±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 342
Total: 342
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Home
03: Community Forums
04: Community Forums
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Your Account
08: Home
09: Home
10: Member Screenshots
11: Community Forums
12: Photo Gallery
13: Home
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: News Archive
17: Photo Gallery
18: Statistics
19: Member Screenshots
20: Photo Gallery
21: Photo Gallery
22: Photo Gallery
23: Photo Gallery
24: Community Forums
25: Statistics
26: Community Forums
27: Home
28: Home
29: Community Forums
30: Home
31: Your Account
32: Photo Gallery
33: Member Screenshots
34: News Archive
35: Photo Gallery
36: Member Screenshots
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Member Screenshots
40: Downloads
41: Community Forums
42: Downloads
43: Photo Gallery
44: Community Forums
45: Community Forums
46: Community Forums
47: Home
48: Member Screenshots
49: Home
50: Photo Gallery
51: Member Screenshots
52: Community Forums
53: Home
54: Community Forums
55: Home
56: Home
57: Member Screenshots
58: Photo Gallery
59: Downloads
60: Downloads
61: Member Screenshots
62: Downloads
63: Photo Gallery
64: News Archive
65: Community Forums
66: Member Screenshots
67: Community Forums
68: Home
69: Home
70: Home
71: Community Forums
72: Home
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Home
76: Community Forums
77: Photo Gallery
78: Community Forums
79: Member Screenshots
80: Home
81: Community Forums
82: Community Forums
83: Member Screenshots
84: Home
85: Home
86: Photo Gallery
87: Community Forums
88: Photo Gallery
89: Community Forums
90: Home
91: Downloads
92: Downloads
93: Photo Gallery
94: Member Screenshots
95: Community Forums
96: Home
97: Photo Gallery
98: Photo Gallery
99: Photo Gallery
100: Community Forums
101: News Archive
102: Community Forums
103: Photo Gallery
104: News Archive
105: Home
106: Photo Gallery
107: Home
108: Photo Gallery
109: Home
110: Community Forums
111: Home
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Downloads
115: Community Forums
116: Photo Gallery
117: Member Screenshots
118: Photo Gallery
119: Photo Gallery
120: Community Forums
121: Home
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Photo Gallery
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Home
129: Community Forums
130: Home
131: Home
132: Photo Gallery
133: Community Forums
134: Home
135: Photo Gallery
136: Home
137: Community Forums
138: Downloads
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Home
143: Home
144: Home
145: Downloads
146: Home
147: Community Forums
148: Photo Gallery
149: Community Forums
150: Photo Gallery
151: Home
152: Community Forums
153: Statistics
154: Community Forums
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Member Screenshots
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Downloads
161: Home
162: Home
163: Community Forums
164: Member Screenshots
165: Community Forums
166: Photo Gallery
167: Home
168: Photo Gallery
169: Community Forums
170: Downloads
171: Community Forums
172: Photo Gallery
173: Downloads
174: Downloads
175: News
176: Home
177: Home
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Supporters
182: Photo Gallery
183: Photo Gallery
184: Member Screenshots
185: Photo Gallery
186: Photo Gallery
187: Home
188: Home
189: Community Forums
190: Home
191: Community Forums
192: Member Screenshots
193: Photo Gallery
194: Downloads
195: Member Screenshots
196: News Archive
197: Home
198: Home
199: Home
200: Home
201: Home
202: Home
203: Home
204: Home
205: Home
206: Home
207: Home
208: Home
209: Home
210: Your Account
211: Home
212: Home
213: Home
214: Home
215: Home
216: Home
217: Home
218: Home
219: Photo Gallery
220: Community Forums
221: Home
222: Photo Gallery
223: Photo Gallery
224: Community Forums
225: Photo Gallery
226: Home
227: Community Forums
228: Home
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Community Forums
232: Photo Gallery
233: Home
234: Home
235: Member Screenshots
236: Community Forums
237: Home
238: Community Forums
239: Home
240: Home
241: Photo Gallery
242: Statistics
243: Home
244: Member Screenshots
245: News Archive
246: Photo Gallery
247: Home
248: Photo Gallery
249: Home
250: News
251: Member Screenshots
252: Community Forums
253: Photo Gallery
254: Photo Gallery
255: Home
256: Home
257: Community Forums
258: Downloads
259: Home
260: Community Forums
261: Photo Gallery
262: Photo Gallery
263: Member Screenshots
264: Downloads
265: Community Forums
266: Member Screenshots
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Community Forums
271: Community Forums
272: Community Forums
273: Home
274: Community Forums
275: Your Account
276: Home
277: Downloads
278: Home
279: Photo Gallery
280: Community Forums
281: Photo Gallery
282: Community Forums
283: Home
284: Home
285: Home
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Downloads
290: Photo Gallery
291: Downloads
292: Community Forums
293: Home
294: Home
295: Home
296: Member Screenshots
297: Member Screenshots
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Home
301: Home
302: Community Forums
303: Photo Gallery
304: News
305: Photo Gallery
306: Downloads
307: Photo Gallery
308: Community Forums
309: Home
310: Photo Gallery
311: Your Account
312: Home
313: Community Forums
314: Downloads
315: Downloads
316: Home
317: Member Screenshots
318: Your Account
319: Downloads
320: Home
321: Home
322: Photo Gallery
323: Member Screenshots
324: Photo Gallery
325: Home
326: Your Account
327: Member Screenshots
328: Downloads
329: Member Screenshots
330: Home
331: Community Forums
332: Photo Gallery
333: Community Forums
334: Community Forums
335: Photo Gallery
336: Photo Gallery
337: Member Screenshots
338: Home
339: Photo Gallery
340: Home
341: Community Forums
342: Photo Gallery

