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Joe_D · Posted: Wed May 09, 2007 5:22 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Hi everyone,
I just edited the original post with more pictures. I wish I had paid closer attention to my captions though, The picture of the antenna/wind sensor openings should read 3 M60A3 with three bolt opening for wind sensor not M60A1

Roy, Jim, thanks for the nickname, not sure I would go that far though, there are many that have a lot more time on them than I do. But I am honored.

Bob,
About the right rear grill door, not sure what you mean by two different openings/access panels. There is a section on the top left corner of the right grill door to remove 2 of the "Fins" . After you remove them it allows for a positive seal for the exhaust trunk for deep water fording. You can see the bolts along the sealing surface that are used to attach it. Some early models had an additional surface to attach a smaller diameter exhaust. It was square instead of 5 sided and would cut through some of the fins. Later grills dropped this. I believe this was a left over feature from the M48's. Behind the grills a crossover/connector pipe was attached to the exhaust. The crew would remove the stacks and then clamp it on. then they would close the right grill which had a corresponding surface on the inside which bolted to the crossover/connector. If you are lucky the bolts have been maintained with anti seize compound and don't shear off when you try to unscrew them. BTW, The grills always closed right side first, then left. This trunk was used by the USMC and not the Army. Our kit was identicle with the exception of the trunk. The advantage to the trunk was you didn't have to worry about water back washing into the exhaust if you RPM's dropped below 1200 or engine stalled. If it did, you were done, With stacks you could start it up again. I myself am not one bit disappointed that I did not deep ford an M60. I seriously doubted the bilge pump would have pumped the incoming water out faster than it came in with the way our tanks sealed Shocked

(we just don't deep ford that much if ever in the Army).

Joe D

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Wed May 09, 2007 5:39 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

- Joe_D

I myself am not one bit disappointed that I did not deep ford an M60. I seriously doubted the bilge pump would have pumped the incoming water out faster than it came in with the way our tanks sealed (we just don't deep ford that much if ever in the Army).

Joe D

I have and I was no more enthused about it than you sound like you would be, either. When we did it, it was exactly as pictured as here, at the Armor Board (this is such an operation), with saftey and salvage boats (the Armor Board Navy) on the water (I was also a diver on swim/ford exercises) and we had only two men on the vehicles (M60's or Sheridan's, as applicable for ford or swimex). Generally, this was done on Tobacco Leaf Lake at Knox, IIRC. Swimex's were sometimes done elsewhere.

Joe_D · Posted: Wed May 09, 2007 5:52 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

That is not the kit we had,
Is that an experimental rig??? Ours only allowed us to ford up to the cupola. This one looks very similar to the German kit with the TC's "Conning" tower. I did notice that there is no exhaust trunk.

BTW, I believe as a young troop and driver my words would have been "F--- that, you drive!!"

Joe D

Doug_Kibbey · Posted: Wed May 09, 2007 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

- Joe_D

That is not the kit we had,
Is that an experimental rig??? Ours only allowed us to ford up to the cupola. This one looks very similar to the German kit with the TC's "Conning" tower. I did notice that there is no exhaust trunk.

BTW, I believe as a young troop and driver my words would have been "F--- that, you drive!!"

Joe D

That is a test rig, but I am given to understand that it was issued equipment for a number of years. I also noticed that the exhaust stack was not fitted. Strictly speaking, if the engine is kept up to speed and all goes well, it is not needed as the gases will keep the water out at turret depth. The conning tower and exhaust stack will permit what was termed "deep water fording", which is much deeper than cupola depth...something like 15-18' IIRC.

BTW, our military diver training course, conducted at places like Otter Creek Lake (in March! BRRRRRRR! 100' free ascent with no air) also consisted of lashing two of those conning towers together end-to-end and going through it horizontally on the bottom at a local flooded rock quarry without benefit of your airtank. If you were to get stuck or panic, it would not be a good thing.

Kurt_Laughlin · ***Power User*** Offline Joined: Jan 24, 2006 Posts: 577

Thanks Joe.

Does the thermal shroud need a C/U? It would seem that's evident from the other views.

Here's the revised list:
4x overall views (0-90-180-270).
1x Suspension Close up (C/U) showing shock and side lug arrangement
1x Tow lug S/N C/U
1x Engine deck S/Ns C/U
1x Glacis R/N C/U
1x Driver's hatch C/U
1x Turret C/U, showing T/C rangefinder head and gunner's sight
1x Air cleaner C/U, slightly high and looking rearward
1x Turret top view, looking forward from rear deck to show wind sensor and left side of TC cupola
1x Bustle rack C/U from right side
1x Escape hatch C/U

I will try this out tomorrow on M60A3 4125A, 09A1072 located in Plum Boro, PA and post the photos on photobucket.

KL

Roy_A_Lingle · Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 5:30 am Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Hi Joe! Hi Folks!

- Joe_D

That is not the kit we had,
Is that an experimental rig??? Ours only allowed us to ford up to the cupola. This one looks very similar to the German kit with the TC's "Conning" tower. I did notice that there is no exhaust trunk.
Joe D

It is my understanding that kit was developed and issued to 7th Army units for use in crossing rivers. It wasn't done very often, but I do remember during my four years in Germany seeing news stories in Stars and Stripes newpaper about units crossing the Rhine river with that tower system.

Update after getting home and doing a quick check of my files:

The system we had been talking was more in line with driving out of a landing craft, through surf and up onto a beach.

This picture was sent to me by Col. Ken Estes (USMC Tanker). This is the outlet stack the removeable grill section was for.

Sgt, Scouts Out!

Neil_Baumgardner · Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:00 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Joe, any explanation for this M60 SN?:

4038E

What rebuild depot is an E?

Neil

bsmart · Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 6:09 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Ebay!!!

Jens_O_Mehner · Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 8:19 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

- bsmart

Ebay!!!

Could you give an advance warning? Now I've got to clean my keyboard and monitor again... Laughing

bsmart · Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:32 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Yea well we haven't had one in so long I forgot

SPEW ALERT

Neil_Baumgardner · Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:45 pm Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

In all seriousness.... Here's another odd M60 SN: 1964F

Neil

piney · Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:57 am Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Spew alert
Frankenstein ! Mr. Green

Jeff Lewis

Joe_D · Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 11:09 am Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Neil, Bob, Jens, everyone,

Never seen an "E", or an "F" for that matter. I have looked through the list posted and there seems to be a common problem. Only 5 digit numbers are listed. No M60/60A1/60A2/ or A3's with 4 or less digits. Got to be some computer thing, Find it hard to believe that many aren't listed. As far as the odd designators, I'd bet they were mis-read. An "E" could be a damaged "M" and an "F" a damaged "A". As I said before, some ID's just make no sense. Only 4 places M60's were "Produced" Detriot, Newark, Anniston, and Mainz. Anniston and Mainz were more like rebuilds but since they were changed from one NIIN (Designator) to a later one, they in theory produced A3's. But as I always say, Never say never.

Joe D

Joe_D · Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 11:22 am Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Spew alert
Frankenstein !

You laugh but there are some "Frankenstein" display tanks out there. The Valley Station KY M60A2/M48 is one of them. And as someone said before, years from now some one will argue that it was an actual vehicle used. I guess us CIA types have a duty to keep that from happening.

Joe D

Neil_Baumgardner · Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 11:36 am Post subject: Re: M60 Guides

Yeah Joe, I've started to notice a few M60s where I had the original SN (not the rebuild SN) from you or someone else - but TACOM lists it with an A... I'm starting to suspect they put an A by any M60 SN in doubt - although I have found numerous instances of the TACOM SN matching up with an SN I already had...

Neil

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