±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 536
Total: 536
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Community Forums
03: Statistics
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Downloads
10: Downloads
11: News Archive
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Home
15: Photo Gallery
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Home
19: Community Forums
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Home
23: Photo Gallery
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Home
28: Community Forums
29: Home
30: Downloads
31: Member Screenshots
32: Community Forums
33: Home
34: Home
35: Member Screenshots
36: Photo Gallery
37: Community Forums
38: Photo Gallery
39: Photo Gallery
40: Member Screenshots
41: Community Forums
42: Home
43: Member Screenshots
44: Community Forums
45: Home
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Home
53: Member Screenshots
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Statistics
57: Community Forums
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Member Screenshots
63: Home
64: Photo Gallery
65: Home
66: Member Screenshots
67: Statistics
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Photo Gallery
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Home
74: Community Forums
75: News
76: Statistics
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Member Screenshots
80: Home
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Home
85: Home
86: Member Screenshots
87: Community Forums
88: Community Forums
89: Photo Gallery
90: Members List
91: Home
92: Community Forums
93: Member Screenshots
94: Community Forums
95: Home
96: Home
97: Community Forums
98: Home
99: Home
100: Home
101: Members List
102: Community Forums
103: Home
104: Downloads
105: Home
106: Downloads
107: Home
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Member Screenshots
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Photo Gallery
115: Downloads
116: Home
117: Home
118: Photo Gallery
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Member Screenshots
127: Photo Gallery
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Home
131: Community Forums
132: Home
133: News
134: Community Forums
135: Home
136: Community Forums
137: Photo Gallery
138: Photo Gallery
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Photo Gallery
142: Photo Gallery
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Home
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Home
149: Home
150: Home
151: Home
152: Home
153: Home
154: Photo Gallery
155: Community Forums
156: Home
157: Treasury
158: Community Forums
159: Photo Gallery
160: Community Forums
161: Downloads
162: Photo Gallery
163: Photo Gallery
164: Photo Gallery
165: Home
166: Downloads
167: Downloads
168: Home
169: Photo Gallery
170: Photo Gallery
171: Home
172: Downloads
173: Home
174: Community Forums
175: Home
176: Home
177: Photo Gallery
178: Downloads
179: Home
180: Home
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Home
184: News Archive
185: Downloads
186: Photo Gallery
187: Photo Gallery
188: Photo Gallery
189: Community Forums
190: Home
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Photo Gallery
194: Community Forums
195: Home
196: Photo Gallery
197: Home
198: Photo Gallery
199: Photo Gallery
200: Member Screenshots
201: Home
202: Member Screenshots
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Photo Gallery
206: News
207: Home
208: News Archive
209: Photo Gallery
210: Home
211: Photo Gallery
212: Community Forums
213: Home
214: Photo Gallery
215: News Archive
216: Home
217: Community Forums
218: Photo Gallery
219: Photo Gallery
220: Photo Gallery
221: Member Screenshots
222: Downloads
223: Photo Gallery
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Home
227: Member Screenshots
228: Photo Gallery
229: Home
230: Home
231: Community Forums
232: Member Screenshots
233: Photo Gallery
234: Photo Gallery
235: Downloads
236: Home
237: Photo Gallery
238: Downloads
239: Home
240: Home
241: Photo Gallery
242: Member Screenshots
243: Home
244: Community Forums
245: Photo Gallery
246: Home
247: Photo Gallery
248: Community Forums
249: Photo Gallery
250: Community Forums
251: Home
252: News
253: Community Forums
254: Community Forums
255: Photo Gallery
256: Downloads
257: Home
258: Community Forums
259: Community Forums
260: Community Forums
261: Your Account
262: Photo Gallery
263: News Archive
264: Community Forums
265: Home
266: Community Forums
267: Home
268: Photo Gallery
269: Home
270: Downloads
271: Home
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Member Screenshots
275: Photo Gallery
276: Downloads
277: Photo Gallery
278: Home
279: Community Forums
280: Photo Gallery
281: Community Forums
282: Photo Gallery
283: Community Forums
284: Home
285: Home
286: Home
287: Downloads
288: Home
289: Photo Gallery
290: Photo Gallery
291: Member Screenshots
292: Community Forums
293: Downloads
294: Photo Gallery
295: Photo Gallery
296: Home
297: Community Forums
298: Downloads
299: Photo Gallery
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Photo Gallery
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Photo Gallery
307: Downloads
308: Photo Gallery
309: Home
310: Photo Gallery
311: Downloads
312: Photo Gallery
313: Member Screenshots
314: Downloads
315: Downloads
316: Photo Gallery
317: Home
318: Photo Gallery
319: Home
320: Photo Gallery
321: Photo Gallery
322: Home
323: Photo Gallery
324: Photo Gallery
325: Home
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Photo Gallery
329: Member Screenshots
330: Statistics
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Home
335: Photo Gallery
336: Home
337: Home
338: Community Forums
339: Photo Gallery
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Photo Gallery
343: Community Forums
344: Photo Gallery
345: Your Account
346: Photo Gallery
347: Home
348: Community Forums
349: Downloads
350: Downloads
351: Home
352: Community Forums
353: Photo Gallery
354: Home
355: Home
356: Home
357: Downloads
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Downloads
361: Home
362: Community Forums
363: Home
364: Photo Gallery
365: Home
366: Community Forums
367: Photo Gallery
368: Community Forums
369: Home
370: Community Forums
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Member Screenshots
374: Statistics
375: Photo Gallery
376: Downloads
377: Community Forums
378: Community Forums
379: Photo Gallery
380: Photo Gallery
381: Community Forums
382: Home
383: Home
384: Home
385: Community Forums
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Photo Gallery
392: Downloads
393: Downloads
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Home
399: Community Forums
400: Home
401: Home
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Photo Gallery
405: Community Forums
406: Photo Gallery
407: Community Forums
408: Member Screenshots
409: Photo Gallery
410: Community Forums
411: Home
412: Photo Gallery
413: Downloads
414: Community Forums
415: Home
416: Community Forums
417: Photo Gallery
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Home
421: Community Forums
422: Community Forums
423: Community Forums
424: Community Forums
425: Photo Gallery
426: Downloads
427: Home
428: Downloads
429: Community Forums
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Community Forums
433: Community Forums
434: Home
435: Home
436: Community Forums
437: Home
438: Home
439: Home
440: Community Forums
441: Home
442: Photo Gallery
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: Photo Gallery
446: Community Forums
447: Home
448: Community Forums
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Downloads
454: Community Forums
455: Photo Gallery
456: Photo Gallery
457: Community Forums
458: Downloads
459: Community Forums
460: Community Forums
461: Home
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Home
465: Downloads
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Home
469: Community Forums
470: Photo Gallery
471: Community Forums
472: Community Forums
473: Home
474: Photo Gallery
475: Community Forums
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Photo Gallery
479: Community Forums
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Home
483: Home
484: Community Forums
485: Downloads
486: Community Forums
487: Home
488: Member Screenshots
489: Photo Gallery
490: Photo Gallery
491: Home
492: Home
493: Home
494: Downloads
495: Community Forums
496: News
497: Community Forums
498: News Archive
499: Community Forums
500: Photo Gallery
501: Community Forums
502: Home
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: Home
506: Home
507: Home
508: Home
509: Home
510: Home
511: Home
512: Community Forums
513: Home
514: Home
515: Home
516: Member Screenshots
517: Home
518: Downloads
519: Home
520: Downloads
521: Community Forums
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Home
527: Home
528: Community Forums
529: Home
530: Home
531: Home
532: Home
533: Member Screenshots
534: Home
535: Home
536: Photo Gallery

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page Previous  1, 2
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:50 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- Doug_Kibbey
I love this board....I'm learning a ton of stuff about trains here that I never even thought of!


Don't get me started on the "JODI - WHISTLE" or the "JODI - TRAIN"

Confused

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
oldtop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 17, 2006
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 2:16 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Got to say this having loaded and unload countless tanks, SP, amtracks, and @#$#@ Ontos (pigs) on flatcars,flatbed trucks,and LST as well as LPHs how, does a gun tube swing free, I mean if the travering gears are engaged (to unengage them you must drop the gears). if the travering gears and drive motor were removed and the turret lock was relested and the gun tube taken out of travel lock (which is checked by the railroad load master before the shippment moves) and the gun is free swing it would swing all the way to the rear after it hit the first what-ever along side the roadbed ( one man can move the turret on a M109 by pushing it..yes it is that well balanced. So what we see is that someone has got on the vehicle and relested the travel lock, and hand elevated that gun and then traversed the tube to the side. By the way if the travel lock is unoperatable or missing the loadmaster requiers you you "dog" the gun tube to the hull with chains or cables...I'm not nit picking it just when I know better I must say something!
..Now I did have an M60A1 break its tie down chains on a hill in the middle of SanDiego (this was the hill where 6 interstates and Hiways come together) and roll off the lowboy truck trailer and go roaring down the hill. The little elderly couple in the car behind the lowboy liked to have a heartattack when they saw the monster coming at them, but the hand of god intervened I guess and for some reason the tank swerved off the road just before it got to them . I tried to tell the truck driver (a non military contractor) that you couldn't get away with dogging a 56 ton tank down with 3/8" chains, he told me he had been hauling heavy loads for 20 years and knew what he was doing...That night the headline news ch 8 opened with "and the Marine are looking for a few good tanks".
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 8:43 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

[quote="binder001"][quote="C_Sherman"]
- bsmart

I've seen pictures of what happens when a vehicle or part of a vehicle (turret, crane, cargo, etc.) comes adrift during rail transport, and it ain't pretty. If you are lucky, no one gets kilt...and the best result is just extensive damage to unit property. Unlucky? Well, that can get really ugly.



One time several years ago when I was 'train spotting' at an out of the way junction of Norfolk Southern and CSX tracks a signal maintainer for CSX came by to check out a trackside telephone that was broken. after quickly fixing the problem (a rodent had made a nest inside the phone box under the handset and raised the handset so it was 'off hook') we talked for a couple minutes. then a train could be heard pulling up the grade and he stopped and started counting the cars. When the train went by he got on his radio and told his dispatcher where he was, how many cars had been in the train and that there were 'no hangers'. He explained that it was policy that whenever a train went by any worksite everyone was to stop work and watch the train for loose items hanging over the side and that a couple years before his division had made it policy to also call in a car count after a local train that was picking and dropping cars at business sidings had had a car become disconnected and sitting on the mainline (He also said that that was a strange set of incidental mistakes and was almost impossible to happen on anything but a local switcher) The main emphasis was on loads like lumber and pipe where a load band would break and a pipe or telephone pole would angle out from the train and act like a scythe as the train continued running at speed. He said one time they had to replace several miles of telephone poles in the boonies of Western Maryland after one end of a load of poles on a train broke loose.

Also about humping trains. I suspected that any military unit would be handled in a unit train but I remember years ago (Like in the 60s) weeing flat cars with trucks and artillery mixed in with regular freight. Most would be 3 or 4 cars all of like equipment. This was all around the Baltimore area and I remember my father at the time saying it was equipment being shipped overseas from the factory. That made sense at the time. I never remember seeing any tanks in shipment but a lot of tactical trucks and occasional towed artillery.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Maple_Leaf_Eh
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 517

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:03 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Folks!

As best I can remember, every rail movement I was part of, the required number of flat cars would be placed against a ramp at the end of the rail line and each vehicle would drive from the ramp crossed all the flat cars until it reached the one it would be traveling on.

My 2 cents,
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile


I remember watching the best driving conceivable as truck after truck with trailers BACKED down the length of a section of rail cars after RV89 in Wainhole, Alberta. Backing a normal vehicle is small corrections to the wheel as ground guides relay instructions back and forth between themselves, and to the driver. Now, hold the bottom of the wheel and make twice as many small corrections to point a whippy uncooperative 1 1/2ton trailer down the line.

The CF had forgotten how to load trains in Canada until the biannual RV series of exercises from '81 to '93. Then we got mixed up in Bosnia and who knows if there are 5% of the guys in the units who can remember half the lessons learned.

One thing that was learned after 1991, was don't leave loaded trains immobile in railyards on Indian Reserves. It seems that after 5 Brigade helped put a lid on the so-called Oka Crisis with the Mohawks in '91, they picked up the training cycle for the fall season. There is a big railyard on the Kahnewake Reserve just outside Montreal ... An ABLOY padlock only keeps honest thieves out ...
Back to top
View user's profile
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:09 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- oldtop
Got to say this having loaded and unload countless tanks, SP, amtracks, and @#$#@ Ontos (pigs) on flatcars,flatbed trucks,and LST as well as LPHs how, does a gun tube swing free, I mean if the travering gears are engaged (to unengage them you must drop the gears). if the travering gears and drive motor were removed and the turret lock was relested and the gun tube taken out of travel lock (which is checked by the railroad load master before the shippment moves) and the gun is free swing it would swing all the way to the rear after it hit the first what-ever along side the roadbed ( one man can move the turret on a M109 by pushing it..yes it is that well balanced. So what we see is that someone has got on the vehicle and relested the travel lock, and hand elevated that gun and then traversed the tube to the side. By the way if the travel lock is unoperatable or missing the loadmaster requiers you you "dog" the gun tube to the hull with chains or cables...I'm not nit picking it just when I know better I must say something!


I hear ya 'ole top'. I'm searching for 'proof'. I've seen photos of the event in question, long ago, online.

The story was 'lore' for Soldiers & the civilians alike. I will find the photos.

Don

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:14 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Most folks don't know that only certain routes have been cleared for military vehicle flatcars, because they are often "oversized". The problem is that the dimensions of some older railroad tunnels and grade curves are less than required for the vehicles to pass safely.

It isn't unusual for the front or back of a vehicle to hang over the end of a railcar, or for a boom or gun tube to extend over the next car. The problem crops up when the extended end of a vehicle, boom or gun tube hangs out over the edge of the railcar because of a sharp curve. If there is anything beside the track, the protrusion will hit it. This can happen even when the equipment is properly secured and nothing comes unshipped.

A few years back, a trainload was accidentally diverted onto unapproved grade by a busy dispatcher. As the train entered an underpass on a curve, the front end of a PLS truck hung over the edge of the car enough to catch the upper curve of the underpass. This ripped the upper corner of the cab off the PLS. The PLS was loaded with a CONEX shipping container, and the underpass caught the upper corner of it, too. The container was driven backwards THROUGH the cab of the PLS behind it, and the chain reaction continued for about 6 containers and several other trucks behind.

The various containers were all torn open to some extent, some literally peeled open like aluminum pop cans. In the photos I saw, the vehicles and containers looked like they'd been headed for the shredder at a salvage yard. The unit's gear was spread along nearly 5 miles of track in a not-unpopulated area, since it took a fairly long time to stop the train once the conductor realized there was a problem.

It took nearly a month to account for the gear, and some of it was never found. The unit had done a good job of their packing lists for the containers, so the Commander got all his missing gear back...lucky goat. A good deal of personal stuff never was replaced, though.

Even when you do everything right...!

C

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:10 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

'It took nearly a month to account for the gear, and some of it was never found. The unit had done a good job of their packing lists for the containers, so the Commander got all his missing gear back...lucky goat. A good deal of personal stuff never was replaced, though.'

Not to question the honesty of the unit but did anyone figure how much space would be taken up by all the equipment that was missing from the containers?

I remember one time when several mobility containers werelost on a 1st TFW TDY that went to several African and West Asia back in the late 70s/early 80s. Once the containers were lost we started compiling the 'official ' packing lists (The Mobility boxes were lost on the return trip after making several stops and having the deployed unit split and reformed several times so the nice neat ones we made when we sent it had been messed up scribbled on or lost so we were allowed to 'reconstruct' them)

Well Lets just say we made up a lot of shortages and missing equipment Smile


The Mobility box was a big roll around box about 6' high 30" deep and almost 6' long. They were originally sized to fit in a B-29 bomb bay since that was the early Air Force mobility platform. Well we figured from the amount of equipment we had accepted on the 'lost' list that the reasonthey were lost was the C-141 had to jettison it because it couldn't climb over the mountains! each container was holding about 3 tons and 300 Cubic feet!

Sometimes an account custodian loves an accident as long as no one is hurt Smile

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
C_Sherman
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 590

PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:30 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

- bsmart
'
Not to question the honesty of the unit but did anyone figure how much space would be taken up by all the equipment that was missing from the containers?


Why, I have no idea what you could mean by that! Wink Cool

C

_________________
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it
will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.
-Herm Albright

Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
timroberts
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 71
Location: shrewsbury UK
PostPosted: Sat Apr 15, 2006 7:15 pm
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Hi Geoff
These things hold Russian/Warsaw Pact Tanks down on flatcars
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
oldtop
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 17, 2006
Posts: 70

PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 12:37 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

I guess they were one up on us huh, they sure would have saved me a lot of work and splitters.
Back to top
View user's profile
GerryChester
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 3:51 am
Post subject: Re: What holds freight down on Railway flatcars?

Hi.

While many things change, the loading of tanks on to flat-cars seems to be the same as it was during WW II.

Here's a photo, taken in 1942, of Churchills (the early version) of my regiment, the North Irish Horse, being loaded:
www.nih.ww2site.com/ni...a/gwr.html

Cheers, Gerry
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 2 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum