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Tank Insignia
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.

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armyjunk2
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 4:21 pm Post subject: Tank Insignia
Hello everyone, Does anyone here know if this is a correct insignia on this tank, the colors seem to be reversed, the "normal" US insignia for the period would have been a red circle, white star, blue surrounding circle. Don maybe you can help.

SHAWN
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 5:18 pm
Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia

What museum is this, etc.? What did the museum say it was marked to be?

You are correct, it is a variation of the 3-color star, in use until 1941. I would think that the markings are incorrect, as the first M3 left the factory in March of 41. I cant see it, cant verifiy... I wouldnt think it to be an early M3... it has protectoscope fitted to the front hatches, fitted to most M3's produced after 1941...
the 3 color star fell out of use during 1941, so I wouldnt think this to be marked correctly...
I am just a lowly cook...

armyjunk2
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 5:36 pm Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia
its at the Patton Museum, its in a December 8th 1941 Philippine exhibit. Its actually the wrong tank but I am more curious about the insignia. I really thought it was nice someone remembered the early Philippine Campaign.

C_Sherman
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:09 pm
Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia

Hi,

That star coloration is correct for a certain pre/early war period. The version you are thinking of (blue around the outside of the white star) was an Army Air Corps marking used on aircraft. The red surround was often seen on armored vehicles/tanks on training exercises in the US. I can't recall if the use of that star continued into North Africa, but it didn't last long there if it did.

Early model tanks in the Pacific would have carried this style (as depicted at the Patton Museum, obviously) but they didn't survive long enough to benefit from the later style & color changes. The sudden change from training and peacetime to full wartime hostilities occurred so rapidly that there wasn't much time to change anything!

Chuck

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armyjunk2
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 6:37 pm Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia
Thanks everyone for all the info. Isn't the internet great? Last edited by armyjunk2 on Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:39 pm; edited 2 times in total

Garry_Redmon
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:09 pm Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia
The markings are correct for pre-World War II. Charles Lemons, the Patton Museum curator, wrote the book on them: www.amazon.com/Organiz...94&sr=1-16 _________________ armorfortheages.com/

HeinzPatzfahl
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:31 pm Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia
According to >Osprey Vanguard 39, US Armour Camouflage and Markings 1917-45< (Hello Steven J.Zaloga from Berlin, Germany) that marking shown by armyjunk 2 belonged to the 2 nd Armored Division, Fort Hood, Texas in 1941: Plate B showing a M3 Medium with exact the same markings. Heinz Patzfahl

SHAWN
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:49 pm Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia
Armyjunk2, is your question answered? So according to the info from Heinz, it is correct for the 2nd AD stateside, but not for the 192nd or 194th tank battalions in the P.I. (wrong M3 variant for either battalion; they had blue registration numbers and yellow nicknames, no photo documentation showing national insignia or turret bands). I knew I had seen pre-war markings elsewhere.

armyjunk2
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Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: Tank Insignia
Yes it is and thanks everyone

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