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SFC_Jeff_Button · Posted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 10:30 pm Post subject: M50 Ontos picture location...

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I found these pictures of an M50 Ontos, but they do not tell where the pictures were taken. Does anyone know where these possibly are? While I would not want to be on the recieving end, were they really that successful? They were only in the inventory for roughly 6-7 years, correct?

Doug_Kibbey

MAN!...those gun tubes are straight! Can't possibly be a Renwal kit!

Dontos

That the T165E2 #19 at APG

Late model prototype 'ONTOS'

bsmart

That is an old picture of the Ontos on Aberdeen's now gone 'Mile of Tanks' The Mile has been gone for at least 5 years and the Ontos was very faded before that. I suspect the picture is atleast from the early 90s, maybe longer ago than that. The Ontos has been repainted and is awaiting new tracks. It has been waiting for the tracks for several years

Dontos

Jeff

Try here: Ontos History: Where are they now?

Actively fielded from 1957 till 1970. Although a couple seemed to linger till 1980 at Gitmo in Cuba.

SFC_Jeff_Button · Posted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 4:00 am Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Why would this track need new tread unless it was meant to be a runner? What happened to the 5 mi stretch? Was the boulavard removed? Were the vehicles moved elsewhere on the post? Is there a "survivor" list of Ontos out there and where to find them? Come-on Ontos, you should know these questions?!

Chris_C · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 1:24 am Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

IIRC, some drunk driver smacked into one of the vehicles, leading to the bureaucrats complaining that the tanks weren't far enough from the road, etc.

Dontos · Last edited by Dontos on Thu Feb 02, 2006 9:38 am; edited 1 time in total

- SFC_Jeff_Button

.....Is there a "survivor" list of Ontos out there and where to find them? Come-on Dontos, you should know these questions?!

Here you go:

1 ) United States Marine Corps Museum (Quantico, Virginia):
This is an M50A1 version which is in the process of a full restoration.

2 ) The Patton Museum of Cavalry & Armor (Ft Knox, Kentucky):
This is an M50A1 version which is in the process of a full operational restoration. Its completion date is currently April 2006.

3 ) Aberdeen Proving Grounds Museum (Aberdeen, Maryland):
This is a T165E2 (#19) prototype version which is in the process of a cosmetic restoration. It is currently not on public display.

4 ) American Heritage Park (El Monte, California):
This is an M50A1 version on Static display and is available for public viewing.

5 ) Rock Island Arsenal Museum (Rock Island, Illinois):
This is an M50A1 version on Static display and is available for public viewing.

6 ) Twenty Nine Palms Marine Base (29 Palms, California):
This is an M50A1 version on Static display and is available for public viewing.

7 ) Camp Atterbury Army Post (Atterbury, Indiana):
This is a T165 prototype version whch is cosmetically restored, it is on static display on the military installation.

8 ) USMC Museum of the Carolinas (Jacksonville, North Carolina:
This is an M50A1 version whch is operational, but currently not on public display.

9 ) Private Collection (Hockley, Texas):
This privately owned M50A1 version of the Ontos is operational. The owner participates in a number of voluntary public exhibits. This vehicle has been returned to its original configuration from forestry service configuration.

10 & 11) Military Vehicle Technology Foundation (Portola Valley, California):
The privately owned MVTF currently has two versions of the Ontos.
a) A T165E1 prototype version with the original GM 302ci engine. It is undergoing a total operational restoration.
b) A T165E2 prototype version of the Ontos.

12) Private Collection (Staten Island, New York):
This privately owned M50A1 version of the Ontos is being restored from its former forestry service configuration. It is currently not available for public viewing.

13) Private Collection (Vine Grove, Kentucky):
This privately owned M50A1 version of the Ontos is is planned to be restored from its current forestry service configuration. It is currently not available for public viewing.

NOTE: There are an additional '8 parts hulls' that are stripped or being stripped by private collectors to get their respective vehicles assembled.

An unknown collector reportably possesses 3 or 4 incomplete vehicles.

Also there are an additional 74(+ or -) at an undisclosed desert 'dumping' ground. These are untouchable in a closed/restricted area.

So,.....hows that?

SFC_Jeff_Button · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 5:19 am Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

I must say that I am impressed! I have printed that list and it is going into my M50 Ontos file, for future assitance on researching thses vehicles should I ever come across one. I've never seen one up close. Having seen your varied posts and resonses to posts, I must says you have one cool job at Knox. That LST building was cool, along with its belongings. I have researched everything I can here at Ft Irwin. I'm hoping that while Dougs here, we can get into the Sherman and maybe some other vehicles. If so, you can bet Doug and I will be posting lots of pictures here! I hope to see some cool stuff at China Lake as well. Once I get to Hood, I'll be very busy with my new job and getting situated, but once I am, I'll be posting quite a few pictures of the display vehicles.

Jinx · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 6:08 am Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Something i've been wanting to ask for some time, now. What is the range of traverse for the turret on the M50? The lower pair of guns look as if they might hit the hull superstructure at some angles. And does the elevation of the guns matter in this? I've only ever seen pictures of this vehicle, and i can't remember any where the guns weren't forward and level.

Chris_C · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 6:36 am Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Turret traverse is limited to 80 degrees (40 left and right).

bsmart

Number 1) was at Aberdeen for part of it's restoration a while back. Neil posted some pictures of it on the old discussion group.

3) May not be on public display but it is viewable. I take folks by the storage yard it's in on most tours I give at Aberdeen. It is waiting for new track.

This is as good as time as any to explain what happened to the old 'Mile of Tanks'

Back several years ago (more than 5) a woman viered off the divided highway and ran into the M-5 Stuart. In the accident a child was severly injured. I've been told there was some question about speed, road condition (I'm told it was a rainy night) and driver condition. None of that really matters. There was a possible lawsuit against the Army. One of the factors that came into play was that although the median strip met standards when it was built newer standards required that it be at least 6-8 feet wider to have obstructions (The tanks) in the median and provide safety zones. As part of the settlemnent the Army agreed to move the tanks from the median.

The new Mile of Tanks is off on the right side of the road as you enter the base. It isn't as impressive as the old one but that's life. The good thing about the whole situation is that when they went to move the tanks the powers that be were forced to acknowledge the deteriorating condition of the vehicles. Many have been the the REfurb process now. There was a lot of track damage discovered when the tanks were moved. The band tracks of the Ontos basically fell apart when it was moved from the mud that it was slowly sinking into as were several other vehicles. So as much as I moan about the Mile going away because the Army 'caved in' to a lawsuit It was a good thing for the vehicles overall.

The old Mile of Tanks (as it existed in the 1960s) was Very Impressive. As you came in the gate at Aberdeen you started with the WWI tanks and followed the progression of American Armor right up to the present. Sometime in the years I was away the built a new gate and the WWI and interwar tanks were put in storage as the line was shortned (They just cut off the first several tanks to make space for the construction) and the 'Mile' in it's most recent form started with WWII. SOmetime in that period the 'Main Gate' was moved to a new road in from the Interstate and the 'Mile' was on a side road for most visitors. After 9/11 the New gate off of MD 22 was closed to visitor traffic for security reasons and Maryland Blvd became the main entrance again

Jinx · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

- Chris_C

Turret traverse is limited to 80 degrees (40 left and right).

Great, thank you.

Since we're on the topic.....how about elevation/depression?

Dontos · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:49 pm Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

Elevation 20 degrees
Depression 10 degrees

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Thu Feb 02, 2006 2:51 pm Post subject: Re: M50 Ontos picture location...

...and maybe a word about the "kill radius" to the rear? Wink

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