±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 396
Total: 396
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Your Account
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Photo Gallery
06: Photo Gallery
07: Photo Gallery
08: Photo Gallery
09: Community Forums
10: Downloads
11: Member Screenshots
12: Downloads
13: Home
14: Member Screenshots
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Downloads
19: Member Screenshots
20: Member Screenshots
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: News Archive
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Home
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Member Screenshots
34: Member Screenshots
35: Community Forums
36: Photo Gallery
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Statistics
41: Your Account
42: Community Forums
43: Community Forums
44: News Archive
45: Photo Gallery
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Home
50: Member Screenshots
51: Community Forums
52: News
53: Photo Gallery
54: Member Screenshots
55: Photo Gallery
56: Community Forums
57: Member Screenshots
58: Home
59: Community Forums
60: Member Screenshots
61: Community Forums
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Photo Gallery
65: Home
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Photo Gallery
71: Community Forums
72: Home
73: Community Forums
74: Member Screenshots
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Home
80: Member Screenshots
81: Home
82: News Archive
83: Member Screenshots
84: Member Screenshots
85: Photo Gallery
86: Photo Gallery
87: Home
88: Member Screenshots
89: Member Screenshots
90: Home
91: Community Forums
92: Member Screenshots
93: Community Forums
94: Member Screenshots
95: Member Screenshots
96: News Archive
97: Member Screenshots
98: Home
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Member Screenshots
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Statistics
107: Community Forums
108: Member Screenshots
109: Photo Gallery
110: Community Forums
111: Member Screenshots
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: News Archive
115: Member Screenshots
116: Downloads
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Photo Gallery
125: Member Screenshots
126: Member Screenshots
127: Member Screenshots
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Member Screenshots
131: Community Forums
132: Home
133: Community Forums
134: Home
135: Photo Gallery
136: Community Forums
137: Home
138: Member Screenshots
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Member Screenshots
142: Member Screenshots
143: Community Forums
144: Community Forums
145: Home
146: Home
147: Community Forums
148: Downloads
149: Community Forums
150: Member Screenshots
151: Member Screenshots
152: Community Forums
153: Home
154: Home
155: Member Screenshots
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: News Archive
160: Photo Gallery
161: Photo Gallery
162: News Archive
163: Member Screenshots
164: Member Screenshots
165: Photo Gallery
166: Member Screenshots
167: Home
168: Photo Gallery
169: Community Forums
170: Member Screenshots
171: Member Screenshots
172: Member Screenshots
173: Photo Gallery
174: Photo Gallery
175: Community Forums
176: Home
177: Statistics
178: Community Forums
179: Home
180: Photo Gallery
181: Downloads
182: Community Forums
183: Downloads
184: Photo Gallery
185: Photo Gallery
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Member Screenshots
189: Member Screenshots
190: Home
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Home
194: Community Forums
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Photo Gallery
199: Home
200: Community Forums
201: Photo Gallery
202: Statistics
203: Community Forums
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Member Screenshots
207: Community Forums
208: Home
209: Community Forums
210: Member Screenshots
211: Home
212: Home
213: Home
214: Community Forums
215: Member Screenshots
216: Member Screenshots
217: Photo Gallery
218: Member Screenshots
219: Home
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: News Archive
224: News Archive
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Home
228: Community Forums
229: Member Screenshots
230: Community Forums
231: Member Screenshots
232: Member Screenshots
233: Community Forums
234: Community Forums
235: Downloads
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Downloads
239: News Archive
240: Member Screenshots
241: Member Screenshots
242: Member Screenshots
243: Member Screenshots
244: Community Forums
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Home
248: Downloads
249: Community Forums
250: News
251: Community Forums
252: Home
253: Downloads
254: Community Forums
255: News Archive
256: Community Forums
257: Member Screenshots
258: Community Forums
259: Community Forums
260: Community Forums
261: News Archive
262: Downloads
263: Community Forums
264: Downloads
265: Photo Gallery
266: Photo Gallery
267: Community Forums
268: Home
269: Community Forums
270: Photo Gallery
271: News Archive
272: Home
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Downloads
277: Community Forums
278: Photo Gallery
279: Home
280: Home
281: Community Forums
282: Community Forums
283: Member Screenshots
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Member Screenshots
288: Home
289: News Archive
290: Community Forums
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Community Forums
294: Member Screenshots
295: News Archive
296: Member Screenshots
297: Photo Gallery
298: Member Screenshots
299: Community Forums
300: Member Screenshots
301: Community Forums
302: Photo Gallery
303: Photo Gallery
304: Community Forums
305: News Archive
306: Downloads
307: Home
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Community Forums
311: Member Screenshots
312: Community Forums
313: Member Screenshots
314: Community Forums
315: Member Screenshots
316: Community Forums
317: News Archive
318: News Archive
319: Member Screenshots
320: Community Forums
321: Downloads
322: Downloads
323: Photo Gallery
324: Statistics
325: Community Forums
326: Photo Gallery
327: Community Forums
328: Member Screenshots
329: Member Screenshots
330: Member Screenshots
331: Community Forums
332: Statistics
333: Community Forums
334: Downloads
335: Statistics
336: Community Forums
337: Member Screenshots
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Downloads
341: Downloads
342: Photo Gallery
343: Community Forums
344: News Archive
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: Member Screenshots
348: Photo Gallery
349: Community Forums
350: Member Screenshots
351: Home
352: Member Screenshots
353: Community Forums
354: Home
355: Community Forums
356: Community Forums
357: Home
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Downloads
362: Home
363: Community Forums
364: Home
365: Downloads
366: News Archive
367: Home
368: Downloads
369: Member Screenshots
370: Member Screenshots
371: Home
372: Home
373: News Archive
374: Community Forums
375: Member Screenshots
376: Home
377: Photo Gallery
378: Community Forums
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Photo Gallery
383: Community Forums
384: Member Screenshots
385: Member Screenshots
386: Member Screenshots
387: Member Screenshots
388: Community Forums
389: Community Forums
390: Photo Gallery
391: Member Screenshots
392: Photo Gallery
393: Community Forums
394: News Archive
395: Photo Gallery
396: Home

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
A-109E
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Oct 11, 2006
Posts: 154
Location: Minneapolis
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:07 pm
Post subject: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Here's the second installment of many. Just throw bricks when you've had enough. Laughing




































The next several are dedicated to our revered moderator by special request. Laughing










The remainder are for that gentleman, Chris "Toadman" Hughes, by special request. He was kind enough to exchange an M5 DVD I ordered in error for the correct M5A1 with no questions asked, and I believe he even smiled. Laughing (Sorry, Chris: no interior shots possible.)























_________________
--Bob Steinbrunn
BSteinIPMS at aol.com
Back to top
View user's profile
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:42 pm
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Great shots! The M551 is actually an M551A1. May have come from the 82nd Airborne since it doesn't have the bolt-on mine kit under it.

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Jens_O_Mehner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 511
Location: Giessen, Germany
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:43 pm
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Hmmm,

an M48A1, wish they'd apply a little TLC to the old gal... Failing that, it would make a nice conversation piece on my lawn, but the shipping might be a bit too much. <sigh>

Bob Smart is interested in M551s? Gee, I never knew that, surprises lurking at every corner. Wink Laughing

Thanks for sharing, Bob, and I can assure you I'm completely out of bricks. Razz
Back to top
View user's profile
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

I read with great interest about the Sheridan's "152mm discarding sabot" and how this round was responsible for imparting "some" spin to conventional projectiles. I wonder how the other conventional rounds achieved their rotation? And I'm dyin' to hear more about the Sheridan's APDS (or APFSDS) round itself. And the loadout. And how production commenced in 1969. Shocked
(...and how much faster than 43 mph is it being suggested that they were capable of? I saw a little more down hill on Porter River Rd. once, but it gets pretty steep there for a brief stretch)


And what's this Soviet T92 tank it was VISMODed to resemble?

And if an M48 is a "Patton II", is an M60 not a "Patton III"?

Bob, get on in there and help those good folks out! (I'm thinkin' about throwing some bricks, but not at Bob!)




Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Jens_O_Mehner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 511
Location: Giessen, Germany
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:31 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Not to mention that those few airborne armor types might appreciate a passing mention that they took the M551 to the sandbox in 1991/92 and were the first line of defense until the heavier stuff could be moved into theater.

