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Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.

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Dirk
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Location: South Africa

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:30 pm Post subject: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
Managed to track down 6 Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa. Based my research on the PDF document (Larkum & Marshall) listing all examples of WWII armour in South Africa. Photographs to follow ASAP. It is good to be back ! Best regards

TrevorLarkum
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Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 8:58 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
I look forward to seeing the photographs - and let us know if you can add any information too. _________________ Trevor Dr Trevor Larkum Preserved Tanks: PreservedTanks.com Armour Archive: ArmourArchive.co.uk EVs

armyjunk2
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 12:01 am Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
How rare is this? Are there complete vehicles anywhere?

jcneel
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
- armyjunk2 How rare is this? Are there complete vehicles anywhere? That's a turret from an M10 Achillies (17pdr British version of the US Tank Destroyer). There's a complete vehicle at Fort Hood in Texas. Does anyone know if they have started to move the museum pieces to their new base from Fort Hood or are they going to leave them there? later cn

TrevorLarkum
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 4:04 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
- armyjunk2 How rare is this? Are there complete vehicles anywhere? Was the question about examples in South Africa? I'm not aware of any (there are no Achilles listed in Preserved Tanks in South Africa). _________________ Trevor Dr Trevor Larkum Preserved Tanks: PreservedTanks.com Armour Archive: ArmourArchive.co.uk EVs

Dontos
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 4:34 pm
Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa

- jcneel

- armyjunk2

How rare is this? Are there complete vehicles anywhere?

That's a turret from an M10 Achillies (17pdr British version of the US Tank Destroyer). There's a complete vehicle at Fort Hood in Texas.

Does anyone know if they have started to move the museum pieces to their new base from Fort Hood or are they going to leave them there?

later

cn

Jeff Buttons shouldbe able to answer that. A lot of the stuff at Hood is left over. Budgets are tight to move anything, so I'd bet most if not all stays in place, and is 'soaked' into the remaining units or organizations.

The core of 4th IDs vehicles are 2nd AD's 'stuff' from prior to 1992(ish) when 5th ID rolled into Hood then rolled over (redesignated) to 2 AD then Redesignated to 4th ID.

Thats when they committed the ultimate atrocity of repainting the 'checkerboard' tower sand,.... Many a tanker lost the best boresight panel on post.....

Don

armyjunk2
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
I was just wondering if the M10 with the 17pd was rare, anymore survive other than the one at Hood?

grockwood
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 8:34 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
There is/was an Achillies at the Bastogne muesum.

armyjunk2
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Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2007 9:12 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
Thanks grockwood I googled it and here it is Achillies

TrevorLarkum
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Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 8:49 am Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
I also have listings for two Achilles IIC, at Bovington and the Brussels Tank Museum. _________________ Trevor Dr Trevor Larkum Preserved Tanks: PreservedTanks.com Armour Archive: ArmourArchive.co.uk EVs

Rikard_Hufschmied
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden

Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:48 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
There's one in Latrun, Israel: And Ron & Rex Cadman had one restored by the "Salvage Squad": The Salvage Squad M10 page And there are 23(!) M10 Achilles in different states of preservation in Denmark: M10 Achilles in Denmark page 1. M10 Achilles in Denmark page 2. _________________ Frustra Nate Vive Devincere

jcneel
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Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:24 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
Here's a photo of the one from Fort Hood, 4th Inf Div Museum (at that time). Taken a few years back. Note that this one has the earlier wedge shaped counterweights on the back of the turret as opposed to the later duckbill styled ones. cn

Jim_Coles
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Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:41 pm Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
Note that "Achilles" actually refers to any M10 in Brit service, following the practice of using "A" names for SP AT guns. The original turret was the Mk I and the duckbill turret was the Mk II. The 17pdr-armed variant was the Mk Ic and Mk IIc, using the same suffixes as the Shermans. The name was rarely used in reality, and the troops and most documents just called them "M-10" and "M-10 17pdr".

Jens_O_Mehner
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Location: Giessen, Germany

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:54 am Post subject: Re: Sherman Fireflies preserved in South Africa
- Jim_Coles The name was rarely used in reality, and the troops and most documents just called them "M-10" and "M-10 17pdr". The name also appears for the first time post-war, IIRC shortly before they were retired. Nice parallel to M10 "Wolverine" and M36 "Jackson", names completely unknown during the war and to the troops. Jens O.

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