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A little quiz....
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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Dontos
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Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 1:30 pm Post subject: Re: A little quiz....
- SFC_Jeff_Button Would it be the "Chilly Bowl" area? Not familiar with that name.... Don

Maple_Leaf_Eh
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Posted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 7:55 pm
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

- Tanklord

I went with the LAARNG to Fort Irwin in the summer of 87. We were a roundout brigade for 5th ID. Boy did we stink up the joint. When I get back home, I will dig out the photos.

At least you admited playing in your usual sandbox and training areas didn't prepare you for the simulated battle conditions of NTC. Being a train wreck in peacetime is considered lucky; doing that in battle is unacceptible.

A friend of mine is a professional rowing coach. In the '90's he was coaching the Canadian women's developmental team that produced some of our most successful Olympic rowers. His view on winning was simple. Anyone can win at home. To become a champion you have to go on the road.

SFC_Jeff_Button
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Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2007 12:05 am Post subject: Re: A little quiz....
Don, The "Chilly Bowl" was on the south / east area of the training area, EG57000300. The "Red Ball Express" road ran right by it and on the other side of the RBE was "Porta-Potty Wadi" The RBE ran north/east towards the "Flagpole" after crossing through "1SG Wash". _________________ SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"

Dontos
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Posted: Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:19 am Post subject: Re: A little quiz....
- Dontos Don Location is Orange dot, Camera angle is red arrow. Don _________________ "Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."

SFC_Jeff_Button
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:21 am
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

Man, you were clear up in Northern Corridor! Thats "Drinkwater Lake" (dry) off to the right. The "Hot Dog" would have been the hill mas in the rear of the photo. beyond that about 4.25 clicks would be the boundry of the post. You must have gotton to this spot by either going through "Engineer Gap" or "FSS Gap" from central corridor, or you came from "Andy's Gap"/"Refridgerator Gap" from the East, via the "Flag Pole" location. Any of these ringing bells in anyones heads?! Once you crossed into Northern corridor, esspecially in the winter, the weather was automatically 20 degree's colder, ( or hotter in the summer time, you were that much closer to the actual Mojave Desert).
I take it you were up there either hiding/running from OPFOR, hoping to out flank the OPFOR, or were resting between battles out of sight awaiting the next days battle, haha. Got anymore photos of NTC? I like this little "guess where I am" quiz. Kinda like "Find Waldo" for the NTC vets. Take care.

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Dontos
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:52 am Post subject: Re: A little quiz....
Jeff The photo was taken of me sitting patiently awaiting the bulldozers to arrive and dig my tanks fighting position for the upcoming live fire defense. _________________ "Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."

Burik
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 5:12 am Post subject: Re: A little quiz....
Can you guess where I am?! Sorry, I couldn't resist. This one is quite easy for anyone who has been there within the past few years. I am going back on Monday to finish up a project I am working on. I was last there (for the first time, too) back in Feb 06 following a Stryker Bde. This time it is one of the Bdes of the 3rd ID. It's going to be cooold. Bob

SFC_Jeff_Button
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Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 5:53 pm Post subject: Re: A little quiz....
"Painted Rocks" would be the first picture. The second might be out by East Township, by the Flag Pole? All those towns seemed to be built alike. _________________ SFC Jeff Button "High Angle Hell"

Burik
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Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 12:29 am
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

Jeff,

Medina Jabal/Tiefort City. Yeah, I guess they all look alike. From the few that I got to see Tiefort City was the largest. Tunnel complex (you can see a disguised entrance behind me), a few newly built prefab buildings that will one day turn into a 300 building city, and the best part - a hot dog stand for the roleplayers and softies like me.

Within spitting distance just off to the right of the photo was FOB Denver.

One thing I can say, I am not looking forward to riding in the Humvee again. My fat butt does not fit so well in those tiny seats. I always felt like I was going to be pitched out on turns and bumps, despite wearing the seat belt. All those bumps did not help my back and butt.

I suppose Junction City and Tiefort City are the easiest for the PAO to cover with the media, but I hope I get to see some other parts this time, like the helicopter FOB. I'll be sure to post a pic or two when I get back.

Bob

SFC_Jeff_Button
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Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 2:47 am
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

The PAO's are taking you to the two nearest towns. Tiefort City is only about 10-12 clicks from the main post area. However if you can catch a ride out to East Gate Township, (by the Flag Pole, may have a new city name now) it's about a 38-40 clicks away by taking the main way through Central Corridor. I'm sur eits ever changing to closely reflect the changing enviroment in the middle east.

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Burik
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Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 4:31 am
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

I got permission to hang with the OPFOR overnight at Four Corners - I think that is Junction City.

I am not a camper! I'm not sure what I am getting into. I know I am going to freeze even sleeping in one of those buildings. Have any of you guys spent the night in the new environment? I know there is no guaranteed "action" but what might I expect and/or be ready for? I suppose I can get some candid photos of roleplayers and such even if nothing happens (I am developing a history of the NTC and there will be an emphasis on the new mission).

Bob

SFC_Jeff_Button
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 1:22 am
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

Burik,
I was an OPFOR role player out at East Gate Township. My role was that of a Soccer player that was sectretly invloved in covert op's against American Forces. As an 11C, (Mortarman) we would go out at night and lob rounds against the "enemy" Americans, and then quickly retreat back to our towns/buildings before being caught. I must say it was easy pickings. Blu-for was always asleep, and could litrerally careless about our attacks. I could tell you numerous stories of walking into tents, buildings, between Helo's at the FARP, dropping Chem-light grenades into tank hatches, etc...
Anyway, one night around 0200hrs, BLUFOR entered the town and had everyone empty the buildings. We all have made up ID cards and had to present them. Suddenly I was told to get on my knee's with my hands behind my head. Well since I didn't "know" english I just stood there. BLUFOR got mad immediately because they don't understand the role I'm playing and they know I know english and can't understand why I dont go to my knee's.
Anyway, I was detained and driven across the Central Corridor to somewhere arounf 4-Corners where I was interogated by the S-2 personnel for a couple hours. I played it up and acted like an a-- pissing off all those I came in contact with. haha! I was put into a 10X10 concertina holding area outside until I was eventually released. Ah the good times! That whole episode came about because I lead a raid against a radio relay station that was gaurded by one M1 and it's crew. The crew was asleep in a tent and we threw chem-light greandes on the tank and into the tent where they were. The OC's, (observer controllers) accessed us as a complete success with the site wiped out. The tank crew didn't care. We yelled at them, called them names, and cursed them repeatedly and they did nothing, pathertic! They were from 1st CAV if I remeber right. We also dealt with Marines from that same rotation and killed a bunch of them with a 155mm round buried on the bridge to West gate Township.
We were able to enter and leave the town pretty easy by hanging flood lamps in the town that aimed out into the desert. This ruined the BLUFOR ability to observe the town at night with night-vision because it "washed-out" their AN-PVS7's and other night vision devises.
Enough of my babble, you should stay plenty warm by dressing properly. The Mojave gets COLD at night. That dry wind/air will crack your lips in a heart-beat so wear plenty of lip-balm!

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Dontos
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:37 am
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

Jeff

Immediately following my return from Bosnia, we began to prep for an NTC rotation ( thankfully my last).

Having just spent 8 months doing 'OOTW', 'We' had a little trouble dealing with the BS at NTC. Perhaps it should have been taken into account, but we were treated as if we had NO experience in the subject. And this by evaluators and Opfor who hadn't left the Mojave Desert in several years.

(pardon the rant...)

Perhaps the this was the case with your rotation.

Most units are now populated with personnel with multiple combat tours. 'Playing' to standards (MTP and such) is real difficult when you've 'been there / done that'...

Just my opinion...
Don

Joe_D
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:33 pm
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

Hi Jeff, Dontos,

Jeff, I must agree with Dontos. It's very hard to take the training serious when you just left the big sand box a little over a year before. Couple this with knowing that in a few weeks after coming back from NTC you will be gone for a year or more makes you put what your doing in the "Who Cares" department.
The role playing that the OPFOR does has it's merits but the X-ROE ties the Blue Force's hands. How you act as the insurgent/ COB plays a lot differently if you really knew you could possibly get killed/ Beat down. It's real easy to piss off people when there are no real consequences. Same goes for the Blue Force. Hard to take an exercise seriously after doing it for real when the worst that can happen is you finally get to rest when your killed.

Joe D

Roy_A_Lingle
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Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:51 pm
Post subject: Re: A little quiz....

Hi Don and Joe! Hi Folks!

It's good to hear training haven't changed over the years.

Been there done that myself only my event took place in Germany back around 1975 or 1976.

About six months after the 3rd ACR returned to Ft. Bliss from Desert Storm it went to the NTC and did very badly against the OpFor.

Sgt, Scouts Out!

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