Com-Central.net

- Roy_A_Lingle

Hi AJ2! Hi Folks!

- armyjunk2

Anyone have anything special they would like me to attempt to photograph this weekend, I'll do my best to do it, but no guarantees....

A 360 walk around of the XM800T would be great if you have the time AJ2.

Thanks,
Sgt, Scouts Out!

- A-109E

What's the story on this vehicle? I mean, beyond what I can read on the plaques.

--Bob Steinbrunn

- Doug_Kibbey

- A-109E

What's the story on this vehicle? I mean, beyond what I can read on the plaques.

--Bob Steinbrunn

Continnuing saga of the eternal struggle between wheeled vs. tracked proponents, especially vis-a-vis the recon role...so they built and tested both versions. In the end, neither offered significant mobility advantages over vehicles already in the inventory (like the M113) and represented a huge investment that would have diverted funds from other programs. It was fortunate that neither was pursued because the Bradley was not far over the horizon and this was money far better spent. Too little, too late for the returns.

This is why I maintain now that the Dutch YPR concept series should have been adopted as an interim vehicle instead of wasting money on schemes like this...proven, something we already had experience with. Basically a Product Improved M113A1 without the funky turret/hatch layout of our version that never got off the boards.

The wheeled version:

- Neil_Baumgardner

Doug, I think we continue to disagree on the subject, although I'll defer to your Armor Board knowledge. But if Hunnicutt's Bradley has any weight (page 244), it appears that the XM800T at least was superior than the M113:

"In comparing the two XM800 vehicles with the baseline M113A1, the test report concluded that the XM800T was superior to both the M113A1 and the XM800W in overal performance as an ARSV.
Neil

- Neil_Baumgardner

Okay, understood & granted. We're talking the age-old capability vs cost. Was a dedicated scout vehicle worth the cost.

However, I would point out that the abandonment of the ARSV led to both HMMWV and Bradley mounted scouts. And the Army has recently abandoned HMMWV mounted scout units as too vulnerable, leaving "scouting in a Winnebago" as the only mechanized scout capability (besides Stryker RSTA vehicles - which would probably be good scout vehicles across the board IMO).

Neil

- Doug_Kibbey

Bob (A 109 E) can probably relate to this, but I think of an analogy to the Air Cav "pink team"...the light scouting helicopter...nimble, but vulnerable, with a gunship (or two) in support. Something like a "mothership".

- A-109E

There are two Loaches here and I ain't gonna tell you where they are. You hafta find 'em on your own,

- Doug_Kibbey

There is always a problem with the concept of a dedicated "Scout Vehicle"...if it's mobile/fast enough, it's necessarily vulnerable to all sorts of stuff....the converse situation is obvious. That's why I think a dedicated Scout vehicle (on land) is an anachronism and has been for a couple of decades. Scouting needs to be a combined operation itself...with a light arm and a backup. Not unlike the Cav units that combined tanks with lighter AFV's or even Sheridans for scouting. Bob (A 109 E) can probably relate to this, but I think of an analogy to the Air Cav "pink team"...the light scouting helicopter...nimble, but vulnerable, with a gunship (or two) in support. Something like a "mothership".

Increasingly, the need for this as a dedicated unit is probably diminished over what it was in the '70's, what with UAV's, other imaging, etc., but it's always nice to send somebody out there for a look-see without getting your a$$ shot off just for the effort. And it's nice if you can carry some guys with you, just in case. Three-man scout vehicle...I'm not sure the need still exists..., but that's just me.