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bsmart

- the_shadock

to be more complete on the answer, only the small hatch M4A3s and the M4A4s have wide hood castings on the front hull. M4s and M4A2s have the narrow hood castings. So, the Sherman displayed ouside is an M4A3 or an M4A4.

You can see that it has a fitting for the 4″ bomb throwers on the turret side, and that is a typical British fitting, so this tank was used by British troops during WW2. Then you can tell that it is an M4A4 because the British only had very few M4A3s.

P-O

Okay - But I've spent some time looking at what little can be seen of the road wheel spacing (The best identifier I know of for M4A4) I can't decide. Now that vehicle is pretty distinctive with the shattered barrel. So does anyone have a good side shot of that vehicle? Or better yet an engine deck photo?

Garry_Redmon

It's mislabeled. See this link from my web site.

armorfortheages.com/GG...tsPage.htm

Go to bottom of page. The spacing on bogies is more evident. I identified it as an M4A4, but I have been wrong before. Really.

the_shadock

Curiously, I've not found a lot of pictures showing the rear of the M4A4 at Fort Knox, here's one by Gary Binder :

part of the game was to identify the model of the tank without a side or a rear view Wink

P-O

Geoff_walden · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 26, 2006 Posts: 133

- Garry_Redmon

Unfortunately this is not the only example of incorrect displays made by the staff. The volunteers have made note of them and will discuss with the staff at our next meeting.

I hope they changed the label on that Luftwaffe dagger, that they were calling an SS dagger. Wink

TrevorLarkum

Good to see recent pictures.

bsmart

- Garry_Redmon

It's mislabeled. See this link from my web site.

armorfortheages.com/GG...tsPage.htm

Go to bottom of page. The spacing on bogies is more evident. I identified it as an M4A4, but I have been wrong before. Really.

Yea given the clearer view of the bogies I'll agree with M4A4. I believe many M4A4s were used for Stateside training by US forces then (as someone else mentioned) refurbed for reissue to allies when the U.S. units deployed

Kurt_Laughlin · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 577

- bsmart

- the_shadock

#36 is not an M4A2....

anyway the displays are interesting. Thanks for the photos !!

P-O

I'm not doubting you but how can you tell from that angle?

Going further, the shape of the driver's hood castings, the shape of the glacis antenna bracket casting, the shape of the bow MG casting. Also, the gun shield lifting eyes (cast-in) seem to be peculiar to M4A4s.

There are weld scars on the glacis indicative of the British track stowage racks, so I would say for certain that this is an ex-Commonwealth vehicle. Many went directly to Lend-Lease without being used stateside.

KL

Garry_Redmon

Rumor has it that it was a British vehicle knocked out at D-Day (or in the Normandy area) and was used as a range target post-war. How it got to Fort Knox I have no idea. Maybe Dontos can provide more info.

Dontos

I heard it was knocked out during D-Day landings and a hard target by the French. It was 'traded' to the Patton Museum in the early 90's.

One of the more outlandish 'rumors' I heard, was that it was a 4th AD tank, taken from the battlefield area where Sadowski's Medal of Honor actions were recorded. (It was related to me from a supposed 'expert' in Armor....LOL!!)

Regards
Don

the_shadock

I can teel for sure that this tank saw no active duty in the French Army in the 1950s, but it was possibly a target range, I don't know.

P-O

chrisballance · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Mar 16, 2010 Posts: 31

As a reply to Koluchiy, there is at least open PzIV inside at Ft.Benning. I didn't get a direct photo of it this winter, but you can see it in the background.

Chris

Dontos

That's the cut-away Panzer IV that Ft Knox got from APG in 2006 or so. It obviously moved to Ft Benning during the big move.

Regards
Don

the_shadock

looking at the album, I wonder how they managed to find a spare turret for the Renault FT hull.

P-O

chrisballance · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Mar 16, 2010 Posts: 31

I found a better PzIV photo on my phone and upload the rest of my Armor School visit camera photos to a smugmug gallery found here:

dubliner75.smugmug.com...;k=ffs67G6

Dontos

- the_shadock

looking at the album, I wonder how they managed to find a spare turret for the Renault FT hull.

P-O

I think that's the turret from the 2nd FT that came out of Afghanistan back in 02/03.

Regards
Don

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