Sheesh, who writes these things? Is it like "Fred, do some googling on that there tank" or more like "Wilbur, weren't you a mechanic on those things?"... Don't get me wrong, I truly appreciate their efforts and know the limitations inherent, but if you put up a plate in the first place and apparently do some research anyways, you might as well get it right and not make it seem like "Sparky" is your consultant.

Yeah, I know, 99% of the visitors don't know an M4 from their elbow, but this is one of my pet peeves... Evil or Very Mad


Last edited by Jens_O_Mehner on Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:25 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:08 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Hi Jens! Hi Folks!

- Jens_O_Mehner
Hmmm,
Bob Smart is interested in M551s? Gee, I never knew that, surprises lurking at every corner. Wink Laughing


Hey Jens! Wrong Bob! This photos come from Bob, the A-109E Helo pilot, not Bob Smart the ex-F15 fixer upper guy!
Sgt, Scouts Out!

P.S.
Thanks Bob (A109E) for the great photos, please feel free to post more!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:30 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Hi Doug! Hi Folks!

- Doug_Kibbey
I read with great interest about the Sheridan's "152mm discarding sabot" and how this round was responsible for imparting "some" spin to conventional projectiles. I wonder how the other conventional rounds achieved their rotation? And I'm dyin' to hear more about the Sheridan's APDS (or APFSDS) round itself.

Odd, but interesting. If I remember right the reason the MTB70 152mm gun/launcher had a longer barrel, than the M551 and the M60A2, was there was a plan to develope a discarding sabot round, after production had started, for use by the MTB70.

- Doug_Kibbey

And how production commenced in 1969. Shocked


Let me see now, I arrived at Ft. Riley in late summer of 1968 and the 1st Bn (Light) 63rd Armor, 1st Infantry Division (rear detachment, the division was in Vietnam at that time) already have M551s for over a year or more. Sometime during the summer of 1969, the unit moved down to Ft. Bragg where we found a squadron of the 17th Cav (82nd Airborne's recon squadron) which already had 9 M551s which had been there for some time.

- Doug_Kibbey

And if an M48 is a "Patton II", is an M60 not a "Patton III"?


No. If we are going to add numbers after the name, then they have that wrong also.

M-46 Patton = Patton I
M-47 Patton = Patton II
M-48 Patton = Patton III
M-60 (never named) = Patton IV

Got to give them an "A" for effort for saving old vehicles, but their documention gets a "D".
Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Jens_O_Mehner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 511
Location: Giessen, Germany
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 8:57 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Jens! Hi Folks!

- Jens_O_Mehner
Hmmm,
Bob Smart is interested in M551s? Gee, I never knew that, surprises lurking at every corner. Wink Laughing


Hey Jens! Wrong Bob! This photos come from Bob, the A-109E Helo pilot, not Bob Smart the ex-F15 fixer upper guy!
Sgt, Scouts Out!

P.S.
Thanks Bob (A109E) for the great photos, please feel free to post more!


Ahhm, I knew that, I was playing on the "revered moderator", knowing full well Bob meant Dougbert E. Kibblee, not Bob Smart... Cool
Back to top
View user's profile
Jens_O_Mehner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 511
Location: Giessen, Germany
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:04 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

- Roy_A_Lingle

- Doug_Kibbey

And how production commenced in 1969. Shocked


Let me see now, I arrived at Ft. Riley in late summer of 1968 and the 1st Bn (Light) 63rd Armor, 1st Infantry Division (rear detachment, the division was in Vietnam at that time) already have M551s for over a year or more. Sometime during the summer of 1969, the unit moved down to Ft. Bragg where we found a squadron of the 17th Cav (82nd Airborne's recon squadron) which already had 9 M551s which had been there for some time.


Got to give them an "A" for effort for saving old vehicles, but their documention gets a "D".
Sgt, Scouts Out!


The first production vehicles rolled off the assembly line in 1965. Interestingly enough, the M551 came into being because the T92 wasn't to be- that's probably where the T92 tidbit comes from, but somebody seriously scrambled their data ("Gee, Jack, if it's got a "T" designation, it must be Rooshian")... Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:18 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

- Jens_O_Mehner
- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Jens! Hi Folks!

- Jens_O_Mehner
Hmmm,
Bob Smart is interested in M551s? Gee, I never knew that, surprises lurking at every corner. Wink Laughing


Hey Jens! Wrong Bob! This photos come from Bob, the A-109E Helo pilot, not Bob Smart the ex-F15 fixer upper guy!
Sgt, Scouts Out!

P.S.
Thanks Bob (A109E) for the great photos, please feel free to post more!



Ahhm, I knew that, I was playing on the "revered moderator", knowing full well Bob meant Dougbert E. Kibblee, not Bob Smart... Cool


Don't worry I got it I'm beginning to think we're getting too many Bobs around here Also inspite of what Senor Kibbey says I consider him the true moderator of this forum. Actually with this group it is more of 'facilitator' rather than moderator given the manners shown by all membors of this group.

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:40 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

- Roy_A_Lingle
Hi Doug! Hi Folks!

- Doug_Kibbey
I read with great interest about the Sheridan's "152mm discarding sabot" and how this round was responsible for imparting "some" spin to conventional projectiles. I wonder how the other conventional rounds achieved their rotation? And I'm dyin' to hear more about the Sheridan's APDS (or APFSDS) round itself.

Odd, but interesting. If I remember right the reason the MTB70 152mm gun/launcher had a longer barrel, than the M551 and the M60A2, was there was a plan to develope a discarding sabot round, after production had started, for use by the MTB70.
Sgt, Scouts Out!



Ding, ding, ding! Roy gets a cookie!
Exactly! (Which is why I was so careful to get that Sheridan bit in there before the 152mm....twice!) Mr. Green

"XM578 152mm, APFSDS
From 1965 to 1972, the US Army conducted development program for the 152mm XM578 cartridge, which was co-developed with the prototype MBT-70 Tank. The XM578 cartridge used a tungsten alloy that was slightly denser than the British alloy, consisting of 97.5 percent tungsten and 2.5 percent binder, which had a density of 18.5 gm/cc. The tungsten alloys used in the XM578 projectile had to be encased in a steel jacket to withstand the extreme firing velocities of the 152mm gun, reducing the penetrating effectiveness of the tungsten cartridge.

A strategy was devised that called for combining ultra-lightweight plastics with titanium sabot components. These were combined with a plastic driving and sealing band that allowed insertion of the much longer KE cartridge several feet down the rifled bore of the new cannon.

With the terminatlon of the Program and the initiation of the XM-1 Tank Program, a need for a modern 105mm Anti-tank, Kinetic Energy Projectile. Picatlnny Arsenal responded to this tasking by utilizing the technology gained in the 152nwn Program - specifically the subpEojectile - and adapting it to the 105mm Gun by means of a saddle sabot.

Throughout the 1960s and early 1970s, the US Army developed a successive series of improved 105mm rounds (the primary caliber of the main gun on M-60 and developmental XM-1 series tanks) using the denser 97.5 percent tungsten alloy. The XM735 and XM774 cartridges were the first rounds developed out of the XM578 cartridge program.

A decision analysis was performed on the XM578 APFSDS projectile development program in 1973. The decision analysis differed from a Risk Analysis in that, along with assessing program risks, the decision analysis proposed alternative program approaches and compared the expected outcomes of the proposed alternatives with the basic program. Prime consideration was given to the quantification of uncertainties, examination of allocation of resources between test and design phases of the development program and to quantify the value of information obtained in a test program."

www.globalsecurity.org...s/m578.htm
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:47 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

- Jens
Ahhm, I knew that, I was playing on the "revered moderator", knowing full well Bob meant Dougbert E. Kibblee, not Bob Smart



- bsmart
Actually with this group it is more of 'facilitator' rather than moderator given the manners shown by all membors of this group.


*Purr, purr*



(Actually, it's true!)
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 10:31 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

The M551 had 300 horsepower.

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Roy_A_Lingle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1997
Location: El Paso & Ft Bliss, Texas
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:15 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

Hi Mark! Hi Folks!

- MarkHolloway

The M551 had 300 horsepower.


300 HP! Mr. Green Mr. Green Scouts in seven ton M114s with only a 283 cubic inch Chevy engine had to run hard to stay out in front of those speedy monsters.

Sgt, Scouts Out!

_________________
"You can never have too much reconnaissance."
General G.S. Patton Jr.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:40 am
Post subject: Re: Ft. Snelling Military Museum - Pics #2

M114's had 160 HP. They could have gotten more if they wanted Smile

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 3
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum