±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 600
Total: 600
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Community Forums
03: Photo Gallery
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: News
07: Photo Gallery
08: Community Forums
09: Community Forums
10: Community Forums
11: Community Forums
12: Community Forums
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Community Forums
16: Community Forums
17: Downloads
18: Community Forums
19: Member Screenshots
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Downloads
24: Photo Gallery
25: Photo Gallery
26: Community Forums
27: Home
28: Community Forums
29: Community Forums
30: Downloads
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Community Forums
34: Community Forums
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Your Account
41: Downloads
42: Community Forums
43: Downloads
44: Community Forums
45: Photo Gallery
46: Downloads
47: Downloads
48: Community Forums
49: Home
50: Your Account
51: Home
52: Downloads
53: Photo Gallery
54: Photo Gallery
55: CPGlang
56: Home
57: Community Forums
58: Home
59: Photo Gallery
60: Photo Gallery
61: Photo Gallery
62: Community Forums
63: Photo Gallery
64: Community Forums
65: Community Forums
66: Home
67: Photo Gallery
68: Photo Gallery
69: Community Forums
70: Community Forums
71: Community Forums
72: Photo Gallery
73: Community Forums
74: Home
75: Community Forums
76: Community Forums
77: Community Forums
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Downloads
82: Community Forums
83: Community Forums
84: Your Account
85: Downloads
86: Community Forums
87: Photo Gallery
88: Your Account
89: Community Forums
90: Your Account
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Community Forums
95: Your Account
96: Community Forums
97: Photo Gallery
98: Home
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: Community Forums
102: Community Forums
103: Photo Gallery
104: Community Forums
105: Community Forums
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Community Forums
109: Community Forums
110: Community Forums
111: Photo Gallery
112: Community Forums
113: Community Forums
114: Community Forums
115: News Archive
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Community Forums
120: Downloads
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Community Forums
124: Community Forums
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Home
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Home
134: Community Forums
135: Downloads
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Photo Gallery
139: Community Forums
140: Photo Gallery
141: Community Forums
142: Photo Gallery
143: Home
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Community Forums
147: Community Forums
148: Community Forums
149: Photo Gallery
150: Community Forums
151: Your Account
152: Community Forums
153: Photo Gallery
154: Home
155: Photo Gallery
156: Photo Gallery
157: Community Forums
158: Downloads
159: Photo Gallery
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Community Forums
163: Your Account
164: Photo Gallery
165: Community Forums
166: Downloads
167: Community Forums
168: Photo Gallery
169: Home
170: Community Forums
171: CPGlang
172: Community Forums
173: Photo Gallery
174: Community Forums
175: Community Forums
176: Photo Gallery
177: Community Forums
178: Photo Gallery
179: Community Forums
180: Photo Gallery
181: Community Forums
182: Community Forums
183: Photo Gallery
184: Photo Gallery
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Photo Gallery
188: Home
189: Community Forums
190: Home
191: Downloads
192: Community Forums
193: Community Forums
194: Downloads
195: Community Forums
196: Community Forums
197: Community Forums
198: Community Forums
199: Community Forums
200: Community Forums
201: Photo Gallery
202: Community Forums
203: Photo Gallery
204: Community Forums
205: Community Forums
206: Community Forums
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Community Forums
211: Photo Gallery
212: Community Forums
213: Community Forums
214: Downloads
215: Home
216: Photo Gallery
217: Community Forums
218: Home
219: Home
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Community Forums
224: Community Forums
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: Downloads
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Photo Gallery
232: Home
233: Community Forums
234: Photo Gallery
235: Home
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Home
239: Photo Gallery
240: Community Forums
241: Photo Gallery
242: Community Forums
243: Community Forums
244: Home
245: Statistics
246: Photo Gallery
247: Member Screenshots
248: Statistics
249: Community Forums
250: Downloads
251: Home
252: Photo Gallery
253: Home
254: Photo Gallery
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Community Forums
258: Community Forums
259: Home
260: Photo Gallery
261: Community Forums
262: Member Screenshots
263: CPGlang
264: Community Forums
265: Photo Gallery
266: Community Forums
267: Community Forums
268: Community Forums
269: Community Forums
270: Photo Gallery
271: Home
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Community Forums
275: Community Forums
276: Home
277: Photo Gallery
278: Community Forums
279: Community Forums
280: Community Forums
281: Photo Gallery
282: Community Forums
283: Community Forums
284: Photo Gallery
285: Photo Gallery
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Community Forums
289: Community Forums
290: Photo Gallery
291: Member Screenshots
292: Community Forums
293: Photo Gallery
294: Community Forums
295: Community Forums
296: Photo Gallery
297: Community Forums
298: Community Forums
299: Community Forums
300: Community Forums
301: Community Forums
302: Community Forums
303: Community Forums
304: Community Forums
305: Photo Gallery
306: Community Forums
307: Home
308: Community Forums
309: Home
310: Home
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Downloads
314: Community Forums
315: Community Forums
316: Home
317: Community Forums
318: Photo Gallery
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Community Forums
322: Home
323: Community Forums
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Community Forums
327: Photo Gallery
328: Community Forums
329: Photo Gallery
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Photo Gallery
335: Photo Gallery
336: Community Forums
337: Community Forums
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Community Forums
341: Community Forums
342: Community Forums
343: Community Forums
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Community Forums
347: Community Forums
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Home
351: Community Forums
352: Community Forums
353: Community Forums
354: Community Forums
355: Community Forums
356: Community Forums
357: CPGlang
358: Community Forums
359: Photo Gallery
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Home
366: Community Forums
367: Community Forums
368: Member Screenshots
369: Photo Gallery
370: Community Forums
371: Home
372: CPGlang
373: Community Forums
374: Community Forums
375: Community Forums
376: Community Forums
377: Community Forums
378: Photo Gallery
379: Photo Gallery
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Community Forums
383: Community Forums
384: Community Forums
385: Community Forums
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Home
389: Community Forums
390: Community Forums
391: Photo Gallery
392: Community Forums
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: CPGlang
396: Community Forums
397: CPGlang
398: Community Forums
399: Community Forums
400: Photo Gallery
401: Community Forums
402: Photo Gallery
403: Home
404: Community Forums
405: Community Forums
406: Photo Gallery
407: Home
408: Community Forums
409: Community Forums
410: Downloads
411: Community Forums
412: Photo Gallery
413: Community Forums
414: Photo Gallery
415: Community Forums
416: Community Forums
417: Statistics
418: Community Forums
419: Downloads
420: Photo Gallery
421: Home
422: Home
423: Community Forums
424: Downloads
425: News
426: Community Forums
427: Community Forums
428: Community Forums
429: Community Forums
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Home
433: Home
434: Photo Gallery
435: Community Forums
436: Photo Gallery
437: Community Forums
438: Community Forums
439: Photo Gallery
440: Community Forums
441: Photo Gallery
442: Community Forums
443: Community Forums
444: CPGlang
445: Photo Gallery
446: Community Forums
447: Photo Gallery
448: Statistics
449: Community Forums
450: Community Forums
451: Community Forums
452: Community Forums
453: Community Forums
454: Photo Gallery
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Community Forums
460: Community Forums
461: Photo Gallery
462: Community Forums
463: Home
464: Community Forums
465: Community Forums
466: Home
467: Photo Gallery
468: Community Forums
469: Community Forums
470: Home
471: Community Forums
472: Community Forums
473: Photo Gallery
474: Community Forums
475: Photo Gallery
476: Community Forums
477: Community Forums
478: Community Forums
479: Community Forums
480: Downloads
481: Community Forums
482: Community Forums
483: Photo Gallery
484: Community Forums
485: Home
486: Community Forums
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Photo Gallery
490: Photo Gallery
491: Home
492: Community Forums
493: Community Forums
494: Community Forums
495: Home
496: Home
497: Member Screenshots
498: Community Forums
499: Home
500: Community Forums
501: Community Forums
502: Community Forums
503: Community Forums
504: Community Forums
505: Home
506: Community Forums
507: Photo Gallery
508: Community Forums
509: Community Forums
510: Home
511: Home
512: Photo Gallery
513: Community Forums
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Community Forums
517: Community Forums
518: Downloads
519: Home
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Community Forums
523: Community Forums
524: Photo Gallery
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Home
528: Downloads
529: Community Forums
530: Community Forums
531: Statistics
532: Downloads
533: Community Forums
534: Community Forums
535: Community Forums
536: Member Screenshots
537: Community Forums
538: Community Forums
539: Community Forums
540: Photo Gallery
541: Community Forums
542: Community Forums
543: Photo Gallery
544: Home
545: Community Forums
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Photo Gallery
549: Home
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Community Forums
554: Home
555: Community Forums
556: CPGlang
557: Community Forums
558: Community Forums
559: Community Forums
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Photo Gallery
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Member Screenshots
568: Home
569: Community Forums
570: Community Forums
571: Community Forums
572: Community Forums
573: Photo Gallery
574: Downloads
575: Home
576: Community Forums
577: Community Forums
578: Community Forums
579: Community Forums
580: Community Forums
581: Community Forums
582: Community Forums
583: Member Screenshots
584: Your Account
585: Community Forums
586: Community Forums
587: Community Forums
588: Community Forums
589: Community Forums
590: News
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Community Forums
595: Community Forums
596: Community Forums
597: Community Forums
598: Home
599: Photo Gallery
600: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
SHAWN
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:52 pm
Post subject: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

okay fellas, happened to catch the tail end report on the news this evening in re: an anti-RPG system or something. it was developed by the IDF, called Trophy?

do any of you who know more about this, feel that you can comment, shed more light on how this is supposed to work?

shawn
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JimWeb
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 1439
Location: The back of beyond
PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Not adopted by anyone yet as it is useless in built-up areas and poses a hazard to any of the dismounts around the vehicle. It is strictly a wide-open spaces and everyone under armour system.

TRAPS is a much better system that can be used even with personnel stood beside it...

Cool

_________________
TTFN
Jim

If your not a member of JED then your
not serious about anything military..

***********************
www.jedsite.info
JED Military Equipment
***********************
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Shadow_Banshee
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 03, 2005
Posts: 575

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 1:05 am
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

maybe this might be intresting, i checked and its ok to link to it, www.thesop.org/index.php?id=878 i was recently discusing this with a IDF friend so the link was handy. hope it helps.

_________________
Lay me place and bake me Pie
I'm starving for me Gravy
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 3:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

I believe Trophy may have seen some limited use in Lebanon last year. There's been a recent media stink about the U.S. turning its nose up to Trophy in favor of a home-grown version that's still pretty far down the road.

My own ill-informed concern with Trophy is its electronic footprint. Radars scannning for incoming rockets sounds like an opponent should be able to pick up and isolate vehicle signatures from miles away. 'Captain, I'm reading three Trophy signatures off the port bow!"
Back to top
View user's profile
SHAWN
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 31, 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 5:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

thanks, i know i am not the only one who feels this way, the media can get my blood boiling...

oh my goodness, i cant believe i was going to use this term, the "drive-by" media, lisa meyers or whomever she was, reported on the trophy system,
presenting views and opinions that i dont feel are accurate, trying to make the govt or army out to be the bad guys and not putting the lives of the soldier first, blah, blah, blah.

this type of defense has some good pros, but too many cons at the present...
this is the first i have heard of it. sounds viable, but how useful would it really be?
seems like sci-fi, force fields around vehicles and such, seems cool


the story had mentioned something to do with an auto-loader, how did that fit into the system?

thanks for shedding some light on this for me, and for the link. i will check it out.
shawn
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Neil_Baumgardner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3942
Location: Arlington, VA
PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 5:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Army Committed to Force Protection, Not False Security
By Jim Garamone
American Forces Press Service

WASHINGTON, Sept. 8, 2006 – Army leaders are committed to ensuring soldiers have the best force-protection capability possible, but also want to avoid giving soldiers a false sense of security, service officials said here today.

Maj. Gen. Jeffrey A, Sorenson, the Army’s deputy for acquisition and systems management, took exception to an NBC News report that said the Army is not buying an Israeli system, called Trophy, that could protect soldiers and their vehicles from rocket-propelled grenades. The report alleges the Army manipulated information in favor of a competing Raytheon system, called Quick Kill.

Both the Israeli and Raytheon systems are designed to fire missiles that intercept RPGs in flight. The Israeli system may be six months ahead of the Raytheon system, but it has limitations. The NBC report made it sound as if the Army refused to field a perfectly fine combat system that would save lives, officials said.

Sorenson said they system is not a “produceable item.� The Israelis have been working on the Trophy system for 10 or 11 years, Sorenson said. “If this thing was ready to go, my question would be, why wasn’t it on the particular tanks that went into Lebanon?� he said. No Israeli Merkava tanks carried the Trophy system, he said.

Other problems include the fact that the system right now has no reloading capability. Once it fires, that side of the vehicle is vulnerable. Which brings up another shortcoming: the Trophy can only be mounted to protect one axis. This means officials would have to mount multiple missile systems on every vehicle. The Quick Kill missile has 360-degree capability and a reload capability.

Another worry is collateral damage, he said. “In a tight urban area, the Trophy system may take out the RPG, but we may kill 20 people in the process,� Sorenson said. “That is a concern we have that we haven’t fully evaluated.�

The general said there also is confusion on the contract award. “It was awarded by the lead system integrator and the government team,� Sorenson said. “It was not done by Raytheon. There was confusion in the report that the Army was cooking the books and which was absolutely false, blatantly false.�

Sorenson said the Army has standards of performance for force-protection capabilities. “These have not only been dictated by lessons learned in theater, but all the work we have done heretofore on all the systems prior to this,� he said. “We will not put anything out there that has not demonstrated that it is capable of doing what it is alleged to do.�

The bottom line is that if a system “does not have the ‘Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval’ it does not go forward,� Sorenson said.

The general said that every soldier lost is a tragedy. But, of the more than 1,400 soldiers killed in Iraq, most died from improvised explosive devices. A total of 148 soldiers have been lost due to an RPG or an RPG and other weapons. Sixty-three soldiers died by RPG only, he said. Broken down further, 10 soldiers died as a result of an RPG hit to a U.S. combat system -- an Abrams tank, Bradley fighting vehicle, Stryker wheeled vehicle or M-113 armored personnel carrier.

“The reason that is so low is that those combat systems already have good force-protection systems applied,� Sorenson said. There are reactive armor tiles on the Bradley. Officials added slat-armor protection to the Stryker, and all combat vehicles have protection built into them, officials said.
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Some describe the debate as a contest between a high-tech one-shot reactive system that may cost more than the vehicle itself vs a cheap steel cage with bars spaced 3 inches apart. of course a cheap steel cage doesn't boost Raytheon profit margin.

D'oh! I almost forgot to mention. Our gracious host 'AFV News' had a brief article on Trophy in its journal a short while ago. Is your magazine subscription up-to-date? Wink
Back to top
View user's profile
mike_Duplessis
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 236

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:58 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Ah! By sheer coincidence I got home from work early last night, just in time to see an NBC news report pretty darned critical of Pentagon procurement in regards to Trophy. Not that they didn't field it, more that they did everything possible to keep from even looking at it! So the old story's still got legs.
Back to top
View user's profile
bsmart
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 23, 2006
Posts: 2523
Location: Central Maryland
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

I saw the story on NBC also. It was a pretty pointed and damning piece. Their focus was 'Army Does everything it can to keep from testing a system which may save soldiers lives to protect the FCS program which their (The Armys) favored contractor is developing' Including the old 'The Army refused our requests for interviews' which NEVER plays well.

Also nothing about cost or potential danger to dismounts (Which is the big problem I've always felt was there with active/reactive systems)

_________________
Bob Smart ([email protected])
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail
Joe_D
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 29, 2006
Posts: 2066
Location: Razorback Country
PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 7:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Trophy-- anit-RPG technology?

Nobody's mentioned Humvee Protection,
Just curious if it would apply to them, since the majority of the traffic is of those type of vehicles. Pardon my ignorance but can it be used with a crewmember exposed in an open cupola??? If not the value would be even less. I will say that protective upgrades are happening all the time and as soon as you get used to one another comes out even better. IED's are the most common and biggest killer. RPG's can mess your day up, but at least there's a person you can kill if he tries to engage you. Can't fight an IED.
Did not see the NBC program, kinda glad I don't have regular access to it based on what everyone has said. Let's hope this story doesn't end up prompting some Congressman to start another uneccesary investigation that will either buy us a system we don't really need and siphon off funds needed elsewhere (Counter IED) or prevent the fielding of one in a timely manner that does work.

Joe D
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum