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johnestauffer · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 5

There are a number of sites that focus on future aviation projects. Are there any sites that target/deal with the projected German panzer designs?
Most sites give limited coverage to the design studies.
There are bits & pieces of 'never where' panzer data scattered here and there but no central site.
Any information would be appreciated
Thank you

bsmart · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 2:52 pm Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

When you say 'Future Panzers' Do you mean future as 'in OUR current future' or in 'The proposed (or even imagined) systems that would/could have been built if the Third Reich had survived?'

JG300-Ascout · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:02 pm Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

Might be a ground clearance problem with this one....which we might have seen if they'd upped 'Dolph's meds....
Think this would fit on a C-130? Could be a new direction for the FCS...

mike_Duplessis · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 236

Ah, future pazers - I'm all notalgic. The early 80s was the golden age of 'future panzers'. The Cold War was still going. Everybody was trying to push the technology envelope as far a possible. Private manufacturers were getting into the act. It doesn't matter than only a handful of those designs ever made it past prototype, it was fun while it lasted.

Future Panzers?
Judging from current evidence apparently everybody in the future is going to be fighting in LAV-IIIs and ex-South African mine-proof vehicles! Wink

johnestauffer · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 5

I started out thinking mainly of the 'what if' German (and other Axis) designs. But there area lot of ideal of what could have been floating around. (Few actual models came to light without a lot of concept vehicles)
We have a web ship - Warship Project Index - that is dedicated to the 'never built' ship designs. It includes both actually 'never were's' along with an own designs section for the 'should have been' designs.

Sabot · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 7:04 pm Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

We've got a couple of mainstream model kits that were prototypes or "paper panzers". Dragon did the Maus heavy tank and the E-100 heavy tank. There were even some conversions to do an anti-aircraft turreted version. There was also a Dragon Panther-based AAA kit done, Colieon or something like that.

Jinx · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 10:43 pm Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

I have heard reference to a German turretless design from the 1950s or 1960s (i think) that was not unlike the Swedish Stridsvagn 103, but with two 105mm auto-loading guns.....but try as i have, i can't find anything about it online. Anyone know anything about this vehicle? Any information would be appreciated.

Roy_A_Lingle · Posted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:00 pm Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

- JG300-Ascout

Might be a ground clearance problem with this one....which we might have seen if they'd upped 'Dolph's meds....
Think this would fit on a C-130? Could be a new direction for the FCS...

Hey there Mr. Ascout! Hi Folks!

Everytime I look at one of those kits (I do have two of them) I think about the forrest of Germany. Those side weapon stations would be OK out in the wide open country, but try moving they through the trees and they wouldn't make it very far with a team of lumberjacks to help clear the way.

Sgt, Scouts Out!

buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

Jim Webster's site has images of these (I believe he was offering free access a day or two ago for a limited period?)...........I've seen them there!

I seem to remember they had "V" or "VT" Prefixes BUT don't hold me to that - I get time later, I'll see if I can find other sources.

Regards,

BUG

buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

God I'm good (he says smiling) Cool

This is the bugga..........the VT1-2 (VT = VersuchsTrager)........

build by: MaK Maschinenbau GmbH, Kiel, Germany
in: 1975
crew: 3
engine: MTU MB803 Ra-500 Viertakt Vorkammer Vielstoffmotor mit 4 Abgasturboladern 12cyl V90Ã‚Â°
45000ccm
max rpm 3000
max power output 2175hp/1600kW for a short time
1500hp/1100kW permanent power output
34,5-50hp/to
battleweight 43,5t
vmax (v/r) 70/40km/h
2x Rh 120mm (same as Leo2) with autoloader
each gun 10-12 rounds per minute = 20-24rounds/minute
the VT1-2 was able to fire on the move...
The chassie was a shortet MBT70 hull (one roadwheele less at each side)

Regards,

BUG

Dontos · Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 1:28 am Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

- buglerbilly

Regards,

BUG

Is that a 105mm mounted Marder?

Back when I was in Germany(86-89), our partnership unit 2/131 PzG had a Platoon Sgt who, related an experimental attempt to mount a large bore gun on the Marder chassis.

Don

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 1:32 am Post subject: Re: Future Panzers

ONTOS Lite....

buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

The vehicle to the right of the VT1-2 is the Marder with 120mm cannon, the vehicle to the left the MBT 70 (or one of the prototypes)............memory again serves me (or not as the case may be) but I think the Marder was related to Swedish trials? As part of their future armour developments which also saw at least mock-ups of a system with a front Tractor Unit linked to a rear gun/ammo unit, witht the crew sitting next to each other in the front unit. Think of a BvS10 armed with a 120mm cannon in the rear and you get the idea!

Regards,

BUG

buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

I wrote 120mm cannon, it should have read 105mm cannon............apologies! Wink

This is a picture of the prototype the Swedes used, the UDES19 concept.........

The UDES 19 was a german Marder with a 10,5 cm gun was mounted on top of the vehicle to test the feasability of a external tank gun in a low profile top mounted turret.

UDES-XX-20 was the linked "Tank" I remember BUT the gun was on the front unit (memory you fail me! :roll:)............

The UDES-XX-20 was ready for testing in 1981. It was based on the HÃƒÂ¤gglunds BV 206 and had double waiststeering and an external 12 cm tank gun. While mobility was very good the concept is more expensive than tracksteering. The vehicle weighed 25 tons.

Regards,

BUG