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
D. Doyle Book Discussion
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:39 pm
Post subject: D. Doyle Book Discussion

I recieved my new M551 book from David Doyle (Thanks Razz ) and enjoyed it very much! I can't get enough Sheridan stuff! There was one thing in it that really got my curiosity going and I want to post it here and see if we can shed some light on it. This is in no way meant to be critical of David's book. I'm just very interested in the M551's history. On page 9 is a picture that says it is vehicle #24 being delivered in 1966. There are two things that threw me here. First you will note the rings on the end of the grenade launchers. The rings were a modification that I thought came out in the early 70's. Secondly you can see the external pull handle to open the driver's hatch from outside. This also was a modification that I thought came out around 1975. I'm curious what the sign says.

Below is a Sheridan in Viet Nam in 1971. It has neither of the stated modifications. So the mystery is if the above photo is 1966 then why weren't these mods put on all of the Sheridans?

Something of note on "#24" is that it originally had it's turret fan in the old location. A plate has been welded over the hole. This is only the second one of these I've seen.

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 5:45 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

I confess to being completely unfamiliar with external pull handles for the driver's hatch*. Now I'm eager to get home and check all my pictures.


*Then again, I ETS'd at the end of '73

Edit:
VISMOD "mine plow". Still learning new stuff about Sheridan's 38 years later.... Wink

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 7:06 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

Doug, In Germany they put this MWO on around 1975 IIRC. It was so they could rescue an incapacited driver. It's something I've always used to date photos.

EDIT: Doug, look at your picture on the other side of that driver's hatch and you can make out the external slave receptacle. This MWO came out after I ETS'd in '79.

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:16 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

Another photo of "#24" from David's book. The two red circles are the bilge pump outlets. We had problems with dirt getting in the slots and clogging up the bilge pumps. So at some later date the slots were done away with. The flat thing on the exhaust is called an "Exhaust Plume Diffuser". It was MWO #1 on the Sheridan. (Modification Work Order) Not sure when that came out though. Another thing I noticed is that the grill does not have a screen over it. I don't know why.
[img]http://www.com-central.net/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/10924/normal_scan%7E1.jpg[/img]

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:06 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

Mark,
I have a copy of Org. Maint. Manual dated June '66. It shows the bilge pump slotted covers, not the exteranal driver release handle (which I never saw in service, for reasons we know). Only became familiar with the "exhaust plume diffuser" on later vehicles (ours were an artillery powder tube canister with the exhause outlet attached to the end, raising the whole affair about 2' into the air...not so much "diffusing" the plume, as getting it up out of your nostrils in heavy bush Mr. Green ).

I can't swear that I haven't seen the standard diffuser on older vehicles, but I certainly don't recall doing so.

How did the driver turret release handles come to be installed...from new beynd a certain date, or retrofit to all vehicles still in service?

I don't recall the "ringed" smoke dischargers either, nor do they appear on the fairly pristine ones we had in my Sheridan School class.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:13 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

I'm not familiar with a driver's turret release. I think the M1A1 has something like that. But they did a lot for the 82nd AB Sheridans. TTS, new grenade launchers, new driver's panel. Maybe it had something like that. I'll have to check. I've got the -10 on CD.

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:22 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

- MarkHolloway
I'm not familiar with a driver's turret release. I think the M1A1 has something like that. But they did a lot for the 82nd AB Sheridans. TTS, new grenade launchers, new driver's panel. Maybe it had something like that. I'll have to check. I've got the -10 on CD.


Mark,
I mis-spoke, typing too fast. Meant "driver's external hatch release" thingy. Probably thinking of the way it rotated compared to other hatches one usually thinks of.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:59 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

This shows the release:


_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:17 am
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

Got my book today,

Worth every penny and then some just for the pictures.

Great work David

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
ddoyle
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Nov 12, 2008
Posts: 61

PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:36 am
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

I'll try to shed a little light on this....

From the registration number, the delivery date of the vehicle was determined. The "shortly after delivery" statement is from a note in the file at the Ordnance Museum - a note written at an unknown time and by an unknown person.

That being said, I know infinitely more about 2 1/2 ton G-742 trucks than I do any other military vehicle. And I have copies of the test reports and correspondence between the army and Reo regarding what has come to be known as the air shift front axle. The correspondence dates from 1952-53, the test reports from 53-55 - and this improvement first appeared in production vehicles in 1971-72...with tens of thousands of trucks delivered in the meantime.

Hence, I'd not bet my life on it, but it wouldn't surprise me if Aberdeen was testing these Sheridan mods in 66-67, yet they weren't fielded until a decade later.

Best wishes,
David

PS: Joe and Mark, thank for your kind words.
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:53 am
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

David,

You beat me on that one, I was going to say the same thing. There were so many mods made for the M1 that took many years before they were officially put into production and then MWO applied to older models. Many MWO's were to upgrade older fleet models that were dated years after production models had them. Good case in point is the conversion from M73/219 MG to M240. The M60A3 was produced with the M240 whereas the M60A1 had to be upgraded with an MWO which was dated in the 80's. Budgets play a lot into this too.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
toadmanstankpictures
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:00 am
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

I'm keeping notes on this whole discussion for my M551 project. Wink Wink

_________________
Chris "toadman" Hughes
www.toadmanstankpictures.com
www.cafepress.com/toad...ksandstuff
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:03 am
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

- Joe_D
Good case in point is the conversion from M73/219 MG to M240. The M60A3 was produced with the M240 whereas the M60A1 had to be upgraded with an MWO which was dated in the 80's. Budgets play a lot into this too.


Just a warning, Joe, shot-across-the-bow thing...you're risking a ritual "banning" just for invoking the memory of the M73/219 MG. Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:41 am
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

Yes, the infamous M73/219.

Was told all the Horror stories by TC's and Gunner's when I was a young troop. Lucky not to experience them.

One named SSG Boggs told me the Nomenclature for the M219 was derived by multiplying it's predecessor, the M73, x 3, which was how much worse it was.

I actually got to work on one (M219) at Rodelheim in W. Germany. I couldn't believe they actually made that thing. What an idiotic concept and design.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
MarkHolloway
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Apr 08, 2006
Posts: 2054
Location: Beatty, Nevada
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:10 pm
Post subject: Re: D. Doyle Book Discussion

David, Good theory. I never thought of it taking ten years to get a mod to the field but that's certainly plausible. It would explain it all. Razz

_________________
"TUMBLEWEED"
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page 1, 2  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum