Skip to main Skip to content Skip to menu

Com-Central.net

`±`Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

`±`User Info-big

Welcome Anonymous

Membership:

Latest: HighestAce

New Today: 0

New Yesterday: 0

Overall: 6648

People Online:

Members: 0

Visitors: 2843

Total: 2843

Who Is Where:

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!

Forum FAQ

Moderators

Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2 Next

Forum Index › AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic

Author

Message

the_shadock
Power User

Offline
Joined: May 27, 2006
Posts: 2865
Location: Normandy, France

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:44 am Post subject: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
Hello, I would like to check facts. I received an email containing this picture, and the parti circled in red seem to prove that Kevin Wheatcroft's Hetzer is a G-13. Is this enough to identify for sure the model of the tank? Thanks !! _________________ soldat_ryan @ hotmail.com Looking for photos of Sherman manufacturer's plates

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:57 am Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
Do we have any pictures showing the gun, near the mantlet? Masimo

Walter
Power User

Offline
Joined: Mar 09, 2010
Posts: 618
Location: Arnhem

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:40 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
I have a picture from upfront,but I am not allowed to put it on the internet.Will send you this in your mail Massimo Walter

earlymb
Power User

Offline
Joined: Jan 30, 2011
Posts: 101

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:07 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
Very interesting. Even if it has or had a Saurer engine, it could still be a WW2 Hetzer modified to G13 spec, if I understand correctly?

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:13 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
- earlymb Very interesting. Even if it has or had a Saurer engine, it could still be a WW2 Hetzer modified to G13 spec, if I understand correctly? It depends on the definition of G-13 We discussed the topic quite a few times in the past. Anyway, the Saurer engine was added in Switzerland, some time after the tanks left their Czechoslovakian factory Massimo

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:25 pm
Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13

Thanks for the picture Walter! It seems it has a StuK 40 gun, but the angle isn't the best, so I can't be 100% sure.

From behind it doesn't have the "bump", at the top left of the rear sloped plate that is typical of G-13s with Saurer engines. You can see what I am talking about here:

G-13 Panzerjäger by Massimo Foti, on Flickr

I have a pretty strong feeling it's a G-13 with a gasoline engine, but I need additional pictures with the gun to be sure.

Massimo

vmmv1
Power User

Offline
Joined: Feb 13, 2006
Posts: 75
Location: virginia

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:15 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
gun is irrelevant to the vehicle. changing the gun after the war does not change the vehicle. Nor does changing the engine.

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:33 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
It's not like guns were changed after the war. The vehicles were assembled after the war with spare parts mostly produced during the war (with Waffenamt markings all over the place). But gun and crew layout were different. A very similar case happened for Fiat G-59 airplanes, assembled after the war from unfinished G-55 parts, using a different engine (RR Merlin vs DB-605) and guns. Massimo

Landsverk
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 10, 2010
Posts: 48

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 4:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13

If you have a "fake" vehicle you can make it look original by changing parts, but it will still be a "fake".
Happens all the time with both vehicles and Equipment. If you are honest with people telling them what you have done there is nothing wrong with this, but if you then claim that it is original it is wrong.

Thats why these questions are relevant. In Norway there was a Pz 38T for sale some time ago - a restoration project. It turned out to be a fake - a Swedish Self propelled gun SAV m/43 built by Scania in 1945 and then converted to look like a Pz 38T and together with original 38T turret it could be put up for sale as an "original" Pz 38T. If the seller is honest with you and tell you all the facts - no problem, but you will probably get more Money if you claim that it is original.

vmmv1
Power User

Offline
Joined: Feb 13, 2006
Posts: 75
Location: virginia

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 5:24 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
Guns were changed after the war, barrels wear out and need to me changed. No one was going to make the new barrels so they used what was available. There is no difference in crew layout other than two crew switched seats.

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:04 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
We had this same discussion in the past. I mentioned sources, books and respected authors. I see no point arguing, we will keep our own opinions anyway. Massimo

the_shadock
Power User

Offline
Joined: May 27, 2006
Posts: 2865
Location: Normandy, France

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:34 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
for me the question is : was it assembled post-1945 with existing parts produced during WW2, or was it completed during WW2 and modified after the war? P-O _________________ soldat_ryan @ hotmail.com Looking for photos of Sherman manufacturer's plates

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13

People like Charles K. Kliment and Vladimir Francev, plus a bunch of less-know authors already answered that question. G-13s were assembled after the war, with spare parts left behind plus some newly manufactured parts. The percentage of new parts was and will remain unclear, but pretty much everybody think it was small.

As for the story behind guns and engines, we talked about it in the past.

Massimo

the_shadock
Power User

Offline
Joined: May 27, 2006
Posts: 2865
Location: Normandy, France

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:49 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
we should do a poll about this, lol _________________ soldat_ryan @ hotmail.com Looking for photos of Sherman manufacturer's plates

Massimo_Foti
Power User

Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2008
Posts: 5397
Location: Lugano, Switzerland

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:57 pm Post subject: Re: Need help on a Hetzer / G-13
It's a topic that may have emotional or financial implications for somebody, that's why he can easily trigger extreme reactions Massimo

Forum Index › AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2

All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2 Next

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

Com-Central.net

Select Language

Login

`±`Recent Visitors

`±`User Info-big

Com-Central.net

Select Language

Login

±Recent Visitors

±User Info-big

`±`Recent Visitors

`±`User Info-big