±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 633
Total: 633
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Home
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Home
08: Community Forums
09: Treasury
10: Community Forums
11: Photo Gallery
12: Your Account
13: Community Forums
14: Home
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Photo Gallery
18: Home
19: Photo Gallery
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Home
25: Photo Gallery
26: News Archive
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Downloads
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Photo Gallery
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Home
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Photo Gallery
43: Community Forums
44: Community Forums
45: Photo Gallery
46: Community Forums
47: Home
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Downloads
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Photo Gallery
62: News Archive
63: Community Forums
64: Home
65: Photo Gallery
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Downloads
70: CPGlang
71: Home
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: CPGlang
75: Downloads
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Photo Gallery
79: Downloads
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: News Archive
86: Community Forums
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Photo Gallery
91: Community Forums
92: Home
93: Member Screenshots
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Home
97: Member Screenshots
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Photo Gallery
103: CPGlang
104: Community Forums
105: Downloads
106: Photo Gallery
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Statistics
111: Community Forums
112: CPGlang
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Your Account
119: Community Forums
120: Photo Gallery
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Downloads
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Member Screenshots
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Statistics
136: Home
137: Photo Gallery
138: Community Forums
139: CPGlang
140: Photo Gallery
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Downloads
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Photo Gallery
148: Community Forums
149: Community Forums
150: Photo Gallery
151: Home
152: Home
153: Home
154: Statistics
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Photo Gallery
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Home
162: CPGlang
163: CPGlang
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Downloads
170: Community Forums
171: Your Account
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Photo Gallery
177: Community Forums
178: Photo Gallery
179: Member Screenshots
180: Photo Gallery
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Photo Gallery
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Home
195: Community Forums
196: Photo Gallery
197: Community Forums
198: Photo Gallery
199: Home
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Home
206: CPGlang
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Photo Gallery
210: Home
211: Community Forums
212: Photo Gallery
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Community Forums
217: Photo Gallery
218: Photo Gallery
219: Community Forums
220: Photo Gallery
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Photo Gallery
226: LinkToUs
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Photo Gallery
233: Community Forums
234: Home
235: Community Forums
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Statistics
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Community Forums
249: Your Account
250: Home
251: Community Forums
252: Photo Gallery
253: Member Screenshots
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Photo Gallery
260: Community Forums
261: Photo Gallery
262: Photo Gallery
263: Downloads
264: Photo Gallery
265: Community Forums
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Downloads
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Photo Gallery
274: Downloads
275: Photo Gallery
276: Community Forums
277: Photo Gallery
278: Community Forums
279: CPGlang
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: Photo Gallery
283: Photo Gallery
284: Community Forums
285: Home
286: Home
287: Home
288: Home
289: Community Forums
290: News
291: Home
292: Home
293: Photo Gallery
294: Photo Gallery
295: Community Forums
296: Statistics
297: Your Account
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Member Screenshots
307: Community Forums
308: CPGlang
309: Community Forums
310: Photo Gallery
311: Member Screenshots
312: Community Forums
313: Member Screenshots
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Community Forums
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: News
321: Photo Gallery
322: Community Forums
323: Photo Gallery
324: Home
325: Statistics
326: Community Forums
327: Photo Gallery
328: Community Forums
329: Downloads
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Community Forums
335: Community Forums
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Your Account
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Photo Gallery
343: Statistics
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Your Account
347: Community Forums
348: Your Account
349: Member Screenshots
350: News Archive
351: Community Forums
352: Home
353: Community Forums
354: Home
355: Community Forums
356: Home
357: Home
358: Home
359: Photo Gallery
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Home
371: Community Forums
372: Downloads
373: Community Forums
374: Member Screenshots
375: Community Forums
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: News
379: Home
380: Community Forums
381: Home
382: Home
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Community Forums
386: CPGlang
387: Community Forums
388: Community Forums
389: Home
390: Community Forums
391: Photo Gallery
392: Photo Gallery
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Home
397: Community Forums
398: Downloads
399: Home
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Home
404: Community Forums
405: Photo Gallery
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Downloads
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: Photo Gallery
412: Community Forums
413: Community Forums
414: CPGlang
415: Photo Gallery
416: Home
417: Photo Gallery
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Home
423: Home
424: Community Forums
425: Home
426: Community Forums
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Your Account
433: Photo Gallery
434: Community Forums
435: Community Forums
436: Home
437: Community Forums
438: Home
439: Photo Gallery
440: Community Forums
441: Community Forums
442: Photo Gallery
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Photo Gallery
447: Community Forums
448: Home
449: Community Forums
450: Downloads
451: Photo Gallery
452: Statistics
453: Home
454: Community Forums
455: Member Screenshots
456: Photo Gallery
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Photo Gallery
460: Community Forums
461: Community Forums
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Downloads
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Community Forums
469: Member Screenshots
470: Community Forums
471: Downloads
472: Community Forums
473: Community Forums
474: Downloads
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Home
478: Community Forums
479: Community Forums
480: Home
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Photo Gallery
484: Community Forums
485: Community Forums
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Community Forums
490: Community Forums
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Community Forums
494: Photo Gallery
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Home
498: Community Forums
499: News
500: CPGlang
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: CPGlang
506: Photo Gallery
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: News Archive
510: Photo Gallery
511: Community Forums
512: Home
513: Your Account
514: Community Forums
515: Photo Gallery
516: Home
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Photo Gallery
520: Photo Gallery
521: Community Forums
522: Downloads
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Downloads
527: Community Forums
528: Community Forums
529: Community Forums
530: Photo Gallery
531: Community Forums
532: Member Screenshots
533: Statistics
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Community Forums
537: Community Forums
538: Downloads
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Community Forums
544: Photo Gallery
545: Member Screenshots
546: Photo Gallery
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Community Forums
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Member Screenshots
553: Member Screenshots
554: Community Forums
555: Community Forums
556: Downloads
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Photo Gallery
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Photo Gallery
567: Community Forums
568: Downloads
569: Community Forums
570: Home
571: Community Forums
572: Photo Gallery
573: Member Screenshots
574: Community Forums
575: Community Forums
576: Community Forums
577: Community Forums
578: Community Forums
579: Community Forums
580: Community Forums
581: Community Forums
582: CPGlang
583: Community Forums
584: Your Account
585: Community Forums
586: Community Forums
587: Home
588: Photo Gallery
589: Community Forums
590: Community Forums
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Photo Gallery
595: Community Forums
596: Downloads
597: Community Forums
598: Downloads
599: Photo Gallery
600: Community Forums
601: Community Forums
602: Photo Gallery
603: Member Screenshots
604: Community Forums
605: Community Forums
606: Community Forums
607: Community Forums
608: CPGlang
609: News Archive
610: Community Forums
611: Community Forums
612: Community Forums
613: Community Forums
614: Community Forums
615: Photo Gallery
616: Community Forums
617: Community Forums
618: Your Account
619: Community Forums
620: Your Account
621: Community Forums
622: Photo Gallery
623: Member Screenshots
624: Community Forums
625: Community Forums
626: Community Forums
627: Community Forums
628: Photo Gallery
629: Home
630: Photo Gallery
631: Community Forums
632: Photo Gallery
633: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Stryker at NTC
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:43 am
Post subject: Stryker at NTC



I visited the NTC last week to follow 3rd Bde, 2nd ID as they went through a rotation to get ready for Iraq. Here is a "knocked out" scout from 1-14 Cav. The scenerio was that some insurgents took over a small town from the Iraqi security forces. with an armor depot nearby, so they had some armor. A BMP took out this scout. When I asked the VC how he let a BMP take him out, he said he was escorting a convoy back to post when he got hit. He said he could have taken out the BMP if he had his Javelin, but the CO took it from him. I don't know, if this were the "Legacy" army then the scouts would have had some anti-armor capability, like a 25mm gun at least.

Reminds me of early WWII German scounts who did not have much besides MGs to defend themselves with. And back then in 1939 and 1940 other armies did not have the punch that is out there today, so at least the Germans had a chance. I would not want to be a scout in a Stryker (other than Iraq where the threat is really non-existent).

Does anybody know what the code is on the corner of the vehicle? Does it possibly have to do w/ shipping, a la the codes used in OIF1. It definitely is not a serial number as that is on the front hull and is different.

Bob
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 5:23 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

The code you speak of is the USA number, if you are refering to the black stencil on the OD paint (JO00IT). I have a couple vehicles on display here at NTC that have comparable USA #'s, (JJ03YM, JJ05UF, JZ002H, etc...). Even if he had his Javelin, OPFOR and the "Insurgents" of the NTC are quite good. I have taken out a Marine LAV here back in summer of 04 with relative ease with 155 shells buried under the road suface on a one lane bridge by East Gate village. Marines ahd actually walked over and stepped on the round while I acted as an inocent civilian. Once the vehicle moved over the bridge which had been "cleared" by the ground troops, "BOOM"!. The OC's "killed" the vehicle and a couple ground troops as we walked away. Another good day for the OPFOR!!!

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 6:12 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

And I came upon an OC who was MFing the men at a checkpoint at Junction City for making a tactical mistake I will not go into here. It was amusing to listen to him, "This town is grey now, but it will be going black soon!"

Man, and those OCs are hardcore. Freezing temps and no doors or windshields. They all have heater hoses tucked into their BDUs and whatnot! I have had my fill of driving in Humvees over rough ground. I had to ride like I would a horse, anticipating the bumps and raising my butt off the seat to take the bump. Also, almost rolled over when a turn came up going at speed in the dark - whoaaa, hold on! If it weren't for the seatbelt I would have got tossed out on that slide since those seats are damn small! Or maybe it was my big fat butt that did not fit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:26 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- Burik

I visited the NTC last week to follow 3rd Bde, 2nd ID as they went through a rotation to get ready for Iraq. Here is a "knocked out" scout from 1-14 Cav. The scenerio was that some insurgents took over a small town from the Iraqi security forces. with an armor depot nearby, so they had some armor. A BMP took out this scout. When I asked the VC how he let a BMP take him out, he said he was escorting a convoy back to post when he got hit. He said he could have taken out the BMP if he had his Javelin, but the CO took it from him. I don't know, if this were the "Legacy" army then the scouts would have had some anti-armor capability, like a 25mm gun at least.
Bob


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

Thanks for the photo of a M1127 RCV Stryker.

Interesting that the C.O. took the VC's AT-4 Javelin away from him.
That would be like a WW II German Commander or a Legacy Commander taking the auto cannon off the scout vehicle. Sad
The AT-4 is the primary anti-armor weapon/round of ammo for scout RCVs and infantry ICVs of the Stryker Brigades. Puzzling. I wonder why the VC didn't use his Scout Scope (I think that system is called a RVSS?) to ID the BMP and then take the convoy his was escorting around it? Neutral

- Burik

Reminds me of early WWII German scounts who did not have much besides MGs to defend themselves with. And back then in 1939 and 1940 other armies did not have the punch that is out there today, so at least the Germans had a chance. I would not want to be a scout in a Stryker (other than Iraq where the threat is really non-existent).

Bob


If not a Stryker, what do you think would be a better scout vehicle?

How about using a M-151 mounting a M-60 machine gun? Rolling Eyes

The Stryker Brigades are not designed for something like the Warsaw Pack vis NATO full blown fire fight, putting them into something like that would be a major mis-used. But then we have taken an Airborne Infantry BCT and thrown it out into the desert for use as a speed bump to stop or delay an armored attack south out of Kuwait. An SBCT would have a much better chance of pulling off a delaying action like that with a lot fewer casualties. The Stryker FOVs/SBCTs adds another tool to Combat Commander's tool box. No vehicle or system is prefect for all conditions. Confused

Unless we are talking about the greatest Scout vehicle ever. The M114 Lingle.

Any chance you where able to take some other photos of the NTC during your visit? Razz

Just my 2 cents for the discussion. Smile
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:28 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

Roy:

I was wondering the same thing about the BMP. I was not in a position to really quiz him, as we were pulling out, and he probably would have gotten ticked off with too many "insulting" questions. As Sgt Button noted, those OPFOR guys are pretty good. Maybe they popped out from behind good cover before he could do anything about it.

The whole Stryker concept perplexes me a little. The Marines have a darned good vehicle in the LAV and it has plenty of firepower and is light at the same time. Why can't the Stryker have the Bradley turret on it? I would think it would still fit in a C130, which seems to be a major requirement. I know the threats out there are not like the old Soviet days, but the N Koreans are pretty strong, and the Syrians, and the Iranians. Sending a Stryker Bde to be the first point of contact would be even worse than the 82nd w/ their Sheridans since the Sheridans at least could shoot back. But I have no problem w/ the Stryker's use in Iraq. I have first hand experience w/ how quiet it is, and so it is great for raids and such. Just as long as the Stryker guys are not expected to go up against enemy w/ armor or anti-armor capabilities... Plus, it's offroad capabilites are not as good as say a Bradley or M113, and it may be in a tough spot in a built up area since it can not make tight turns like a tracked vehicle. But, wheeled vehicles are not as tough to maintain. So, yes, there is no perfect vehicle. As long as it is not misused...

Yes, I have lots more photos. I can share some here. I plan on doing an article or two in Military Modelling of England coinciding w/ the new Trumpeter kit coming out. I also plan on doing a photo history book on the NTC. Digital cameras are the greatest. THere is no such thing as wasted film, and LOTS of photos can be taken, as long as you have enough flash cards or flash card space. One version I did not get enough good shots of were the engineer vehicles. But, I am invited up to Ft Lewis (I live in Portland, OR) to see some more at the motorpool. I need to see some with the slat armor. I think I have a coulpe of cool shots of an FA unit during a live fire exercise taking down a small village.

Bob
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:44 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

i49.photobucket.com/al...gas011.jpg

I took this shot after a long day, so I was too lazy to get out of the OC Humvee, but the OCs have no windshields, so no problem. It is the FA guys mounting up onto the Strykers from the Recon unit that was attached to them. Live ammo, so everybody is pumped up after a couple of dry runs. The Recon unit is not the Cav guys though, like the first photo in this thread. I am told this is a newer idea, and you can see there are a mixture of vehicles in a small unit/platoon.

i49.photobucket.com/al...gas010.jpg

This second shot is the same guys, but earlier. This was one of the dry runs.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:47 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC





Sorry about that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:58 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC



"If not a Stryker, what do you think would be a better scout vehicle?"

How about using a M-151 mounting a M-60 machine gun? Rolling Eyes


Ha! BTDT....no thanky, Roy! At least, not without the added protection of canvas doors....

I have had my fill of driving in Humvees over rough ground. I had to ride like I would a horse, anticipating the bumps and raising my butt off the seat to take the bump. Also, almost rolled over when a turn came up going at speed in the dark - whoaaa, hold on! If it weren't for the seatbelt I would have got tossed out on that slide since those seats are damn small!


Bob...now we get to the heart of the M151 question. If you thing the Humvee is a bad ride, get in the back of an M151 sometime! Laughing
...and don't think about taking turns at speed...just don't.

Oh....what's a "seat belt"? Shocked

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
SFC_Jeff_Button
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1311
Location: Ft Hood, TX
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:54 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

This rotation you took the pictures of was the first to utilize "live ammo" to within 200 meters of the towns. There was very strict compliance with who could go and be where at certain times. OC's played a much larger and important role than usual because of this ammo training. I know of a few 1SG's that were more worried about their troops being out in the "box" with ammo than they were about being in Iraq with ammo, and they were vocal about it at the command and staff meeting. As much as you try to replicate and make it seem like a combat enviroment, there is still that part in the back of your mind that knows your not, and therefore soldiers aren't always as careful with their weapons as they should be. But so far, so good, no ones been hurt and I haven't heard of any accidental discharges yet. Believe me, when they happen, we'll know, that kind of incident spread like wild fire.

_________________
SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:11 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- Burik
Roy:

The whole Stryker concept perplexes me a little. The Marines have a darned good vehicle in the LAV and it has plenty of firepower and is light at the same time. Why can't the Stryker have the Bradley turret on it? I would think it would still fit in a C130, which seems to be a major requirement.
Bob


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

It's not good to compair the Marines with the Army when it comes to 8x8 armored cars.

The Marines are using their LAV-25s in Recon Battalions. They only carry four dismount Scouts in the back of those vehicles. With the Delco 25 mm turret, there is ONLY room for six combat loaded Marines. One of the major problems learned with the Bradley and that turret is there isn't enough room to carry a squad of infantry (nine men) in a Bradley Infantry Company. The Stryker could be fitted with a Bradley turret or a Delco 25 turret and still fit inside a C-130. The Canadain Forces use LAV IIIs with the Delco 25 turret and we have been told by some of them that those vehicles do fit inside a C-130. The Army could have added a 25mm turret but it would reduce the number of troops a Stryker can carry and that would require more Strykers to carry the number of infantry men in the BCT. As for the Scouts (I to would have liked to have seen the M1127 RCV fitted with a 25mm turret) but that would add weight to the supply tail. More ammo (in this case, only used by the Scouts). More parts to repair things (in this case, again limited to only the Scout vehicles). The idea is to get an infantry brigade in the air with the least amount of lift aircarft and tied up the least amount of aircraft required to support and resupply the BCT once it is there.

Think of a Stryker BCT as light infantry unit (as in walking and must carry almost everything on their backs) that has been upgraded with trucks that have some armored protection. This is an upgrade of light infantry, not a down grade of mech infantry with lighter vehicles. The Scouts in the SBCT are light scouts who will need to use movement and concealment to do their job. They are not heavy Armored Cavarly Scouts who can fight for information or conduct an ecomany of force operation. That VC you talked with would have been conducting that convoy escort mission with a M151 or Hummer if he was still in a light infantry brigade. The BMP would have still got him if he was not watching and drove out into it's kill zone. With a light infantry scout unit, you have walking Scouts and light wheeled vehicle mounted scouts. The Stryker RCV can carry a lot of AT-4s, more troops in each vehicle, carry that very heavy Long Range Scout Surveillance System (LRAS3, the super scout scope I was talking about in my other post). When thinking about a light infantry brigade and the scouts units, Stryker is a major upgrade.

- Burik

I know the threats out there are not like the old Soviet days, but the N Koreans are pretty strong, and the Syrians, and the Iranians. Sending a Stryker Bde to be the first point of contact would be even worse than the 82nd w/ their Sheridans since the Sheridans at least could shoot back.
Bob


Sending a Stryker BCT would have been worse that the 82nd w/their Sheridans?
Hold on here David! First of all we are NOT talking about all of the 82nd Airborne Division. We are talking about ONE BCT from the 82nd. About the same number of infantry, maybe a little bit less than what a SBCT now has. Sheirdans? We are not talking about the complete battalion. We are talking about ONE tank company, divided three ways with four tanks support each battalion of dismouted infantry. Dismounted infantry that could only get out of the way of a heavy division attack by digging in and keeping their heads down or using their feet and trying to run away in an open desert. It would have been very hard for that BCT to conduct a delaying action once the troops had been dropped off. A SBCT on the other hand would have been able to load up the infantry and move them to one delaying position after another. Using AT-4s to reduce the number of attacking AFVs.

- Burik

But I have no problem w/ the Stryker's use in Iraq. I have first hand experience w/ how quiet it is, and so it is great for raids and such. Just as long as the Stryker guys are not expected to go up against enemy w/ armor or anti-armor capabilities... Plus, it's offroad capabilites are not as good as say a Bradley or M113, and it may be in a tough spot in a built up area since it can not make tight turns like a tracked vehicle. But, wheeled vehicles are not as tough to maintain. So, yes, there is no perfect vehicle. As long as it is not misused...
Bob



When it comes to military operations, one must always be ready to use what is available to do what ever must be done. Someday, possible somewhere those Stryker BCTs may end up facing a heavy armored force and those troopers had better know how to use what they have to do the best they can. Task Force Smith and the Battle of the Bulge are two possible examples where units where tasked to do things they where never designed for.

- Burik

Yes, I have lots more photos. I can share some here. I plan on doing an article or two in Military Modelling of England coinciding w/ the new Trumpeter kit coming out. I also plan on doing a photo history book on the NTC. Digital cameras are the greatest. THere is no such thing as wasted film, and LOTS of photos can be taken, as long as you have enough flash cards or flash card space. One version I did not get enough good shots of were the engineer vehicles. But, I am invited up to Ft Lewis (I live in Portland, OR) to see some more at the motorpool. I need to see some with the slat armor. I think I have a coulpe of cool shots of an FA unit during a live fire exercise taking down a small village.
Bob


Super, can not wait to see what you can share with us all.

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.


Last edited by Roy_A_Lingle on Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:06 am; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Burik
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 05, 2006
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 4:59 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

Roy, well said. Point taken.

Cheers.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 10:04 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

It just hit me that these Strykers do not have the bar armor on them. Seems that if they are training for deployment they would try to have vehicles equiped the same way as they will use in the field. I can see the extra size affecting everything from how the vehicle drives to how you dismount and clear the vehicle.

Just seems like a big oversight to me

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 10:22 am
Post subject: Re: Stryker at NTC

- bsmart
It just hit me that these Strykers do not have the bar armor on them. Seems that if they are training for deployment they would try to have vehicles equiped the same way as they will use in the field. I can see the extra size affecting everything from how the vehicle drives to how you dismount and clear the vehicle.

Just seems like a big oversight to me


Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

It's not an oversight. It's another case of NOT ENOUGH MONEY Evil or Very Mad . One of the lessons learned by the first two SBCTs was the drivers need some training with all that extra bar armor. The corrective plan is to buy a few sets for the state side units so all drivers can get some experence driving with the cages installed. Besides, the bird cages are an intrim Evil or Very Mad fix, the Army is working on next phase of protection.

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum