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Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 7:40 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

How old is that picture? How confident are you it still exists at Ft Bliss?

My gut feel is that picture is like some I have seen of artifacts that were once at Aberdeen. They were long ago transferred, scrapped, used as range targets, etc.

I would love to proven wrong

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Taranov
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 9:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

- bsmart
How old is that picture? How confident are you it still exists at Ft Bliss?

My gut feel is that picture is like some I have seen of artifacts that were once at Aberdeen. They were long ago transferred, scrapped, used as range targets, etc.

I would love to proven wrong


I have 1997 dated shots in Notiziario Modellistico magazine. Shots taken in Fort Bliss.
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bsmart
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:01 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

If it made it to 1997 maybe it's still there. But if the article was in 1997 the photos may have been older. Does it have any clue as to where on Ft Bliss it was (part of the Air Defense Museum, etc)?

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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:35 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Hi Taranov! Hi Folks!

- Taranov

One of the most interesting and rare AFVs in Fort Bliss - last survived Autocannone DA 90/53
Any chance of detailed walkaround? Wink


Sorry Taranov. I think I remember that vehicle at the OLD outside display area. Sense the Museum moved into the old PX building a few years ago, most of the items in the outside display area have gone into storage (I hope that is where they went?) and out of sight.

Spot Report! Sad
Sgt, Scouts Out!

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Last edited by Roy_A_Lingle on Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:45 am; edited 2 times in total
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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 1:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Roy, came across pics of the current 1AD museum in Wiesbaden. Maybe these items will be coming to Hood soon?

www.geocaching.com/see...7cc206d91e

Neil
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Taranov
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Not sure about this T-34/85 origin...
It's ex-yugoslavian tank. It's can be czech or polish built T-34/85, like T-34/85 in Jaques Littlefield collection.
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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 8:46 am
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Hi Taranov! Hi Folks!

On the way home from work Thursday morining, I conducted an area recon of Ft. Bliss. Look what I found out side the museum's storage buildings!


I think that is your Autocannone D A 90/53. It is still here at Ft. Bliss. I think it was placed inside one of the storage buildings after it was moved from the old display field. Checking Google Earth, it does not show up on the sat photos of the old museum or the storage area. It has been painted sense the last time I saw it. Paint that is already pealing.

Spot Report!
Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Hi Neil! Hi Folks!

Here is the list of what I found around the post.

North side of Jeb Stuart Road, just west of Chaffee Road
1. M-163 Vulcan out
2. M-730 Chaparral out

South side of Cassidy Road, just west of Chaffee Road
1. M-41 Duster out
2. M-730 Chapparral out
3. M-163 20 Vulcan
For those who have been to Ft. Bliss back during the 3rd ACR time, this is the old Regimental Headquarters building location.

North side of Casside Road, just east of Chaffee Road
1. M-42 Duster out

Museum Storage area outside two buildings
1. two 75mm automatic AAA guns out look like both are in bad shape
2. 90 mm AAA gun out -looks like it had been repainted
3. Italian Autocannone D A 90/53 out - doesn't look very good

Buiding 2920, elements of the 1st Bn, 44th AMD, 11th ADA Bde, 32rd AAMDC (first unit to have an Avenger btry along side Patriot)
1. M-42 Duster
2. M-163 Vulcan
3. ZSU-23-4

There should be one more M-163 Vulcan. For a long time, one sat just outside the gate to Biggs Field. Due to the 4th Bde, 1st Cav now setting up at Biggs field and the 1st AD coming, the road way and gate are being rebuild to account for the heavier traffic going into and coming out of the Biggs area. Currently there is only one road into and out of the airfield area. There was a second road which was closed after 9/11.

I asked one of the folks at the museum if she knew anything about that Vulcan. She told that the 1st 44th had taken it and moved it out to McGreager Range complex. I have not gone out there yet, so I can not confirm it is there.

Follow up on the source of the Sgt, York. The lady I talked to about the missing Vulcan told me that she was the one who took the phone call asking if the Ft. Bliss Museum wanted one. She remembers it came from Aberdeen (APG). The folks who control equipment to be used for targets had it and where planning on blowing it up if they could not find anyone who wanted it. That was about two and half to three months ago. It was flown to El Paso by C-5, when straight into the museum paint shop and went on display (ind) about two months ago. I had sent Bob Smart a message asking him to check into the status of Yorks at APGs. He will let me known if he finds out anything. He also told me you might be able to check with your contacts at APG. I am sure it wasn't the museum's York. Do you have any contacts with the folks who control targets? Maybe you can confirm that is were it came from.

I was thinking the other guy I first asked about the York, told me it came from Alabama or Flordia. I don't know now.

I made a list of what was inside the museum, but I can't find it right now. I will post that as soon as I find it or make another trip into the museum and make another list. Crying or Very sad

Spot Report!
Sgt Scouts Out! Smile

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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:28 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Roy, thanks much for the info!

Hmm.... I'm trying to remember if I saw the York at APG on Saturday. I walked right by where it should have been in the storage lot... I cant remember seeing it specifically. But I dont remember noticing it wasnt there if you know what I mean...

I may try to go up again this Saturday, hopefully the weather will be better.

Actually, I'd be a little annoyed if it was the Ordnance Museum's York... That thing sat behind the museum for many years not quite on display... It would have been a good element for the new museum at Fort Lee....

Neil
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Neil_Baumgardner
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Any sign of that M60A0 from WSMR?

Neil
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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 10:12 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Hi Neil! Hi Folks!

- Neil_Baumgardner

Any sign of that M60A0 from WSMR?


Yes. Sorry, I didn't listed sense you had it in an earlier post along with another Duster and Vulcan.



Hopefully the York that is here, is another vehicle and NOT the one from the museum at APG.

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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Dontos
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 11:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

- Roy_A_Lingle






Wow,...flash from the past!!

I lived in housing at Ft Bliss from 77-80 (as a dependent). Our house was right down the street from the old ADA Museum, and the 'missle park'. That truck was one that I used to climb on during that time. I had some old photos from that time of the static display items, but have been unable to locate them.

Don

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 11:26 pm
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

- Dontos
- Roy_A_Lingle






Wow,...flash from the past!!

I lived in housing at Ft Bliss from 77-80 (as a dependent). Our house was right down the street from the old ADA Museum, and the 'missle park'. That truck was one that I used to climb on during that time. I had some old photos from that time of the static display items, but have been unable to locate them.

Don


So you were part of the abuse it's seen?

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Roy_A_Lingle
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:04 am
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

Hi Bob! Hi Folks!

The old outdoor display had an open gate and was not guarded. Razz Any one of any size could climb all over any of the items without anyone saying anything. As a G.I., I sat in a number of gunner seats to check out the view.

That old Italian truck looks like someone had started to try cleaning it up and repainted it. Razz Sadly, the new paint is already pealing under the hot desert sun. Sad

An update on the data sign next to the M-60 A0 tank. It no longer says M-60A3. In facts it doesn't say much of anything now. The sun has destoryed the writing on all of the outdoor signs. I guess someone didn't select material that could stand up to the UV rays here.

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile

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bsmart
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 12:17 am
Post subject: Re: Fort Bliss - Roy, any new 1AD AFVs on display yet?

- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Bob! Hi Folks!


An update on the data sign next to the M-60 A0 tank. It no longer says M-60A3. In facts it doesn't say much of anything now. The sun has destoryed the writing on all of the outdoor signs. I guess someone didn't select material that could stand up to the UV rays here.

Sgt, Scouts Out! Smile


Aberdeen has had the same problem with the addition of 'acid rain' They now are doing engraved plaques on concrete/stone blocks

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