±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 461
Total: 461
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Photo Gallery
02: Member Screenshots
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: CPGlang
11: Community Forums
12: Photo Gallery
13: Community Forums
14: Home
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Photo Gallery
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Home
23: Home
24: Community Forums
25: Community Forums
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Community Forums
32: Member Screenshots
33: Community Forums
34: Photo Gallery
35: Community Forums
36: Home
37: Photo Gallery
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Community Forums
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: Home
44: Community Forums
45: Your Account
46: Community Forums
47: Community Forums
48: Community Forums
49: Community Forums
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Photo Gallery
54: Community Forums
55: Home
56: Home
57: Community Forums
58: Downloads
59: Photo Gallery
60: Photo Gallery
61: Home
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Home
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Home
68: Photo Gallery
69: Downloads
70: Photo Gallery
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: CPGlang
74: Community Forums
75: CPGlang
76: Community Forums
77: Photo Gallery
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: CPGlang
81: Home
82: Community Forums
83: Downloads
84: Community Forums
85: Photo Gallery
86: Community Forums
87: Photo Gallery
88: Photo Gallery
89: Photo Gallery
90: Home
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Home
96: Community Forums
97: Photo Gallery
98: Community Forums
99: Photo Gallery
100: Photo Gallery
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Home
104: Photo Gallery
105: Photo Gallery
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Home
111: Community Forums
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: News
115: Community Forums
116: CPGlang
117: Home
118: Member Screenshots
119: Community Forums
120: Photo Gallery
121: Photo Gallery
122: Community Forums
123: Home
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Downloads
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Photo Gallery
139: Photo Gallery
140: Member Screenshots
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Photo Gallery
144: Photo Gallery
145: Community Forums
146: Photo Gallery
147: Photo Gallery
148: CPGlang
149: Community Forums
150: Community Forums
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Home
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Photo Gallery
162: Home
163: Community Forums
164: Photo Gallery
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Downloads
168: Community Forums
169: Photo Gallery
170: Photo Gallery
171: Community Forums
172: Community Forums
173: CPGlang
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: CPGlang
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Photo Gallery
181: Community Forums
182: Photo Gallery
183: Community Forums
184: Your Account
185: Photo Gallery
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Community Forums
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Photo Gallery
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Community Forums
203: Community Forums
204: Home
205: Photo Gallery
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Photo Gallery
209: Community Forums
210: Downloads
211: Home
212: Home
213: CPGlang
214: Photo Gallery
215: Community Forums
216: Photo Gallery
217: Home
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Photo Gallery
221: Community Forums
222: Home
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Photo Gallery
227: Photo Gallery
228: Photo Gallery
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Photo Gallery
232: Your Account
233: Home
234: Downloads
235: Community Forums
236: Home
237: Community Forums
238: Photo Gallery
239: Community Forums
240: Community Forums
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Community Forums
244: Community Forums
245: Home
246: Home
247: Photo Gallery
248: Home
249: Community Forums
250: Community Forums
251: Photo Gallery
252: Community Forums
253: Community Forums
254: Photo Gallery
255: Downloads
256: Downloads
257: Home
258: Community Forums
259: Photo Gallery
260: Community Forums
261: Your Account
262: Community Forums
263: Community Forums
264: Photo Gallery
265: Photo Gallery
266: Home
267: Community Forums
268: Photo Gallery
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Photo Gallery
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Photo Gallery
277: Member Screenshots
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Photo Gallery
281: Photo Gallery
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Photo Gallery
285: Photo Gallery
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Community Forums
290: Community Forums
291: Photo Gallery
292: Home
293: Community Forums
294: News
295: Community Forums
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Home
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: CPGlang
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: CPGlang
310: Photo Gallery
311: Home
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Photo Gallery
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Community Forums
323: Community Forums
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Photo Gallery
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Photo Gallery
334: Community Forums
335: Photo Gallery
336: Community Forums
337: Your Account
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Statistics
343: Downloads
344: Photo Gallery
345: Community Forums
346: Home
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Home
351: Community Forums
352: Photo Gallery
353: Community Forums
354: Photo Gallery
355: Community Forums
356: Downloads
357: Home
358: Community Forums
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Home
362: Your Account
363: Community Forums
364: Home
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Your Account
369: Home
370: CPGlang
371: Downloads
372: Photo Gallery
373: Community Forums
374: Photo Gallery
375: Home
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Photo Gallery
379: Photo Gallery
380: Photo Gallery
381: Community Forums
382: Community Forums
383: Community Forums
384: Home
385: Community Forums
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: CPGlang
389: Community Forums
390: Downloads
391: CPGlang
392: Photo Gallery
393: Downloads
394: News Archive
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Photo Gallery
398: Community Forums
399: Community Forums
400: Community Forums
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: Community Forums
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Community Forums
407: Community Forums
408: Home
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: CPGlang
412: Community Forums
413: Photo Gallery
414: Community Forums
415: CPGlang
416: Photo Gallery
417: Community Forums
418: Community Forums
419: Community Forums
420: Community Forums
421: Community Forums
422: Community Forums
423: Community Forums
424: CPGlang
425: Photo Gallery
426: Community Forums
427: Photo Gallery
428: Community Forums
429: Home
430: Downloads
431: Community Forums
432: Community Forums
433: Community Forums
434: Photo Gallery
435: Community Forums
436: Photo Gallery
437: Downloads
438: Community Forums
439: Community Forums
440: Home
441: Photo Gallery
442: Your Account
443: Community Forums
444: Community Forums
445: Photo Gallery
446: Community Forums
447: Photo Gallery
448: Community Forums
449: Photo Gallery
450: Your Account
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Community Forums
454: Photo Gallery
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Home
460: Community Forums
461: Photo Gallery

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission :: Archived
A general meeting place for all pilots!
Post new topic    Revive this topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  Officer's Club

Topic Archived View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Uhu_Fledermaus
Aircraft Demolition Expert

Offline Offline
Joined: Nov 28, 2004
Posts: 4369
Location: Blaricum, The Netherlands ~GMT+1
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 10:48 am
Post subject: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Microsoft updates Windows without users' consent

By Scott Dunn

Microsoft has begun patching files on Windows XP and Vista without users' knowledge, even when the users have turned off auto-updates.

Many companies require testing of patches before they are widely installed, and businesses in this situation are objecting to the stealth patching.


Files changed with no notice to users

In recent days, Windows Update (WU) started altering files on users' systems without displaying any dialog box to request permission. The only files that have been reportedly altered to date are nine small executables on XP and nine on Vista that are used by WU itself. Microsoft is patching these files silently, even if auto-updates have been disabled on a particular PC.

It's surprising that these files can be changed without the user's knowledge. The Automatic Updates dialog box in the Control Panel can be set to prevent updates from being installed automatically. However, with Microsoft's latest stealth move, updates to the WU executables seem to be installed regardless of the settings — without notifying users.

When users launch Windows Update, Microsoft's online service can check the version of its executables on the PC and update them if necessary. What's unusual is that people are reporting changes in these files although WU wasn't authorized to install anything.

This isn't the first time Microsoft has pushed updates out to users who prefer to test and install their updates manually. Not long ago, another Windows component, svchost.exe, was causing problems with Windows Update, as last reported on June 21 in the Windows Secrets Newsletter. In that case, however, the Windows Update site notified users that updated software had to be installed before the patching process could proceed. This time, such a notice never appears.

For users who elect not to have updates installed automatically, the issue of consent is crucial. Microsoft has apparently decided, however, that it doesn't need permission to patch Windows Updates files, even if you've set your preferences to require it.

Microsoft provides no tech information — yet

To make matters even stranger, a search on Microsoft's Web site reveals no information at all on the stealth updates. Let's say you wished to voluntarily download and install the new WU executable files when you were, for example, reinstalling a system. You'd be hard-pressed to find the updated files in order to download them. At this writing, you either get a stealth install or nothing.

A few Web forums have already started to discuss the updated files, which bear the version number 7.0.6000.381. The only explanation found at Microsoft's site comes from a user identified as Dean-Dean on a Microsoft Communities forum. In reply to a question, he states:

"Windows Update Software 7.0.6000.381 is an update to Windows Update itself. It is an update for both Windows XP and Windows Vista. Unless the update is installed, Windows Update won't work, at least in terms of searching for further updates. Normal use of Windows Update, in other words, is blocked until this update is installed."

Windows Secrets contributing editor Susan Bradley contacted Microsoft Partner Support about the update and received this short reply:


"7.0.6000.381 is a consumer only release that addresses some specific issues found after .374 was released. It will not be available via WSUS [Windows Server Update Services]. A standalone installer and the redist will be available soon, I will keep an eye on it and notify you when it is available."

Unfortunately, this reply does not explain why the stealth patching began with so little information provided to customers. Nor does it provide any details on the "specific issues" that the update supposedly addresses.

System logs confirm stealth installs

In his forum post, Dean-Dean names several files that are changed on XP and Vista. The patching process updates several Windows\System32 executables (with the extensions .exe, .dll, and .cpl) to version 7.0.6000.381, according to the post.

In Vista, the following files are updated:

1. wuapi.dll
2. wuapp.exe
3. wuauclt.exe
4. wuaueng.dll
5. wucltux.dll
6. wudriver.dll
7. wups.dll
8. wups2.dll
9. wuwebv.dll

In XP, the following files are updated:

1. cdm.dll
2. wuapi.dll
3. wuauclt.exe
4. wuaucpl.cpl
5. wuaueng.dll
6. wucltui.dll
7. wups.dll
8. wups2.dll
9. wuweb.dll

These files are by no means viruses, and Microsoft appears to have no malicious intent in patching them. However, writing files to a user's PC without notice (when auto-updating has been turned off) is behavior that's usually associated with hacker Web sites. The question being raised in discussion forums is, "Why is Microsoft operating in this way?"

How to check which version your PC has

If a system has been patched in the past few months, the nine executables in Windows\System32 will either show an earlier version number, 7.0.6000.374, or the stealth patch: 7.0.6000.381. (The version numbers can be seen by right-clicking a file and choosing Properties. In XP, click the Version tab and then select File Version. In Vista, click the Details tab.)

In addition, PCs that received the update will have new executables in subfolders named 7.0.6000.381 under the following folders:

c:\Windows\System32\SoftwareDistribution\Setup\ServiceStartup\wups.dll
c:\Windows\System32\SoftwareDistribution\Setup\ServiceStartup\wups2.dll

Users can also verify whether patching occurred by checking Windows' Event Log:

Step 1. In XP, click Start, Run.

Step 2. Type eventvwr.msc and press Enter.

Step 3. In the tree pane on the left, select System.

Step 4. The right pane displays events and several details about them. Event types such as "Installation" are labeled in the Category column. "Windows Update Agent" is the event typically listed in the Source column for system patches.

On systems that were checked recently by Windows Secrets readers, the Event Log shows two installation events on Aug. 24. The files were stealth-updated in the early morning hours. (The time stamp will vary, of course, on machines that received the patch on other dates.)

To investigate further, you can open the Event Log's properties for each event. Normally, when a Windows update event occurs, the properties dialog box shows an associated KB number, enabling you to find more information at Microsoft's Web site. Mysteriously, no KB number is given for the WU updates that began in August. The description merely reads, "Installation Successful: Windows successfully installed the following update: Automatic Updates."

No need to roll back the updated files

Again, it's important to note that there's nothing harmful about the updated files themselves. There are no reports of software conflicts and no reason to remove the files (which WU apparently needs in order to access the latest patches). The only concern is the mechanism Microsoft is using to perform its patching, and how this mechanism might be used by the software giant in the future.

I'd like to thank reader Angus Scott-Fleming for his help in researching this topic. He recommends that advanced Windows users monitor changes to their systems' Registry settings via a free program by Olivier Lombart called Tiny Watcher. Scott-Fleming will receive a gift certificate for a book, CD, or DVD of his choice for sending in a comment we printed.

I'll report further on this story when I'm able to find more information on the policies and techniques behind Windows Update's silent patches. Send me your tips on this subject via the Windows Secrets contact page.

Scott Dunn is associate editor of the Windows Secrets Newsletter. He is also a contributing editor of PC World Magazine, where he has written a monthly column since 1992, and co-author of 101 Windows Tips & Tricks (Peachpit) with Jesse Berst and Charles Bermant.

source => windowssecrets.com/com...13/#story1

just tought to inform you all


fled
Back to top
View user's profile ICQ Number MSN Messenger Photo Gallery
Shades
Forum Tree-Rat

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 6475
Location: 3rd Branch up, 'Ye Olde Oak', Green Wood.
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Been watching this developing on BYO as well.
lolol
All the Linux guys have been like Cheshire Cats this week.
LOL

_________________
Skwerl's place.

Com-Central's cutest, fluffiest, twitchiest, tail.
CPU > Intel i9-9900k (o/c 4.9GHz); COOLING > BeQuiet! Dark Rock Pro 4;
MOBO > ASUS PRIME Z390-A; RAM > 2x32GB Corsair LPX 2666MHz;
GPU > Gigabyte GEFORCE GTX650Ti PCI-e 3.0 2Gb GDDR5;
AUDIO > Creative X-Fi Xtreme Music (plus - Universal Audio UAD2 Quad Custom accelerator);
HDD > 3x1TB+ M.2. SSDs; LCD > DELL - S2419HGF (1920x1080);
PSU > 650W be quiet Straight Power 11 - 80+ Gold;
CASE > BeQuiet! SILENT BASE 601; OS > Windows 11 Home Advanced (64-bit).
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
JG300-Stoopy
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 5840
Location: Group W bench
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Hey I was thinking of de-fraggin' my HD tonight but now that I think about it it would be COOL if they can just go ahead and do that bit of maintenance for me as well....

_________________
"Once your reputation is ruined, you can live quite freely."
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Uhu_Fledermaus
Aircraft Demolition Expert

Offline Offline
Joined: Nov 28, 2004
Posts: 4369
Location: Blaricum, The Netherlands ~GMT+1
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:38 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Just posted this to keep ya fella's updated, and your system in the same go as iut looks ..............alltough personally I don't think it's the right way to do by MS
Back to top
View user's profile ICQ Number MSN Messenger Photo Gallery
JG300-Stoopy
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 5840
Location: Group W bench
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:41 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Not defending this in the least...but thinking out loud, I'd say if it doesn't show up on the "Add/Remove Programs" list like other security patches, it would be a definite bad thing.....just in case someone had to troubleshoot a prgram or patch conflict and couldn't remove it to see if it's a cause of a problem.

_________________
"Once your reputation is ruined, you can live quite freely."
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
HA_needacar
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 13, 2005
Posts: 52
Location: Michigan
PostPosted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 8:47 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Sony BMG got in trouble for this a while ago.....

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address MSN Messenger
Shadow_Bshwackr
Janitor

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 21, 2005
Posts: 7015
Location: Central Illinois, USA
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:52 am
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

- Shades
Been watching this developing on BYO as well.
lolol
All the Linux guys have been like Cheshire Cats this week.
LOL


I bet they are!...lol

I don't agree in no way shape or form to let anyone update any files without my permission. While MS updated with 'no harm' files, it's the principal of the situation that should be in the forefront of everyone's mind. How would you like it if the 'bank' moved funds of your's around because they thought 'it was needed and they didn't think you would mind' ?

Another reason to run Linux ( I use www.linuxmint.com ) for your everyday needs and run 'the other one' for Gaming... and yes, you CAN dual boot...lol Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Shades
Forum Tree-Rat

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 6475
Location: 3rd Branch up, 'Ye Olde Oak', Green Wood.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 12:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

Totally agree with the general sentiment.
If I choose to disable auto-update it's for a reason, and I don't want anyone bypassing that without my knowledge and permission;
That's what we have hackers for.

_________________
Skwerl's place.

Com-Central's cutest, fluffiest, twitchiest, tail.
CPU > Intel i9-9900k (o/c 4.9GHz); COOLING > BeQuiet! Dark Rock Pro 4;
MOBO > ASUS PRIME Z390-A; RAM > 2x32GB Corsair LPX 2666MHz;
GPU > Gigabyte GEFORCE GTX650Ti PCI-e 3.0 2Gb GDDR5;
AUDIO > Creative X-Fi Xtreme Music (plus - Universal Audio UAD2 Quad Custom accelerator);
HDD > 3x1TB+ M.2. SSDs; LCD > DELL - S2419HGF (1920x1080);
PSU > 650W be quiet Straight Power 11 - 80+ Gold;
CASE > BeQuiet! SILENT BASE 601; OS > Windows 11 Home Advanced (64-bit).
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Shadow_Banshee
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 03, 2005
Posts: 575

PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:52 pm
Post subject: Re: Microsoft Changes files on your PC without permission

can we sue um? i'll accept a couple of k lol

_________________
Lay me place and bake me Pie
I'm starving for me Gravy
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Revive this topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  Officer's Club
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours

Archive Revive
Username:
This is an archived topic - your reply will not be appended here.
Instead, a new topic will be generated in the active forum.
The new topic will provide a reference link to this archived topic.