±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 446
Total: 446
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Home
03: Community Forums
04: Supporters
05: Downloads
06: Home
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Home
14: Member Screenshots
15: Community Forums
16: Home
17: Downloads
18: Community Forums
19: Member Screenshots
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Home
23: Community Forums
24: Downloads
25: Photo Gallery
26: Community Forums
27: Photo Gallery
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Photo Gallery
33: Community Forums
34: Photo Gallery
35: Photo Gallery
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Statistics
39: Home
40: Photo Gallery
41: Photo Gallery
42: Community Forums
43: Photo Gallery
44: Photo Gallery
45: Photo Gallery
46: Community Forums
47: Statistics
48: Community Forums
49: Home
50: Home
51: Community Forums
52: Home
53: Community Forums
54: Photo Gallery
55: Downloads
56: Home
57: Home
58: Downloads
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Home
62: Photo Gallery
63: Home
64: Downloads
65: News
66: Home
67: Community Forums
68: Downloads
69: Your Account
70: Home
71: Home
72: Home
73: Home
74: Community Forums
75: Home
76: Home
77: Member Screenshots
78: Member Screenshots
79: Member Screenshots
80: Member Screenshots
81: Photo Gallery
82: Home
83: Search
84: Photo Gallery
85: Downloads
86: Community Forums
87: Community Forums
88: Photo Gallery
89: Home
90: Community Forums
91: Treasury
92: Photo Gallery
93: Community Forums
94: Home
95: Community Forums
96: Photo Gallery
97: Downloads
98: Home
99: Home
100: Home
101: Downloads
102: Community Forums
103: Community Forums
104: Home
105: Community Forums
106: Home
107: Community Forums
108: Member Screenshots
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Photo Gallery
112: Photo Gallery
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Home
118: Home
119: Community Forums
120: Home
121: Home
122: Photo Gallery
123: Photo Gallery
124: Photo Gallery
125: Home
126: Photo Gallery
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Home
130: Downloads
131: Community Forums
132: News
133: Downloads
134: Community Forums
135: News
136: Photo Gallery
137: Home
138: Home
139: Home
140: Member Screenshots
141: Photo Gallery
142: Home
143: Photo Gallery
144: News
145: News
146: Photo Gallery
147: Home
148: Community Forums
149: Home
150: Home
151: Member Screenshots
152: Home
153: Home
154: Community Forums
155: Home
156: Community Forums
157: Downloads
158: Member Screenshots
159: Community Forums
160: Photo Gallery
161: Photo Gallery
162: Downloads
163: Photo Gallery
164: Downloads
165: Downloads
166: Home
167: News Archive
168: Member Screenshots
169: Home
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Photo Gallery
173: Home
174: Photo Gallery
175: Downloads
176: Community Forums
177: Photo Gallery
178: Photo Gallery
179: Your Account
180: Downloads
181: Photo Gallery
182: Home
183: Photo Gallery
184: Community Forums
185: Downloads
186: Home
187: Home
188: Downloads
189: Home
190: Home
191: Photo Gallery
192: Community Forums
193: Photo Gallery
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Member Screenshots
197: Member Screenshots
198: Home
199: Home
200: Home
201: Home
202: Photo Gallery
203: Community Forums
204: Downloads
205: Home
206: Community Forums
207: Photo Gallery
208: Downloads
209: News Archive
210: Community Forums
211: Home
212: Member Screenshots
213: Member Screenshots
214: Home
215: Photo Gallery
216: Home
217: Home
218: Photo Gallery
219: Community Forums
220: News
221: Home
222: Photo Gallery
223: Tell a Friend
224: News
225: Home
226: Photo Gallery
227: Home
228: Home
229: Photo Gallery
230: Home
231: Photo Gallery
232: Home
233: Downloads
234: Member Screenshots
235: Home
236: Member Screenshots
237: News Archive
238: Home
239: Home
240: Community Forums
241: Home
242: Community Forums
243: News Archive
244: Home
245: Contact
246: Community Forums
247: Photo Gallery
248: Photo Gallery
249: Home
250: Photo Gallery
251: Home
252: Photo Gallery
253: News
254: Community Forums
255: Photo Gallery
256: Member Screenshots
257: Member Screenshots
258: Home
259: Community Forums
260: Home
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Statistics
264: Community Forums
265: Home
266: Home
267: Home
268: Treasury
269: Downloads
270: Home
271: Home
272: Photo Gallery
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Statistics
279: Community Forums
280: Photo Gallery
281: Member Screenshots
282: Photo Gallery
283: Member Screenshots
284: Downloads
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Photo Gallery
290: Community Forums
291: Photo Gallery
292: Photo Gallery
293: Photo Gallery
294: Community Forums
295: Photo Gallery
296: Photo Gallery
297: Photo Gallery
298: News Archive
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Home
303: Photo Gallery
304: Photo Gallery
305: Photo Gallery
306: Photo Gallery
307: Community Forums
308: Supporters
309: LinkToUs
310: Community Forums
311: Community Forums
312: Your Account
313: Photo Gallery
314: Photo Gallery
315: Home
316: News
317: Member Screenshots
318: Photo Gallery
319: Community Forums
320: Home
321: Downloads
322: Community Forums
323: Home
324: Photo Gallery
325: Home
326: Photo Gallery
327: Member Screenshots
328: Home
329: Home
330: Downloads
331: Photo Gallery
332: Home
333: Photo Gallery
334: Downloads
335: Photo Gallery
336: News Archive
337: Photo Gallery
338: Community Forums
339: Member Screenshots
340: News
341: Community Forums
342: Downloads
343: News
344: Photo Gallery
345: Downloads
346: Home
347: Home
348: Home
349: News
350: Community Forums
351: Home
352: Home
353: Photo Gallery
354: Photo Gallery
355: Home
356: Home
357: Community Forums
358: Downloads
359: Photo Gallery
360: Photo Gallery
361: Home
362: Home
363: Home
364: Member Screenshots
365: Home
366: Community Forums
367: Home
368: Member Screenshots
369: Community Forums
370: Home
371: Community Forums
372: Community Forums
373: Community Forums
374: Community Forums
375: Member Screenshots
376: Community Forums
377: Photo Gallery
378: Home
379: Community Forums
380: Photo Gallery
381: Photo Gallery
382: Community Forums
383: Home
384: Community Forums
385: Community Forums
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Downloads
389: Home
390: Community Forums
391: Photo Gallery
392: Photo Gallery
393: Home
394: Downloads
395: Home
396: Home
397: Tell a Friend
398: Photo Gallery
399: Home
400: Home
401: Downloads
402: Community Forums
403: Home
404: Member Screenshots
405: Community Forums
406: Photo Gallery
407: Downloads
408: Community Forums
409: Photo Gallery
410: News
411: Photo Gallery
412: Member Screenshots
413: Home
414: Home
415: Home
416: Downloads
417: News
418: News Archive
419: Community Forums
420: Photo Gallery
421: Photo Gallery
422: Photo Gallery
423: Community Forums
424: News
425: Community Forums
426: Community Forums
427: News
428: Community Forums
429: News
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Photo Gallery
433: Photo Gallery
434: Home
435: Community Forums
436: Photo Gallery
437: Member Screenshots
438: Community Forums
439: Photo Gallery
440: Home
441: Downloads
442: Photo Gallery
443: Community Forums
444: Home
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Let's hear it for Montana!
A public forum for the JG300 Wild Sau Gruppe!
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  JG300 Wild Sau Gruppe Public Forum

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6258
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 11:52 am
Post subject: Let's hear it for Montana!



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Man ordered to wear sandwich board for lying to probation officer

MISSOULA, Mont. - A Whitefish man who lied to his probation officer about having served in the military was ordered Thursday to stand outside the courthouse here wearing a sandwich board that says, "I am a liar. I am not a Marine."

William C. Horvath, 35, pleaded guilty to making false statements, a felony.

U.S District Judge Donald Molloy sentenced him to four months of house arrest and four years of probation. He also ordered him to stand outside the courthouse for 50 hours wearing a sandwich board with large letters on the front that say: "I am a liar. I am not a Marine."

On the back, it must read: "I have never served my country. I have dishonored veterans of all wars."

Molloy, a veteran himself, also ordered Horvath to write letters of apology to newspapers, the U.S. Marine Corps, Veterans of Foreign Wars and the American Legion in Kalispell. The judge said Horvath must admit in the letters that he lied repeatedly about serving and being wounded.

According to a news release from the U.S. attorney's office, Horvath claimed during an interview with a probation officer on Aug. 9, 2001, that he had served in the Marine Corps. The officer was gathering information on Horvath on a prior charge of being a fugitive in possession of firearms or ammunition.

The probation officer then attempted to verify Horvath's military service, but was told by the Marine Corps that there was no record of Horvath ever having served.

Horvath then presented the probation officer with evidence of his time in the military, including photographs and decorations. However, Marine Corps representatives told the probation officer that the evidence contained a variety of inconsistencies.

For instance, Horvath was wearing his uniform improperly; he displayed decorations incorrectly; and equipment and uniforms in the photos either didn't fit the era or were inconsistent with other items in the photos.

A service of the Associated Press(AP)



_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Tanklord
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 817
Location: Louisiana
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 5:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Let's hear it for Montana!

I do a lot work helping the local American Legion post expose these fake vets. D.G. Burkett has a great book about the subject: "Stolen Valor". Bottom line, if you didn't earn it, don't wear it, whether it is a uniform or medals.

_________________
The only thing to do when a son-of-a-bitch looks
cross-eyed at you is to beat the hell out of him right
then and there
Back to top
View user's profile Yahoo Messenger
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6258
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 6:41 pm
Post subject: Re: Let's hear it for Montana!

O'er on another forum before we made our home here, there was a cranky individual (with an alcohol problem) that claimed he'd been under threat of extermination by the tankers (uh-huh...) who had orders to fire on the ASA (radio intercept guys, of which he claimed to be one...a crypto specialist) in their vans if it looked like an overrun was likely in the waning days of Vietnam. (He also claimed Korea service, which by his own profile birthdate, would have made him about 14 at the time).

I know a few ASA guys, bein' as the 8th Radio Research Unit were almost neighbors of ours in VN (we ran some missions in support of their activity) and while they probably deserved shootin' ( Laughing well, they did have tennis courts, air conditioning, and a swimming pool) I can't imagine any tanker in the Army turning their weapons on the spooks just because they "couldn't be captured". With a little help from contacts at the Ranger website for exposing frauds, we blew him away. ("My records were destroyed in the fire in St. Louis"....yeah...that fire only affected Vet's from WWII and before...and for one-two years postwar...not Korea and VN).

I hate these guys....

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"


Last edited by JG300-Ascout on Mon Jul 24, 2006 8:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-Stoopy
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 5840
Location: Group W bench
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 7:50 pm
Post subject: Re: Let's hear it for Montana!

I remember hearing about this case (the original one above) back when it happened. Thought it was WAY cool at the time.

Problem is, for whatever reason it's more common than I ever would have thought. What goes through these guy's heads is impossible to understand.

_________________
"Once your reputation is ruined, you can live quite freely."
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6258
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 8:21 pm
Post subject: Re: Let's hear it for Montana!

- JG300-Stoopy
I remember hearing about this case (the original one above) back when it happened. Thought it was WAY cool at the time.

Problem is, for whatever reason it's more common than I ever would have thought. What goes through these guy's heads is impossible to understand.


Re: Phonies and Frauds

From: POW-MIA InterNetwork

Date: November 17, 2003

"Real war veterans increasingly uncover truths of 'wannabes'

Actor Brian Dennehy is among those who have either exaggerated their experiences or lied outright about serving.

By Mike Hudson

Toronto Blue Jays manager Tim Johnson fired up his baseball teams with bloody tales of his days as a U.S. Marine in Vietnam. War was hell. He had killed a little girl and her brother who happened into the line of fire.

The truth: He had been in the Marine Reserves. An exemption for baseball players had kept him out of combat.

The Blue Jays fired Johnson. Now he manages in the bush leagues.

U.S. Rep. Wes Cooley told reporters he'd fought in Korea as a Special Forces "demolition expert" trained in mountain climbing and escape tactics. The Oregon Republican said he'd engaged in countless secret missions.

The truth: Cooley never left the states during his military career. He hadn't even finished his training when the Korean conflict ended.

After his lies unraveled, Cooley dropped his re-election bid. He was convicted of falsifying campaign documents.

Actor Brian Dennehy, one of the stars of the Rambo movie "First Blood," said he served five years in Vietnam. He'd been hit by shrapnel. Combat, he told Playboy magazine, was "absolute f---ing chaos."

The truth: Dennehy had been a Marine, but his only overseas assignment had been as a football player on a service team in Okinawa.

After a long delay, Dennehy admitted his lies.

Pulitzer-winning historian Joseph Ellis spiced his lectures with tales of his Vietnam service. His unit had been nearby during the My Lai massacre. He served on the staff of America's top commander in Vietnam, Gen. William Westmoreland.

The truth: Ellis never fought in Vietnam. During the war, he taught military history at West Point.

Ellis made a tepid apology: "Even in the best of lives, mistakes are made."

Stolen glory

Veterans call them by all sorts of names: phonies, fakes, imposters, wannabes. Some claim they fought in wars they never served in. Others served honorably but exaggerate their exploits; they claim service in elite units, tell tales of top-secret suicide raids, wear medals they never earned.

Vets and journalists who have delved into the world of military impostors say untold thousands of masqueraders are using make-believe war records to polish resumes, collect veterans benefits, or impress business associates, friends or romantic partners.

"The sheer number is just mind-boggling," said Mark Bowden, author of "Black Hawk Down," a bestselling book about a U.S. Army Ranger engagement in Somalia. "And it's frankly put me in a position of doubting anybody who tells me a war story."

B.G. "Jug" Burkett, a Vietnam vet who is now a stockbroker in Dallas, feels the same way. Almost any time he reads a newspaper article about someone claiming to be a Vietnam veteran, he digs into their background and files a request for their military records.

Over the past 15 years, Burkett said, he has investigated perhaps 2,000 claims of military service; at least 1,500 of them were bogus in one way or another. Rep. Cooley was among the storytellers he helped expose.

Burkett, co-author of "Stolen Valor: How the Vietnam Generation Was Robbed of its Heroes and its History," is in many ways the godfather of a growing network of debunkers of false military claims. One retired SEAL commander told The New York Times that he and others connected with the elite Navy unit had exposed more than 7,000 SEAL impostors.

Waving the flag

It can take time, but it's almost always possible to prove or disprove whether someone served in the military, where they served, whether they saw combat, and whether they earned medals.

The military keeps records on almost everything. On a typical day in Vietnam, Burkett noted, there were always more clerks with typewriters than riflemen in the field. "Everything is done in triplicate," he said.

People should be skeptical, he said, about those who wear heroism on their sleeves, tell wild tales of wartime mayhem or claim to have led clandestine missions that the government won't acknowledge.

In his book, Burkett notes the story of a man named John Murray who claimed to be an ex-prisoner of war and retired lieutenant colonel. During a POW-MIA Day ceremony in New York, Murray stepped forward with a tiny framed American flag. He said he had made it in his POW camp by shredding his clothing and dyeing the cloth with berries and his own blood. Each day he raised the flag on a bamboo stick so he and his fellow prisoners could honor it.

He got permission to hold a ceremony on National Park Service grounds and persuaded retired Gen. William Westmorland to attend.

That night, Murray, driving drunk and on antidepressants, smashed his car into a utility pole. Police efforts to ascertain his true identity - he claimed three different birthdays and had two Social Security numbers - unraveled his patchwork of lies. Murray had never been in the military. He later pleaded guilty to lying to obtain a government permit.

Murray explained his deception by saying, "I only wanted to help."

Victims and heroes

False warriors are a phenomenon that happens after every war. Historian William Marvel has written that every one of the last dozen recognized living Confederate veterans was bogus. Marvel found that the last one, Walter Williams of Texas, would have been 5 in 1860 and 10 when the war ended. Williams didn't begin identifying himself as a Civil War veteran until 1932, when he applied for a Confederate pension.

Society honors warriors. Movies and television are obsessed with war. Many Americans equate honor and masculinity with military service. Men - and women - with low self-images sometimes try to build up themselves by claiming service and even heroism, say those who have investigated the problem. Cooks and clerks and others who served in noncombat slots feel guilt that they had it easy compared with comrades who risked and sometimes gave their lives in battle.

Society is fascinated, too, with victims and heroes. For self-aggrandizers, Burkett said, Vietnam is alluring because its tortured history allows them to meld two identities. Like Rambo, they can be both heroes who fought for their country as well as victims betrayed by politicians and the public.

Some fakers are compulsive liars who convince themselves of the truth of their own stories. And while most fakers are trying to bolster fragile egos, some use their stories for grander aims: to win elections, steal money, hype their public images as entertainers or business executives, make political statements for or against U.S. military actions.

When confronted with evidence of their duplicity, Burkett said, most will stick with their stories, even presenting doctored and forged documents for support. "It's very rare that they'll cough it up."

Undying beliefs

In his book, Burkett argues that the problem goes beyond acts of individual dishonor. He says military pretenders often appear in news stories that contribute to stereotypes of Vietnam vets as violent, drug-addled, psychologically wasted and homeless.

The image is so universally accepted, he says, reporters and producers are quick to use stories that fit the stereotype, and rarely check the veracity of the source.

And what happens when someone questions the record of a veteran quoted in a news story? Most of the time, Burkett said, reporters, editors and producers refuse to admit their mistakes.

Bowden, the "Black Hawk Down" author, found this to be true when he did his own investigation of the media's handling of this problem: Many journalists simply didn't care about finding out the truth. "It was just an outrage," Bowden said. "It was frankly somewhat disillusioning to me."

The media and the public live by stereotypes; rarely do they willingly forsake long-held beliefs. It's not an easy battle to challenge oft-repeated stories of a community hero's valor, or to correct a flawed but long-accepted historical record.

Burkett said one thing his campaign has taught him is that people want to hang onto their myths, whether it's a society certain that Vietnam veterans are woebegone cases, or a spouse who wants to blame her husband's problems on the trauma of war.

"They want to believe," he said. For some people, "there's a point where, once you cross that threshold, it doesn't matter whether it's true or not." "

www.aiipowmia.com/inte...nabes.html

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-fr8ycat
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 13, 2005
Posts: 1530
Location: Los Angeles
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 3:13 am
Post subject: Re: Let's hear it for Montana!

- JG300-Ascout

Actor Brian Dennehy is among those who have either exaggerated their experiences or lied outright about serving.


That's why Rambo kicked his butt! Laughing

It is sad. I never heard the Dennehy story, blew me away.
Back to top
View user's profile MSN Messenger Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  JG300 Wild Sau Gruppe Public Forum
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum