±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 314
Total: 314
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Home
03: Downloads
04: Community Forums
05: Statistics
06: Community Forums
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Home
10: Member Screenshots
11: Community Forums
12: Home
13: Home
14: Home
15: Your Account
16: Community Forums
17: Community Forums
18: Community Forums
19: Community Forums
20: Home
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Home
26: Community Forums
27: Photo Gallery
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Home
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Community Forums
34: Home
35: Home
36: Home
37: Community Forums
38: Downloads
39: Community Forums
40: Home
41: Home
42: Home
43: Community Forums
44: Home
45: Member Screenshots
46: News Archive
47: Home
48: Home
49: Home
50: Home
51: Community Forums
52: Photo Gallery
53: Photo Gallery
54: Home
55: Community Forums
56: Home
57: Community Forums
58: Home
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Home
70: Community Forums
71: Community Forums
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Home
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Home
79: Photo Gallery
80: Community Forums
81: Home
82: Home
83: Home
84: Home
85: Home
86: Home
87: Community Forums
88: Home
89: Member Screenshots
90: Community Forums
91: News
92: Home
93: Home
94: Community Forums
95: Home
96: Community Forums
97: Community Forums
98: Home
99: Home
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Home
104: News
105: Home
106: Community Forums
107: Home
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Downloads
111: Photo Gallery
112: Member Screenshots
113: Community Forums
114: Home
115: Home
116: Home
117: Home
118: Community Forums
119: Member Screenshots
120: Home
121: Home
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Home
129: Photo Gallery
130: Community Forums
131: Home
132: Community Forums
133: Home
134: Home
135: Home
136: Home
137: Home
138: Community Forums
139: Home
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Home
144: Home
145: Community Forums
146: Home
147: Community Forums
148: Downloads
149: Home
150: Home
151: Community Forums
152: Community Forums
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Home
156: Community Forums
157: Community Forums
158: Downloads
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Community Forums
163: Home
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Home
167: Home
168: Community Forums
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Downloads
172: Community Forums
173: Community Forums
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Home
180: Home
181: Home
182: Home
183: News Archive
184: Home
185: Community Forums
186: Home
187: Home
188: Home
189: Home
190: Downloads
191: Community Forums
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Community Forums
195: Home
196: Home
197: Downloads
198: Home
199: Home
200: Home
201: Community Forums
202: Home
203: Home
204: Community Forums
205: Home
206: Community Forums
207: Home
208: Community Forums
209: Home
210: Home
211: Home
212: Home
213: Home
214: Home
215: Member Screenshots
216: Home
217: Home
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Home
221: Home
222: Downloads
223: Community Forums
224: Community Forums
225: Home
226: Downloads
227: News
228: Photo Gallery
229: Home
230: Home
231: Community Forums
232: Home
233: Home
234: Home
235: Home
236: Home
237: Home
238: Home
239: Downloads
240: Home
241: Home
242: Home
243: Home
244: Home
245: Community Forums
246: Home
247: Home
248: Home
249: Home
250: Home
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Community Forums
254: Home
255: Home
256: News
257: Community Forums
258: Home
259: Home
260: Home
261: Home
262: Community Forums
263: Home
264: Community Forums
265: Home
266: Home
267: Home
268: Community Forums
269: Home
270: Home
271: Home
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: News
275: Tell a Friend
276: Community Forums
277: Home
278: Community Forums
279: Home
280: Home
281: Home
282: Home
283: Home
284: Home
285: Member Screenshots
286: Home
287: Home
288: Home
289: Community Forums
290: Downloads
291: Home
292: Downloads
293: Downloads
294: Home
295: Home
296: Community Forums
297: Community Forums
298: Home
299: Community Forums
300: Home
301: Downloads
302: News
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Community Forums
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Home
311: Home
312: Photo Gallery
313: Downloads
314: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
For all the M60A1 Fans
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 1:02 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

- Dontos
I do have more I can add, but I want to see what kind of silly post Doug will do for them.....

ah, that is besides the 'cute whittle kitty' above
Rolling Eyes

Don Cool


Whatever it takes, Don...whatever it takes. Wink

Guess I might need to actually get the entire series and scan them instead of taking a quick photo of them.


You hereby exhorted to do so officially. Less talk, more scanning!
Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Kurt_Laughlin
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 577

PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 1:44 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

If there is a larger shot of the M60A2s on the flat car available there may be some date info to be gleaned from the car markings.

I tried the "Properties" & paste trick mentioned elsewhere, didn't work . . .
KL
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:07 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

- Kurt_Laughlin

I tried the "Properties" & paste trick mentioned elsewhere, didn't work . . .
KL


Kurt,
In this case, it's not because the method doesn't work, but because the original images Don has hosted were posted there in sizes less than the maximum allowable here. That is, the "real size" he hosted are a "what you see is what you get" deal. No benefit to the "copy/paste properties" thing.

Had he put images of, say, 1200 x 1500 pixels up, then you'd notice a difference. (and I sure hope he does, because I want those images in a higher res...great stuff!).

I love the two M60A1 turrets on the flatbed. The very essence of the A1/A3 silhouette with no clutter.
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:11 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

I usually reduce images and size to ease the posting or viewing headache. I will check on my 'original photo' (its merely a digital snapshot of the actual photo, so there is some loss of clarity.

.....Be right back with something better... Rolling Eyes
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:17 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

- Joe_D
They also all come with the T142 track with replaceable pads.



Joe,
I noticed that too. When, exactly, were those introduced?....never saw any during my "tenure".

T'anks in advance....

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:34 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

Off the Hip,

I think 1973, although fielding probably kicked it back to 1974. M60A1 AOS were the first to have them with top loader air filters and of course, Add On gun Stabilization.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:38 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

- Joe_D
Off the Hip,

I think 1973, although fielding probably kicked it back to 1974. M60A1 AOS were the first to have them with top loader air filters and of course, Add On gun Stabilization.


Joe,

Thanks...one thing leads to another...

And AOS was introduced, specifically, when? (Never saw that one, either).

T.I.A.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:42 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

Program was started as the M60A1IP or PI,

Improved product or product improved.
Top loaders came first,
Then came the stabilization,
you put them altogether and you get the AOS, which was step I in the fleet upgrades. My info says 1972. I don't honestly believe the track factored in the AOS designation, only the Filters and Stabilization. Just that new tanks coming off the line would have the T142 track. Track was one of those that would change based on how much money the unit wanted to spend. Much like M1A1's equipped with old T156 chevron track when they should have the T158 pad model. We had T97 track on some of our M60A3's at Fort Irwin when I was with 1-63 Armor. Stateside units, especially TRADOC ones did this since the OP Tempo was so high in the school houses.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:57 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

Thanks, Joe...

What I find strange is that I was never exposed to AOS or anything BUT chevron track through the end of '73 on an M60A1, even at the Armor Board. And that includes the M60A2 Initial Production Test vehicles. Those were chevron track (and of course, integral stabilization, if you consider it rising to the dignity of that term). Seems odd that the A2's (we had three for the test) had the old track. I never saw replaceable track pads until I was well out of the Army (though I confess I wasn't following things much when I went back to school...co-eds, ya' know, and no internet).

I suddenly feel older than I....feel.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:22 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

IIRC most/if not all A2's came off the line with the T97 chevron track.

I personally believe the T142 track came out on production tanks around late '74 early '75. As far as it's effect on vehicle typing, It all depends on who's book you read. Some claim the T142 was for the AOS, others say it was for the RISE package. IMO it was for neither, and just was a newer track that came available for use. Much like the difference between the AVDS1790-2 and AVDS1790-2A. The -2A came out with the M60A1, the most noticeable change was the relocation of the fill spout. On the -2 it was in front by the dip stick, with the -2A it was moved to the back next to the transmission. This was done to keep spilled oil from fouling the oil coolers during topping off. If you spill oil by the transmission it isn't a problem. Most later M60 tankers never knew this because as engines were replaced all the M60's got -2A's and by the early 70's the -2 didn't exist anymore. No official MWO or designator was needed for the tank since they swapped out with no mods, just like track.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:09 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

- Joe_D
IIRC most/if not all A2's came off the line with the T97 chevron track.

I personally believe the T142 track came out on production tanks around late '74 early '75. As far as it's effect on vehicle typing, It all depends on who's book you read. Some claim the T142 was for the AOS, others say it was for the RISE package. IMO it was for neither, and just was a newer track that came available for use. Much like the difference between the AVDS1790-2 and AVDS1790-2A. The -2A came out with the M60A1, the most noticeable change was the relocation of the fill spout. On the -2 it was in front by the dip stick, with the -2A it was moved to the back next to the transmission. This was done to keep spilled oil from fouling the oil coolers during topping off. If you spill oil by the transmission it isn't a problem. Most later M60 tankers never knew this because as engines were replaced all the M60's got -2A's and by the early 70's the -2 didn't exist anymore. No official MWO or designator was needed for the tank since they swapped out with no mods, just like track.


Joe,
I'd buy into that that one. What can I say, I was at "The Board" (not a unit that wanted for service, or trick parts, or much of anything...we had three welders for a Company when the normal compliment was one for a Battalion) AND at the Armor Center (have to believe they had some sort of priority for tanky-stuff...as well as a Commandant of the Armor School that got really pissy about track damage to roads around his school...like end-connectors tearing up his curbs. I think his first name was "George" Wink ). Somehow, I never saw replaceable track pads with all that stroke around by the end of '73. I have a hard time believing it was "in service" in fielded units and Donn Starry (and that other guy) didn't have any at the "Home of Armor" if it was available, even in limited supply.

I don't know what the documents might say, but I sure as s*** know what track I was driving on or changing in Heard Motor Park. When we changed, we changed the whole track. (though changing pads actually sounds like more work, once you get those "sections of eight" broken down and the new track on.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:48 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

What can I say,

I have my opinions but I am careful not to throw stones unless I have real facts to back them up. I don't know if it's the lack of combat pedigree or maybe a lack of "sexiness", but the M60 really doesn't get that in depth research other systems do. The few that do cover it are either dated or just do a cursory bio on them. I find it ironic that the best source on the subject is Mr. Hunnicutt's "Patton" book, which covers from the M46 to the M60. There is no really good book that specifically covers the M60 series in depth. A real shame considering how many were made and how long they served.

though changing pads actually sounds like more work


Trust me, not much fun. On the M60 we're talking 360 pads, M1 352 pads.
Two ways to do it. IMO removing the track and changing them was easier in the long run.

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Sabot
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 380
Location: Kentucky
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:52 am
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

Changing out the entire track is much easier, but take it from a guy who's managed the Class IX budget for an armor battalion, when money's tight and track needs repair, sometimes the only option is to go the less expensive route and do track pads and centerguides only.

_________________
RobG
Back to top
View user's profile AIM Address
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2068
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 2:34 pm
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

Amen Rob,

That, and to remove, "spin 180" , replace sprockets (M1), and then re-install the track to even end connector wear. Something most units never did unless money was tight. But you could only do this with the omni-directional T142 and T158 track.

I never thought I'd say it, but I miss it now. But I don't think I could hang with the Kids anymore Sad

_________________
Joe_D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Doug_Kibbey
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 4678
Location: The Great Satan
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 3:38 pm
Post subject: Re: For all the M60A1 Fans

- Joe_D
Amen Rob,

That, and to remove, "spin 180" , replace sprockets (M1), and then re-install the track to even end connector wear. Something most units never did unless money was tight. But you could only do this with the omni-directional T142 and T158 track.

I never thought I'd say it, but I miss it now. But I don't think I could hang with the Kids anymore Sad


Joe,
I can recall swapping sprockets on chevron track, but my brain cells scream that it was more to reduce the "fish hook" effect on the sprocket teeth (which might, admittedly, contribute to end connector wear). Does that sound plausible?
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 2 of 3
All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum