: Photo Gallery
294: Community Forums
295: Home
296: Downloads
297: Community Forums
298: Photo Gallery
299: Photo Gallery
300: Photo Gallery
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Community Forums
304: Photo Gallery
305: Photo Gallery
306: Home
307: Downloads
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Community Forums
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: News Archive
316: Photo Gallery
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Photo Gallery
320: Community Forums
321: Downloads
322: CPGlang
323: Photo Gallery
324: Your Account
325: Community Forums
326: Downloads
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Your Account
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Photo Gallery
333: Community Forums
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Home
346: Community Forums
347: Photo Gallery
348: Home
349: Community Forums
350: Photo Gallery
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Photo Gallery
356: Community Forums
357: Home
358: Downloads
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Community Forums
363: Home
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Community Forums
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Community Forums
374: Community Forums
375: Photo Gallery
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Home
379: Community Forums
380: Home
381: Photo Gallery
382: Community Forums
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Community Forums
386: Statistics
387: Photo Gallery
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Photo Gallery
392: Community Forums
393: Home
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Community Forums
399: Photo Gallery
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Community Forums
407: Downloads
408: Photo Gallery
409: Community Forums
410: Photo Gallery
411: Community Forums
412: Community Forums
413: Downloads
414: Photo Gallery
415: Community Forums
416: Community Forums
417: Home
418: Photo Gallery
419: Community Forums
420: Member Screenshots
421: Community Forums
422: Photo Gallery
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Home
426: Community Forums
427: Community Forums
428: Home
429: Community Forums
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Home
433: Community Forums
434: Community Forums
435: Community Forums
436: Community Forums
437: Community Forums
438: Your Account
439: Community Forums
440: Community Forums
441: CPGlang
442: News
443: Photo Gallery
444: Home
445: Statistics
446: Community Forums
447: Community Forums
448: Community Forums
449: Your Account
450: Community Forums
451: Community Forums
452: Your Account
453: Community Forums
454: Photo Gallery
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Downloads
459: Community Forums
460: Photo Gallery
461: Community Forums
462: Photo Gallery
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Home
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: News Archive
470: Community Forums
471: Community Forums
472: Member Screenshots
473: Home
474: Photo Gallery
475: Home
476: Home
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Photo Gallery
480: Home
481: Photo Gallery
482: Home
483: Photo Gallery
484: Member Screenshots
485: Community Forums
486: Member Screenshots
487: Downloads
488: Community Forums
489: Photo Gallery
490: CPGlang
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Downloads
494: Community Forums
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Community Forums
498: Photo Gallery
499: Community Forums
500: Photo Gallery
501: Downloads
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Member Screenshots
505: Community Forums
506: Community Forums
507: Downloads
508: Community Forums
509: Photo Gallery
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: Community Forums
513: Your Account
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Photo Gallery
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: Member Screenshots
522: Downloads
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Community Forums
528: Photo Gallery
529: Photo Gallery
530: Community Forums
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Community Forums
537: Member Screenshots
538: Member Screenshots
539: Home
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Home
544: Photo Gallery
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Photo Gallery
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Home
554: Photo Gallery
555: Home
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Home
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Home
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Community Forums
572: CPGlang
573: Community Forums
574: Community Forums
575: Community Forums
576: Community Forums
577: Photo Gallery
578: Home
579: Downloads
580: Member Screenshots
581: Community Forums
582: Community Forums
583: Photo Gallery
584: Community Forums
585: Community Forums
586: Statistics
587: Photo Gallery
588: Community Forums
589: Community Forums
590: Home
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Home
594: Your Account
595: Home
596: Statistics
597: Photo Gallery
598: Community Forums
599: Community Forums
600: Home
601: Photo Gallery
602: Community Forums
603: Community Forums
604: Photo Gallery
605: Community Forums
606: Community Forums
607: Community Forums
608: Community Forums
609: Home
610: Community Forums
611: Community Forums
612: Community Forums
613: Community Forums
614: Photo Gallery
615: Community Forums
616: Downloads
617: Community Forums
618: Community Forums
619: Community Forums
620: Community Forums
621: Community Forums
622: Photo Gallery
623: Community Forums
624: Home
625: Community Forums
626: Home
627: Community Forums
628: Community Forums
629: Community Forums
630: Community Forums
631: Community Forums
632: Community Forums
633: Community Forums
634: Photo Gallery
635: Community Forums
636: Downloads
637: Community Forums
638: Community Forums
639: Photo Gallery
640: Community Forums
641: Member Screenshots
642: Member Screenshots
643: Community Forums
644: Photo Gallery
645: Home
646: Community Forums
647: Community Forums
648: Home
649: Community Forums
650: Photo Gallery
651: Community Forums
652: Home
653: Community Forums
654: Community Forums
655: Home
656: Community Forums
657: Home
658: Community Forums
659: Home
660: Community Forums
661: Photo Gallery
662: Photo Gallery
663: Community Forums
664: Community Forums
665: Home
666: Community Forums
667: Home
668: Community Forums
669: LinkToUs
670: Community Forums
671: Photo Gallery
672: Home
673: Community Forums
674: Community Forums
675: Home
676: Photo Gallery
677: Photo Gallery
678: CPGlang
679: Community Forums
680: Community Forums
681: Community Forums
682: Community Forums
683: Downloads
684: Community Forums
685: CPGlang
686: Community Forums
687: Photo Gallery
688: Home
689: Community Forums
690: CPGlang
691: Community Forums
692: Community Forums
693: Photo Gallery
694: Community Forums
695: Community Forums
696: Community Forums
697: Community Forums
698: Community Forums
699: Photo Gallery
700: News Archive
701: Statistics
702: Community Forums
703: Community Forums
704: Photo Gallery
705: Community Forums
706: Community Forums
707: Downloads
708: Home
709: Community Forums
710: Home
711: Community Forums
712: Community Forums
713: Community Forums
714: Community Forums
715: Community Forums
716: Photo Gallery
717: CPGlang
718: Photo Gallery
719: Community Forums
720: Community Forums
721: Community Forums
722: Community Forums
723: Community Forums
724: Your Account
725: Community Forums
726: Community Forums
727: Community Forums
728: Home
729: Community Forums
730: Community Forums
731: Community Forums
732: Community Forums
733: Community Forums
734: Community Forums
735: Community Forums
736: Community Forums
737: Photo Gallery
738: Photo Gallery
739: Community Forums
740: Member Screenshots
741: Photo Gallery
742: Photo Gallery
743: Community Forums
744: Photo Gallery
745: Community Forums
746: Downloads
747: Home
748: Community Forums
749: Community Forums
750: Statistics
751: Community Forums
752: Home
753: Community Forums
754: Your Account
755: Your Account
756: Community Forums
757: Community Forums
758: Community Forums
759: Community Forums
760: Community Forums
761: Community Forums
762: Community Forums
763: Community Forums
764: Home
765: Community Forums
766: Member Screenshots
767: Community Forums
768: Community Forums
769: Photo Gallery
770: Community Forums
771: Community Forums
772: Community Forums
773: Photo Gallery
774: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
geoffsteer
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 114

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:18 pm
Post subject: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Hi Guys-
Just when you thought I could not think of another railway question, yet another comes to my pointy little noodle! I've been studying all the photos I can find of freight on flatcars and, I cannot see what holds said freight in place. If the freight is vehicles, I can see blocks/chocks placed front and back of the tires, what is holding them (block/chocks) in place? On some, not all, flat bed trucks, I can see tie down rings and places to drop a peg to stop a block from slipping. I dont see anything like this on any railway flatcars. On the sides of the Dragon flatcars are rings which, obviously, are meant to serve as tie down points for frieght although, these would not help to hold wheel blocks/chocks. I mean to say, the railway flatbed is featureless so, if you put a block in front of a vehicle's wheel, what is there (on the flatbed) to keep the block from sliding?
With thanks-
Geoff Steer [;-{/) Rolling Eyes
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:30 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- geoffsteer
Hi Guys-
Just when you thought I could not think of another railway question, yet another comes to my pointy little noodle! I've been studying all the photos I can find of freight on flatcars and, I cannot see what holds said freight in place. If the freight is vehicles, I can see blocks/chocks placed front and back of the tires, what is holding them (block/chocks) in place? On some, not all, flat bed trucks, I can see tie down rings and places to drop a peg to stop a block from slipping. I dont see anything like this on any railway flatcars. On the sides of the Dragon flatcars are rings which, obviously, are meant to serve as tie down points for frieght although, these would not help to hold wheel blocks/chocks. I mean to say, the railway flatbed is featureless so, if you put a block in front of a vehicle's wheel, what is there (on the flatbed) to keep the block from sliding?
With thanks-
Geoff Steer [;-{/) roll
It probably varies from country to country based on local custom. In The US on some older flat cars they would nail the blocks into the wood deck

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:30 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

They are could be nailed into the flatcar, or the weight of the vehicle applies pressure. Chains can be applied to the tow hooks or around axles and then ratched down, to keep the vehicle from shifting.

HTH
Don

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:35 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Depends on who you are talking about.

In the US, railroad rules require chains fore and aft. Depending on the type of flatcar and what you are loading on it (wheel or track, etc.), it may also require chocks and bracing. The chocks and bracing are normally nailed to the car decking using long spikes. The rules are fairly strict, and we always wondered if the railcars were actually going to be upside down at some point.

In Europe, they don't always require chains to secure the load. This may have something to do with the generally smoother roadbeds on Euro railways, and may also reflect the generally shorter distances for rail movements in Europe. I believe that the distance of the move can come into play; i.e., shorter moves require less extensive tiedown or blocking. Perhaps some of the folks here have experience with military rail movements in Europe and can comment further.

I recall reading that German armor was only secured by chocks fore and aft, during WWII. I'm less sure, but I believe that still holds true.

C

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
geoffsteer
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 114

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:39 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?Thanks Guys.

Hi Don & Bob-
Nailed down? I must admit, I never thought of that, probably to simple and obvious. On the one hand, nailing down the blocks would cause wear and tear on the flatbed's wooden floor. On the other hand, it would not cause sufficient wear and tear to force the replacement of the wooden floor on anything like a frequent amount of occasions. Actually, being able to nail down blocks is most likely the reason for the flatbed having a wooden floor in the first place.
Thanks for your help, Don and Bob-
Geoff Steer [;-{/)
Back to top
View user's profile
L.Delsing
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 10, 2006
Posts: 960

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:14 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

For Leopards and YPR-765's you need a total of 8 chocks / blocks. Two in front of the track, two at the back against the track and and then 4 chocks / blocks to prevent sideways sliding. These will be placed at the inside of the track under the first and last roadwheels. So it can not move forwards, backwards or sidewards.

These last mentioned chocks / blocks are hanging at the back of the turret of the Leopard 2A5/A6.

Correct placement of these things is checked by railroadpersonnel and if OK nothing more is required. Of course the parking brake of the vehicle must be engaged.

Regards,
Lesley
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:19 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- C_Sherman
Depends on who you are talking about.

In the US, railroad rules require chains fore and aft. Depending on the type of flatcar and what you are loading on it (wheel or track, etc.), it may also require chocks and bracing. The chocks and bracing are normally nailed to the car decking using long spikes. The rules are fairly strict, and we always wondered if the railcars were actually going to be upside down at some point.

In Europe, they don't always require chains to secure the load. This may have something to do with the generally smoother roadbeds on Euro railways, and may also reflect the generally shorter distances for rail movements in Europe. I believe that the distance of the move can come into play; i.e., shorter moves require less extensive tiedown or blocking. Perhaps some of the folks here have experience with military rail movements in Europe and can comment further.

I recall reading that German armor was only secured by chocks fore and aft, during WWII. I'm less sure, but I believe that still holds true.

C


Are flatcars loaded with vehicles ever 'humped'? ( Do they do that in Europe at all?) I know some types of cars are labeled 'DO NOT HUMP' and I always figured it was because of the shock loads involved in the process.

For those that don't know Hump yards are freight classification yards that are used to make up and break down trains. It centers around a large 'hill'. The train is pushed up the back side of the hill (or hump) by a switching locomotive. At the top each car is disconnected in turn and allowed to drift down the front slope where the tower personnel watch it and throw various switches routing the car into the stub track where they want it. I've seen a hump yard that had several cars all rolling down the slope at the same time with the appropriate switch being thrown just before the car gets to the point of the switch and each car slamming into the cars already on the stub when it reached the end of the run. There are brake plates along the rails that can be used to control the cars speed as it rolls down the slope but I understand that there is a reluctance to use them any more than absolutely neccesary since it slows the process of building trains.

If the cars have to be 'humpable' that could be another reason the more extensive chaining is required in the U.S.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:23 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

LOL....okay .

Its my understanding that it is due to the poorer condition of the US rail system.

European Rail system is far better maintained.

Don

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:31 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Here is a photo I took in 1993 at Ft Hood. We were railloading to Ft Bliss and Operation Roving Sands.

This is a typical tie-down scenario in the States.



Don

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:51 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- bsmart

Are flatcars loaded with vehicles ever 'humped'? ( Do they do that in Europe at all?) I know some types of cars are labeled 'DO NOT HUMP' and I always figured it was because of the shock loads involved in the process.


Hi all,

Bob, military vehicles are nearly always carried as 'unit trains'* rather than a collection of individual cars. This is because most equipment moves more than one or two vehicles/railcars, but rather a full unit's worth of vehicles. So 'humping' is unlikely, since 'unit trains' usuually have a dedicated locomotive and the cars are rarely uncoupled from each other.

According to the schools and manuals, the chains, etc. are required in the US because the US rail system tolerates a greater amount of variation in roadbeds...in other words, our roads are bumpier. There are a variety of reasons for this, not just "lower quality".

The rules differ for military/DOD steel deck flatcars (chains only) and standard wood deck cars (chains and chocks). The DOD flatcars are designed to use the chains in the most efficient way, and are often the only way to move tanks and BFVs. What Dontos shows below are DOD steel deck flats, so no blocking/bracing is needed.

The rules are very tight, because of past experience and previous problems. For example, most people don't know that a rubber tire sidewall rubbing against a wood bracing block can actually start a fire...but it has, and it can. So there are requirements for separating the two (tarpaper, believe it or not). I've seen pictures of what happens when a vehicle or part of a vehicle (turret, crane, cargo, etc.) comes adrift during rail transport, and it ain't pretty. If you are lucky, no one gets kilt...and the best result is just extensive damage to unit property. Unlucky? Well, that can get really ugly.

C

* A 'unit train' is a railroad term for a train that has only one or two types of cars, that travel as a unit. In the western US, you can often see unit trains made up of 50-70 hopper cars, that carry coal from mines to power plants. There are other types, too.

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:55 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

I love this board....I'm learning a ton of stuff about trains here that I never even thought of!

...just sayin'.....

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 10:23 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

"According to the schools and manuals, the chains, etc. are required in the US because the US rail system tolerates a greater amount of variation in roadbeds...in other words, our roads are bumpier. There are a variety of reasons for this, not just "lower quality"."

Jeff Button - Make sure you pay attention in class. You are going to be our designated transportation expert in the future.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 10:32 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Hi Folks!

As best I can remember, every rail movement I was part of, the requiered number of flat cars would be placed against a ramp at the end of the rail line and each vehicle would drive from the ramp crossed all the flat cars until it reached the one it would be traveling on.

My 2 cents,
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
binder001
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 363

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:17 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

[quote="C_Sherman"][quote="bsmart"]
I've seen pictures of what happens when a vehicle or part of a vehicle (turret, crane, cargo, etc.) comes adrift during rail transport, and it ain't pretty. If you are lucky, no one gets kilt...and the best result is just extensive damage to unit property. Unlucky? Well, that can get really ugly.

Back in the late 1960s I remember TV footage of a "problem" on the old Rock Island Railroad thru Lincoln, NE. The showed what happened when the barrel of an "Army tank" swung free and was perpendicular to the tracks. In fact the "tank" was an M109 SP 155 and that great big tube was knocking over signs and signals all thru the town until someone could get the train to stop. The RR had to reset most of their crossing signs and signals on that side of the right-of-way!
Back to top
View user's profile
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:46 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

In the 80's, in Germany, a situation occurred when the unsecured gun tube of a US M60 clipped a pole and then spinning wildly, slammed into a tunnel embankment causing the tank to dislodge and then the train derailed.

Not sure of exactly when, but 'rumor' had it ocurring in the Frankfurt (South) rail tunnel as the train headed to Graffenwohr.

Having been in 3rd Armored Div, I rode the train on many occassions and everytime we went thru that particular tunnel there was mere inches clearence, between the tanks and the tunnel.

On one occassion, we were held on a side rail near the Frankfurt Haupt Bahn Hof, because it was believed (by parties unknown) that our M1A1's would hit the tunnel walls. 9 hour delay, seemed a lifetime.

Don

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum