±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 708
Total: 708
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Home
03: Member Screenshots
04: Photo Gallery
05: Community Forums
06: Member Screenshots
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Home
10: Community Forums
11: Your Account
12: Member Screenshots
13: Home
14: Home
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Photo Gallery
18: Your Account
19: Member Screenshots
20: Community Forums
21: News Archive
22: Community Forums
23: Home
24: Photo Gallery
25: Home
26: Photo Gallery
27: Home
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Downloads
32: Photo Gallery
33: Photo Gallery
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: News Archive
38: Community Forums
39: Photo Gallery
40: Statistics
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: Member Screenshots
45: Your Account
46: News Archive
47: Community Forums
48: Home
49: Home
50: Photo Gallery
51: Home
52: Home
53: Community Forums
54: Community Forums
55: Community Forums
56: Community Forums
57: Community Forums
58: Statistics
59: Photo Gallery
60: Community Forums
61: Your Account
62: Community Forums
63: Downloads
64: Home
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Member Screenshots
68: Member Screenshots
69: Member Screenshots
70: Community Forums
71: Photo Gallery
72: Downloads
73: Home
74: Home
75: Photo Gallery
76: Member Screenshots
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Home
84: Downloads
85: Member Screenshots
86: Community Forums
87: Member Screenshots
88: Community Forums
89: Home
90: Community Forums
91: News Archive
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Community Forums
96: Downloads
97: Community Forums
98: Community Forums
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Member Screenshots
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: News Archive
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Member Screenshots
111: Home
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Member Screenshots
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Photo Gallery
123: Member Screenshots
124: News Archive
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Member Screenshots
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Member Screenshots
131: Community Forums
132: Photo Gallery
133: Home
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Photo Gallery
138: Community Forums
139: Photo Gallery
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Home
146: Member Screenshots
147: Community Forums
148: Member Screenshots
149: News Archive
150: Member Screenshots
151: Photo Gallery
152: Member Screenshots
153: Community Forums
154: Member Screenshots
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Member Screenshots
161: Community Forums
162: Home
163: Downloads
164: Home
165: Your Account
166: Member Screenshots
167: Community Forums
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Photo Gallery
171: Downloads
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Home
175: Member Screenshots
176: Member Screenshots
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Community Forums
184: Community Forums
185: Home
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: News Archive
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Member Screenshots
197: Community Forums
198: Downloads
199: Member Screenshots
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Member Screenshots
205: Community Forums
206: Photo Gallery
207: Community Forums
208: Member Screenshots
209: Community Forums
210: Home
211: Community Forums
212: Member Screenshots
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Community Forums
217: Community Forums
218: Home
219: Community Forums
220: Your Account
221: Community Forums
222: Photo Gallery
223: Statistics
224: Community Forums
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Photo Gallery
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Community Forums
233: Home
234: Downloads
235: Home
236: Statistics
237: Community Forums
238: Community Forums
239: Home
240: Member Screenshots
241: Downloads
242: Member Screenshots
243: Downloads
244: News
245: Community Forums
246: News Archive
247: Home
248: News Archive
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Member Screenshots
252: Photo Gallery
253: Community Forums
254: Member Screenshots
255: Photo Gallery
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Community Forums
260: Community Forums
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Community Forums
265: Downloads
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Photo Gallery
269: Home
270: Downloads
271: Home
272: Home
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Community Forums
279: Member Screenshots
280: Member Screenshots
281: Member Screenshots
282: Community Forums
283: Member Screenshots
284: Community Forums
285: News
286: Community Forums
287: Member Screenshots
288: Community Forums
289: Photo Gallery
290: Community Forums
291: News Archive
292: Community Forums
293: Community Forums
294: Home
295: Community Forums
296: Community Forums
297: Downloads
298: Member Screenshots
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Home
303: Home
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Downloads
308: Photo Gallery
309: News Archive
310: News Archive
311: Home
312: Downloads
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Photo Gallery
316: Community Forums
317: Member Screenshots
318: Home
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: News Archive
325: Community Forums
326: Member Screenshots
327: Community Forums
328: Photo Gallery
329: Community Forums
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: News
335: Downloads
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Member Screenshots
340: Home
341: Downloads
342: Home
343: Community Forums
344: Home
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: Community Forums
348: Home
349: Community Forums
350: News Archive
351: Home
352: Photo Gallery
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: News Archive
356: Member Screenshots
357: Community Forums
358: Downloads
359: Downloads
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Home
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: News Archive
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: News Archive
371: Member Screenshots
372: Photo Gallery
373: Community Forums
374: Home
375: News Archive
376: Photo Gallery
377: Photo Gallery
378: Home
379: Home
380: Community Forums
381: Home
382: Home
383: Community Forums
384: Member Screenshots
385: Home
386: Tell a Friend
387: Statistics
388: Community Forums
389: News Archive
390: Community Forums
391: Community Forums
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Community Forums
398: Photo Gallery
399: Community Forums
400: Photo Gallery
401: Community Forums
402: Photo Gallery
403: Photo Gallery
404: Community Forums
405: Photo Gallery
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Photo Gallery
409: Community Forums
410: Photo Gallery
411: Community Forums
412: Supporters
413: Home
414: Community Forums
415: Community Forums
416: Photo Gallery
417: Community Forums
418: Member Screenshots
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Community Forums
423: Home
424: Community Forums
425: Community Forums
426: Community Forums
427: Home
428: Community Forums
429: News Archive
430: Community Forums
431: Downloads
432: Community Forums
433: Community Forums
434: Photo Gallery
435: Community Forums
436: Downloads
437: Downloads
438: Member Screenshots
439: Community Forums
440: Community Forums
441: Photo Gallery
442: Community Forums
443: Photo Gallery
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Home
447: Community Forums
448: Member Screenshots
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Downloads
452: Downloads
453: Home
454: Home
455: Community Forums
456: Photo Gallery
457: Community Forums
458: Downloads
459: Community Forums
460: Home
461: Home
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Downloads
469: Community Forums
470: Member Screenshots
471: Community Forums
472: Community Forums
473: Home
474: Member Screenshots
475: Home
476: Community Forums
477: Member Screenshots
478: Community Forums
479: Downloads
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Community Forums
486: Community Forums
487: Member Screenshots
488: Member Screenshots
489: Community Forums
490: Community Forums
491: Community Forums
492: Community Forums
493: Community Forums
494: Downloads
495: Community Forums
496: News Archive
497: Community Forums
498: Community Forums
499: Member Screenshots
500: Home
501: Downloads
502: Member Screenshots
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: Community Forums
506: Community Forums
507: Community Forums
508: Community Forums
509: Photo Gallery
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: Member Screenshots
513: Community Forums
514: Community Forums
515: News Archive
516: News Archive
517: News Archive
518: Member Screenshots
519: Community Forums
520: Member Screenshots
521: Member Screenshots
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Community Forums
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Downloads
528: Photo Gallery
529: Downloads
530: Community Forums
531: Community Forums
532: Community Forums
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Member Screenshots
536: News Archive
537: Community Forums
538: Supporters
539: Community Forums
540: Community Forums
541: Photo Gallery
542: Community Forums
543: Statistics
544: Member Screenshots
545: Photo Gallery
546: Member Screenshots
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Community Forums
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Member Screenshots
553: Community Forums
554: Community Forums
555: Member Screenshots
556: Home
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Community Forums
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Community Forums
568: Home
569: Community Forums
570: Member Screenshots
571: Community Forums
572: Member Screenshots
573: Community Forums
574: Photo Gallery
575: Member Screenshots
576: Community Forums
577: Member Screenshots
578: Community Forums
579: Community Forums
580: Community Forums
581: Photo Gallery
582: Community Forums
583: Community Forums
584: Community Forums
585: News Archive
586: Community Forums
587: Community Forums
588: Community Forums
589: News
590: Community Forums
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Photo Gallery
595: Community Forums
596: Community Forums
597: Photo Gallery
598: Downloads
599: Community Forums
600: Downloads
601: Community Forums
602: Home
603: Community Forums
604: Community Forums
605: Photo Gallery
606: Community Forums
607: Community Forums
608: Downloads
609: Community Forums
610: Home
611: Member Screenshots
612: Downloads
613: Community Forums
614: Home
615: Community Forums
616: News Archive
617: Downloads
618: Statistics
619: Community Forums
620: Community Forums
621: Community Forums
622: Downloads
623: Downloads
624: Community Forums
625: Community Forums
626: Community Forums
627: Community Forums
628: News
629: Community Forums
630: Community Forums
631: Community Forums
632: Photo Gallery
633: Statistics
634: Community Forums
635: Downloads
636: Community Forums
637: Community Forums
638: Home
639: Photo Gallery
640: Community Forums
641: Your Account
642: News Archive
643: Community Forums
644: Community Forums
645: Community Forums
646: Downloads
647: Your Account
648: Statistics
649: News Archive
650: Home
651: Community Forums
652: Community Forums
653: Community Forums
654: Downloads
655: Community Forums
656: Community Forums
657: News
658: Downloads
659: Photo Gallery
660: News Archive
661: Member Screenshots
662: Member Screenshots
663: Community Forums
664: Photo Gallery
665: Community Forums
666: Home
667: Photo Gallery
668: Home
669: Home
670: Photo Gallery
671: Community Forums
672: Downloads
673: Photo Gallery
674: Member Screenshots
675: Community Forums
676: Community Forums
677: Community Forums
678: Photo Gallery
679: Photo Gallery
680: Community Forums
681: Home
682: Statistics
683: Community Forums
684: Community Forums
685: Photo Gallery
686: Home
687: Community Forums
688: Home
689: Photo Gallery
690: Community Forums
691: Community Forums
692: Community Forums
693: Photo Gallery
694: Downloads
695: Home
696: Community Forums
697: Community Forums
698: Your Account
699: News Archive
700: Statistics
701: Home
702: Community Forums
703: News Archive
704: Community Forums
705: Home
706: Member Screenshots
707: Member Screenshots
708: Home

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Armor penetration formula
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
blair
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 87

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 4:05 am
Post subject: Armor penetration formula

A long time ago I had cme across an article that described a formula regarding the increased resistance of armor depending on the degree of angle. I'm sure I have my numbers mixed up but basically the formula stated that If you took a a plate of armor 2 inches thick and then angled it by 25 degrees the armor would then have the same penetration resistance depth of 4 inches of vertical armor.

The higher the angle then the higher the resistence depth.

Does anyone know any more about this principle/theory?
Back to top
View user's profile
JimWeb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1439
Location: The back of beyond
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 9:29 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Blimey this is really basic geometry!!!

Pick up a book which will represent our armour plate - measure its width then angle it at 45 degrees and measure it from corner to corner - That how thick the armour becomes along the horizontal....

Rolling Eyes

_________________
TTFN
Jim

If your not a member of JED then your
not serious about anything military..

***********************
www.jedsite.info
JED Military Equipment
***********************
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:55 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Where is Lorrin (from the old board) when you need him Rolling Eyes

If I understand your question Jim has the basics laid out pretty well. When I explain this on tours at Aberdeen I use my hand spaced about3" apart first vertically then at an angle. A 45 degree angle gives you about 1.707 times the thickness that vertical plate will, a 60 degree angle doubles the thickness. This is all geometry , Sines & Cosines (depending on if you are measuring the angle from the horizontal or vertical)

There would be a higher chance of the round 'glancing off' as the angle increases but I'm not sure this would be easy to calculate especially since the shape of the nose and the relative hardness probably play into the factoring.

And if you hit an angled plate (say the 47 degree nose of a Sherman) at an angle off of dead ahead (say 45 degrees off to the side) the angle effect is compunded. ( you get thickness * 1.7 (approx factor for 47 degree armor * 1.7 factor for the angle shot) or a total increase in thickness of 2.89.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
JWB2
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 199

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 7:29 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

IIRC ricochet or "skip" starts when the slope is 45* or greater. Firing tests have shown that resistance can actually degrade when the slope exceeds about 56*. I imagine these facts heavily influenced the slope of both the Sherman and the Panther glacis plates.
Back to top
View user's profile
JimWeb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1439
Location: The back of beyond
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:30 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- JWB2
IIRC ricochet or "skip" starts when the slope is 45* or greater. Firing tests have shown that resistance can actually degrade when the slope exceeds about 56*. I imagine these facts heavily influenced the slope of both the Sherman and the Panther glacis plates.


Yes but rounds have been designed to overcome this by having flat angled fronts under ballistic caps to enable them to dig in.

Cool

_________________
TTFN
Jim

If your not a member of JED then your
not serious about anything military..

***********************
www.jedsite.info
JED Military Equipment
***********************
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
clausb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 146

PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 10:08 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- blair
A long time ago I had cme across an article that described a formula regarding the increased resistance of armor depending on the degree of angle. I'm sure I have my numbers mixed up but basically the formula stated that If you took a a plate of armor 2 inches thick and then angled it by 25 degrees the armor would then have the same penetration resistance depth of 4 inches of vertical armor.

The higher the angle then the higher the resistence depth.

Does anyone know any more about this principle/theory?


Goes like this:

Y/cos(Z)=X

where Y is the thickness of the armour plate
where Z is the angle of the armour, with vertical=0
and X is the effective thickness of the armour.

As an example using the frontal hull armour of the Soviet T34 , you get

Y=45mm
Z=60 degrees

and thus:

45/cos(60)=90

meaning that the distance the projectile has to travel through the armour plate is doubled when the plate is sloped at 60 degrees.

However......

That is not by any means equal to the actual resistance of the armour plate in any condition. Far from it. To even begin to approach that issue, you need to take into account a large number of factors including armour quality and hardness, projectile type (AP, APC, sub-caliber, HEAT etc.), projectile design, projectile caliber, projectile hardness and a lot of other elements.
The problem is mainly that while a perpendicular hit on the armour plate will spend most of its energy on going through the armour plate, once the projectile hits a sloped surface, it will have a tendency to move away from the plate and under the right conditions simply bounce off. Whether it bounces or not depends among other things on the shape of the projectiles nose: a pointed nose will tend to bounce, a flat nose will tend to dig in. It also depends on the relationship between the diameter of the projectile (d) and the thickness of the armour (t): if the so-called t/d ratio is more than 1 (say, 45mm of armour hit by a 37mm round) hitting, the projectile will be more likely to bounce off. If the t/d ratio is less than 1 (say, 45mm of armour hit by 75mm projectile) then the projectile will be less likely to bounce off.

It soon gets very complicated....... Smile

I'm deeply suspicious of the idea that an angle of more than 56 degrees will degrade performance, at least not in general. If that was the case, then tanks would have 55 degree slopes on their front hull and no more, which is clearly not the case. The T34 had 60 degree slope on the front hull and post-war tanks tend to get as much slope as possible, just look at Soviet designs. Also, US tanks like the M48 (60 degree front hull) and the M60 (65 degree front hull) shows an increase in slope over the WWII designs (M4 Sherman 56 and 47 degrees, M26 Pershing 56 degrees).

Claus B
Back to top
View user's profile
LeeW
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 26, 2006
Posts: 61

PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:09 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

In addition once a projectile starts to penetrate it will tend to turn toward the orthoganal.

Face hardened vs homogenious can effect this as well.

For naval vessels there some info at:
www.navweaps.com/index...x_tech.htm
and of course:
www.navweaps.com/index...nathan.htm
which has some formulas and programs as well as info.

Unfortuantly I don't know of a simlar site for AFVs some of this will relate but exactly how is not my area of expertise.
Back to top
View user's profile
JWB2
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 199

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 12:43 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Yes but rounds have been designed to overcome this by having flat angled fronts under ballistic caps to enable them to dig in.

That only happens if the projectile is harder than the armor.

I'm deeply suspicious of the idea that an angle of more than 56 degrees will degrade performance, at least not in general.

That is the result of a firing test conducted by the US Army. IIRC it was 90mm vs Panther type armor so it probably has a lot to do with undermatch. Post war tank armor was desiged to deal with HVAP and early APDS.
Back to top
View user's profile
clausb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 146

PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:22 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

That is the result of a firing test conducted by the US Army. IIRC it was 90mm vs Panther type armor so it probably has a lot to do with undermatch. Post war tank armor was desiged to deal with HVAP and early APDS.


But the T-34s armour wasn't.....

90mm projectile vs 80mm of Panther frontal armour gives a T/D of 0.88 which is not exactly a massive "undermatch", in fact it is in the same ballpark as, say, a German 75mm vs a late-war Sherman hull at 63mm (T/D 0.84). In the latter case, your logic would dictate that hitting the Shermans armour at an angle of 40 degrees from the side would have a better chance of penetring than a hit at 30 degrees from the side. That sounds rather counterintuitive to me.....
I've yet to see an actual test result, official penetration data or an emperically based penetration formula that would result in what you describe - resistance of armour degrading at angles over 56 degrees. So unless you can point to the exact tests, I'd have to say that it is either a fairy tale or at least a misunderstanding.

Claus B
Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:33 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- bsmart
Where is Lorrin (from the old board) when you need him Rolling Eyes


We'll remember you said that, Bob...especially if he actually shows up and registers to post. Wink (Be sure to notify Bushy, he'll need to lay on an extra terabyte or two of bandwidth). Alas, we don't have Russ on hand (owing to other "distractions" at the moment, lucky him) to keep him in check if he does.

...and I'm on my way out of the country for a couple of weeks, so if his apparition appears....handle it! Mr. Green
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 9:18 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Hey, I never had a problem with Lorrin. I didn't agree with all his theories (Heck I'm not sure I even understood all his theories Rolling Eyes ) but he did bring a passion and dedication to the discussions.

Have a good trip (you gotta arrange for a layover in the Philly/ Baltimore/DC) region on one of them so we can visit Aberdeen) and we'll try to keep everyone under control (or at least keep them from parking the tanks on the zoomies runway)

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2067
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 9:59 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

Doug,

Alas, we don't have Russ on hand (owing to other "distractions" at the moment, lucky him)


I was wondering how Russ was doing, good to here he's OK, I miss his posts.

Joe D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
piney
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 2330
Location: Republic of Southern New Jersey
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 2:08 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

I miss Russ too. no fun not having to warn against spit takes

Jeff Lewis
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- Joe_D
Doug,

Alas, we don't have Russ on hand (owing to other "distractions" at the moment, lucky him)


I was wondering how Russ was doing, good to here he's OK, I miss his posts.

Joe D


I spoke with Russ recently, and am happy to report that his absence is due to his having discovered romance that is occupying a lot of his time, which inexplicably, he is finding preferable to the company of a bunch of fellow curmudgeons. "Bully for him", I say! We mean to do a tour of the El Monte collection soon (when I get in off the road for more than two weeks at a time Rolling Eyes ) but he sounded great!

I miss his humor as well.....

This update brought you courtesy of the Flagship Lounge at Chicago O'Hare Airport....
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
JWB2
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 25, 2006
Posts: 199

PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 12:50 am
Post subject: Re: Armor penetration formula

- clausb
That is the result of a firing test conducted by the US Army. IIRC it was 90mm vs Panther type armor so it probably has a lot to do with undermatch. Post war tank armor was desiged to deal with HVAP and early APDS.


But the T-34s armour wasn't.....

90mm projectile vs 80mm of Panther frontal armour gives a T/D of 0.88 which is not exactly a massive "undermatch", in fact it is in the same ballpark as, say, a German 75mm vs a late-war Sherman hull at 63mm (T/D 0.84). In the latter case, your logic would dictate that hitting the Shermans armour at an angle of 40 degrees from the side would have a better chance of penetring than a hit at 30 degrees from the side. That sounds rather counterintuitive to me.....
I've yet to see an actual test result, official penetration data or an emperically based penetration formula that would result in what you describe - resistance of armour degrading at angles over 56 degrees. So unless you can point to the exact tests, I'd have to say that it is either a fairy tale or at least a misunderstanding.

Claus B

I got the info from C.G. Erickson a few years ago at one of the visits to Littlefields.
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum