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Well, Xcal,

Hey man all I can say is...You Win! You stumped the crowd!

I didn't participate simply to give others a chance as well....otherwise it woulda been like vulching on my own thread, y'know? But, hey, it was fun while it lasted. And you got what looks like a pretty schnarky paintjob for a P-38 out of it. Now, I'm really looking forward to what the answer you were looking for is!

..and then I'll have to think of a really cool grand prize for you, the Grand Poo-Bah Finalist! LOL!

Well like I said, if nobody else is going to answer, I will. I know/believe my first 2 in my original post were correct:

#1 Clear. Appearance is hard and glossy formed by large water droplets. The flow-back is greatest at temperatures just at O° C. The result is a sheet of solid, clear, glazed ice with very little air enclosed.

#2 Rime. Brittle and frost like formed by small water droplets. O° C and –40° C.

The 3rd had me stumped because (after looking back through my books) it wasn't listed with the 2 I gave under "structural icing" but it was listed by itself after that fact..................

#3 Frost. Frost occurs when moist air comes in contact with a surface at sub zero temperatures. The water vapour, rather than condensing to form liquid water, changes directly to ice and deposits in the form of frost.

I posted the document that contains all the answers at the bottom of page three. Find the two you know, and you'll find the third one too. And look elsewhere in the document, you'll find the extra credit answer too.

LOL, well that one was there too. But since you asked for 3 and Rime, clear, frost & mixed is 4, well I chose the wrong one again!

#1- Clear. Appearance is hard and glossy formed by large water droplets. The flow-back is greatest at temperatures just at O° C. The result is a sheet of solid, clear, glazed ice with very little air enclosed.

#2- Rime. Brittle and frost like formed by small water droplets. O° C and –40° C.

#3- Mixed ice is a combination of rime and clear ice.

Anti-icing is turned on before the flight enters icing
conditions. Typically this includes carburetor heat,
prop heat, pitot heat, fuel vent heat, windshield heat,
and fluid surface deicers (in some cases).
Deicing is used after ice has built up to an appreciable
amount. Typically this includes surface deice
equipment.

Propeller Anti-icers: Ice often forms on the propeller
before it is visible on the wing. Props are treated with
deicing fluid applied by slinger rings on the prop hub
or with electrically heated elements on the leading
edges.

Wing Deicer, and Anti-icing Systems: There is
presently one type of wing deicer�boots�and two
anti-icing systems�weeping wing systems (fluid
deice systems) and heated wings�that are commonly
used in general aviation today. For the most part,
general aviation aircraft equipped to fly in icing conditions
use boots and, to a lesser extent, weeping
wings. Hot wings are typically found on jets and will
not be discussed in this publication.

Boots are inflatable rubber strips attached to and conforming
to the leading edge of the wing and tail surfaces.
When activated, they are pressurized with air
and they expand, breaking ice off the boot surfaces.

- fr8ycat

LOL, well that one was there too. But since you asked for 3 and Rime, clear, frost & mixed is 4, well I chose the wrong one again!

#1- Clear. Appearance is hard and glossy formed by large water droplets. The flow-back is greatest at temperatures just at O° C. The result is a sheet of solid, clear, glazed ice with very little air enclosed.

#2- Rime. Brittle and frost like formed by small water droplets. O° C and –40° C.

#3- Mixed ice is a combination of rime and clear ice.

Anti-icing is turned on before the flight enters icing
conditions. Typically this includes carburetor heat,
prop heat, pitot heat, fuel vent heat, windshield heat,
and fluid surface deicers (in some cases).
Deicing is used after ice has built up to an appreciable
amount. Typically this includes surface deice
equipment.

Propeller Anti-icers: Ice often forms on the propeller
before it is visible on the wing. Props are treated with
deicing fluid applied by slinger rings on the prop hub
or with electrically heated elements on the leading
edges.

Wing Deicer, and Anti-icing Systems: There is
presently one type of wing deicer�boots�and two
anti-icing systems�weeping wing systems (fluid
deice systems) and heated wings�that are commonly
used in general aviation today. For the most part,
general aviation aircraft equipped to fly in icing conditions
use boots and, to a lesser extent, weeping
wings. Hot wings are typically found on jets and will
not be discussed in this publication.

Boots are inflatable rubber strips attached to and conforming
to the leading edge of the wing and tail surfaces.
When activated, they are pressurized with air
and they expand, breaking ice off the boot surfaces.

*ding*ding*ding*ding*ding*

We (finally) have a winner! Mr. fr8ycat is indeed correct, the three types of structural aircraft icing are clear, rime, and mixed, as described by our winner. fr8y, please check your pm. Hope you have more luck with your question than I did

Ok, Fr8ycat has survived Torquemada's most harsh spankin and is ready to resume his obligations to the Contest.

It has been called the greatest aircraft ever built, definitetly the greatest "Spy"
Aircraft ever built.

Over the course of it's history it has had 3 designations. Name the 3 designations
starting with the first and the Government agency that first designation flew for.

The Prize: one used ASA Robinson R22 Pilot's guide and one slightly out of date
Los Angeles Helicopter route chart.

YF-11, A-12, SR-71. Began life as a CIA U-2 replacement, then an Air Force interceptor proposal, then bounced between A.F. and CIA, then settled at the A.F. In the end, the decision to keep it a "black" recon aircraft was ultimately bad for Lockheed, because the numbers produced could never rival expected production for an interceptor...

follow-on....what blabbermouth spoke out of turn and mis-referred to it as an "SR-71" causing the misnomer to stick?

- JG300-Ascout

YF-11, A-12, SR-71. Began life as a CIA U-2 replacement, then an Air Force interceptor proposal, then bounced between A.F. and CIA, then settled at the A.F. In the end, the decision to keep it a "black" recon aircraft was ultimately bad for Lockheed, because the numbers produced could never rival expected production for an interceptor...

follow-on....what blabbermouth spoke out of turn and mis-referred to it as an "SR-71" causing the misnomer to stick?

Ascout check your answer. Possibly a typo or the judges might have to be called in.

- fr8ycat

- JG300-Ascout

YF-11, A-12, SR-71. Began life as a CIA U-2 replacement, then an Air Force interceptor proposal, then bounced between A.F. and CIA, then settled at the A.F. In the end, the decision to keep it a "black" recon aircraft was ultimately bad for Lockheed, because the numbers produced could never rival expected production for an interceptor...

follow-on....what blabbermouth spoke out of turn and mis-referred to it as an "SR-71" causing the misnomer to stick?

Ascout check your answer. Possibly a typo or the judges might have to be called in.

YF-11 is sometimes called YF-11/YF-12, but I'd go with YF-11 as the most acceptable (I didn't Google for my first answer...I've read "Skunk Works" )

Well the judges (me) have come to a conclusion and your the winner!!!!!

Have taken a new interest in this bird since catching "Modern Marvels" episode on it. Have to admit I was a little worried about asking the question becasue there is some conflicting data out there on the web about it.

Since you have read a book on it I'll say you obviously are more educated than myself on it. I only questioned it because everything I have read refers to the YF-12. Did a Google and only one site comes up with YF-11 but it does come up.

I guess if you were to include the test aircraft there were more designations than 3, example the test craft or designs which ultimately became the final A-12 were numbered A-1 through A-11, but from what I understand A-12, YF-12 & SR-71 were the final productions that actually did the job. I'm sure I'll learn more and probably become more confused but that's the fun of it all. Will probably get "Sled Driver" & will check out "skunk works".

Congrats and your prize will soon be in the mail!

BTW is that Blabbermouth "LBJ"?

- fr8ycat

Well the judges (me) have come to a conclusion and your the winner!!!!!

Have taken a new interest in this bird since catching "Modern Marvels" episode on it. Have to admit I was a little worried about asking the question becasue there is some conflicting data out there on the web about it.

Since you have read a book on it I'll say you obviously are more educated than myself on it. I only questioned it because everything I have read refers to the YF-12. Did a Google and only one site comes up with YF-11 but it does come up.

I guess if you were to include the test aircraft there were more designations than 3, example the test craft or designs which ultimately became the final A-12 were numbered A-1 through A-11, but from what I understand A-12, YF-12 & SR-71 were the final productions that actually did the job. I'm sure I'll learn more and probably become more confused but that's the fun of it all. Will probably get "Sled Driver" & will check out "skunk works".

Congrats and your prize will soon be in the mail!

BTW is that Blabbermouth "LBJ"?

Finally, Ascout wins something! Now, about the misnomer ID that it got stuck with with...SR-71. What's wrong with it and who is responsible for this error?

I post this on the understanding I'm cr*p at quizes and I hope I don't win 'cause I can't think of a question to ask...

The SR-71 designator is actually a continuation of the pre-1962 bomber series, which ended with the B-70 Valkyrie. Late in its career, the B-70 was proposed for the reconnaissance/strike role, with an RS-70 designation. The "RS" prefix (sometimes written as "R/S") was actually allowed as an explicit "special case" in the orignal 1962 issue of the designation regulations. When it was clear that Lockheed's A-12 aircraft (then used by the CIA) had much greater performance potential, it was decided to "push" a USAF version of that one instead of the RS-70. This USAF version was to become the RS-71.

"Conventional" wisdom now says that then president Lyndon B. Johnson messed up the designation in his public announcement and called it the SR-71 - and nobody wanted to correct the president. Because the strike mission had been cancelled anyway, "SR" was quickly reinterpreted as "Strategic Reconnaissance". However, a first-hand witness of those events recently revealed in Aviation Week & Space Technology, that LBJ did not misread anything. In fact, then USAF Chief of Staff LeMay simply didn't like the "RS" designator - he already objected it when the RS-70 was discussed, preferring "SR-70". When the RS-71 was to be announced, he wanted to make sure it would be called SR-71 instead. He managed to have LBJ's speech script altered to show "SR-71" in all places. Using archived copies of LBJ's speech, it can actually be verified that it reads SR-71 both in the script and on the tape recording. However, the official transcript of the speech, created from the stenographic records and handed to the press afterwards, shows "RS-71" in three places. It seems that not the president but a stenographer did accidentally switch the letters, and thus create a famous aviation "urban legend".

So the 'culprit'...Chief of Staff Curtis LeMay ?

I googled it if that helps disqualify me

I guess this means I gotta' come up with a serious quiz thingy, right?

Gimme' a day or so, I'm working on it...

OK! Here is the next "quiz question". (Regrettably, "Fr8ycat" must be asked to recuse himself and bite his tongue unless y'all get completely mired...he "knows too much" about this subject already)

What is the historical (Vietnam era, though the concept still exists...we're talking '60s-'70s equipment for the purpose of the quiz, though) composition of a "Pink team" and a "Heavy Pink Team" (what two aircraft would be involved) and extra credit for a third type that might accompany the two primary aircraft? What is the "role" of each in this application?

What is the significance of the color in this context, and from what does it derive? Extra credit if you can identify the color not included, but usually represented in the units operating Pink Teams). What are the typical associations of the two (or three, if you're going for bonus points) colors represented?

Hint: This is strictly a helicopter question. "Google is disallowed"...if you just specify the aircraft, I'll know you cheated!

Prize to be awarded: Authentic hand-rolled incense stick package direct from Vietnam.

Hey guys, just a reminder to try and connect your quizzes with something here at CC Not a requirement, but it's more fun that way