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buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

Interestingly enough whilst TUSK seems to die from lack of funds, both Germany and France seem to be copying TUSK in their own way.

Firstly Germany with their Leopard 2 PSO (PSO = Peace Support Operations! Some0one had a sense of humour here, black humour but humour nevertheless! :mrgreen:)

Jan. 25, 2006

Urban Leopard 2 Variant Planned

CHRISTOPHER F FOSS JDW Land Forces Contributing Editor Munich, Germany

A heavy armoured vehicle based on the Leopard 2 main battle tank (MBT) but optimised for urban operations is being developed by Germany's Krauss-Maffei Wegmann (KMW).

Dubbed the Leopard 2 Peace Support Operation (PSO) vehicle, a demonstrator prototype is expected to be shown in public for the first time in mid-2006.

The Leopard 2 MBT's highest level of protection is over the frontal arc, with the emphasis on protection against armour-piercing fin-stabilised discarding-sabot (APFSDS) and high-explosive antitank (HEAT) attack. However, recent combat experience has shown that in urban operations the main threat to an MBT can come from a much wider range of angles in the form of mines, improvised explosive devices and direct-fire weapons, such as the widely deployed RPG-7 rocket-propelled grenade launcher.

KMW has already developed and tested a new mine protection kit for the Leopard 2 that is being installed in a batch of vehicles for Germany and Sweden and could also be fitted to the Leopard 2 PSO. This provides a high level of protection against anti-tank mines and explosively formed penetrator-type ordnance.

While the ideal solution wouldbe to extend enhanced protection through a full 360Ã‚Â°, this is not possible without increasing the overall combat weight to an unacceptable level.

On the Leopard 2 PSO, new advanced passive armour side-skirts will be fitted above the front five road wheels and extra turret side armour added that extends to the rear of the turret bustle.

The optics of the Leopard 2 PSO will also be protected and an integrated command and control system fitted. The machine gun on the commander's cupola will be replaced by a KMW remote-controlled weapon station on the turret roof to the rear of the loader's hatch. This can be equipped with a 7.62 mm or 12.7 mm machine gun or a 40 mm automatic grenade launcher. A searchlight will be mounted coax ially with the main

Model rear view..........

Model side view.............

Secondly, GIAT has just announced the Leclerc AZUR (AZUR = Action en Zone URban)................

05 June 2006
Eurosatory: Giat heralds Leclerc MBT for urban operations

By Christopher F Foss Jane's Land Forces Contributing Editor
Satory, France

Giat Industries of France will unveil at Eurosatory a special version of its Leclerc main battle tank (MBT) optimised for urban operations.

Called AZUR (Action en Zone URban), the newly configured Leclerc has been developed by Giat Industries as a private venture, although the French Army has had some input into the development. According to Giat Industries, the French Army will evaluate the Leclerc AZUR from late in 2006.

For improved survivability the Leclerc AZUR has been fitted with an enhanced protection package that provides additional protection over the sides and rear of the vehicle.

New side skirts made of an advanced composite material cover the sides of the crew compartment, while bar armour has been fitted around the rear of the hull and turret to neutralise attacks from rocket-propelled grenades. There is also additional protection over the top rear engine decks against attack from petrol bombs.

Also, the Swiss even seen to have some of this Urban Warfare gear........Leopard 2 modified by RUAG in Switzerland................

Interesting armoured and protected .50cal mounts which makes more sense than the plaethora of open-to-damage RWS one see's...........

How many of these actually make it into service is another matter, but the Germans seem to want to adapt at least a small portion of their Leo 2's to their PSO configuration.

Compliments to Panzerbaer, GIAT and my friend Dennis for various of the images................

Regards,

BUG

Adrian_Wainer · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jun 03, 2006 Posts: 255

It would not surprize me if these enhanced Leopard 2 and LeClerc were put together with an eye to possible export opportunities to the People's Republic of China.

I will not make further comment on that issue, suffice to say that many people in the 1930s believed the Third Reich would be a bullwark against Stalin's Russia.............not quite how it worked out with the Third Reich and the USSR carving Poland and the Baltic States up between them, German Panzers runing on Russian fuel during the invasion of France in 1940 and the Communist Party of Great Britain recieving instructions from Moscow to sabotage British industrial producion in response to Neville Chamberlain's declaration of War on the Third Reich.

Best and Warm Regards
Adrian Wainer

Adrian_Wainer · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jun 03, 2006 Posts: 255

If one was building a serious urban combat heavy AFV.

[1]Shift the power train to front

[2]dispense with the conventional turret

[3] develop univeral turret attachement

[4] have a selection of turrets for various missions

[5] have the turret unmanned and armour between turret and vehicle so that enemy can take out turret and vehicle will still be in good mechanical order and vehicle with disabled turret can make a safe evacuation to safe area

Best Regards
Adrian Wainer

Maple_Leaf_Eh · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 517

- Adrian_Wainer

If one was building a serious urban combat heavy AFV.

[1]Shift the power train to front

[2]dispense with the conventional turret

[3] develop univeral turret attachement

[4] have a selection of turrets for various missions

[5] have the turret unmanned and armour between turret and vehicle so that enemy can take out turret and vehicle will still be in good mechanical order and vehicle with disabled turret can make a safe evacuation to safe area

Best Regards
Adrian Wainer

We had this debate probably 3 yrs ago during the last Palestinian Intafadeh (sp?). There were plenty of news pictures of Israeli M113's, Centurion and T55-family urban mechanized vehicles. And kids throwing rocks or blowing up Merkavas with 1 ton IEDs. The M113 armoured OPs have a veritable cylindirical lighthouse cupola with lots of observation windows.

buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

It would not surprize me if these enhanced Leopard 2 and LeClerc were put together with an eye to possible export opportunities to the People's Republic of China.

I will not make further comment on that issue, suffice to say that many people in the 1930s believed the Third Reich would be a bullwark against Stalin's Russia.............not quite how it worked out with the Third Reich and the USSR carving Poland and the Baltic States up between them, German Panzers runing on Russian fuel during the invasion of France in 1940 and the Communist Party of Great Britain recieving instructions from Moscow to sabotage British industrial producion in response to Neville Chamberlain's declaration of War on the Third Reich.

You COMPLETELY lost me there pal! Shocked

I fail to see what any of that has to do with MBT's modified for combat in Urban Terrain................ ???

Regards,

BUG

Adrian_Wainer · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jun 03, 2006 Posts: 255

BUG wrote

You COMPLETELY lost me there pal!

I fail to see what any of that has to do with MBT's modified for combat in Urban Terrain................ ???

Regards,

BUG

well about as much as what you have written below:

Firstly Germany with their Leopard 2 PSO (PSO = Peace Support Operations! Some0one had a sense of humour here, black humour but humour nevertheless! )

Best Regards
Adrian Wainer

buglerbilly · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 147

well about as much as what you have written below:

Well if you don't see any humour in that statement "written below" obviously our measures of humour differ.

Quasi-political statements about unconnected historical data strike me as being SO far removed, as to be almost irrelevant to each other.

NOT wishing to bore the pants off the rest of the participants here, this discussion is forthwith terminated as far as I am concerned.

Regards,

BUG

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