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What's this Tiger tank?
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 8:31 am
Post subject: What's this Tiger tank?

Seen on an article in a French newspaper, which deals with the Vimoutiers Tiger restoration :



said to be "a recent restoration of two Tiger tanks by the German company Hoebig". I've never heard of this before...

P-O

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Pzkpfw-e
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:11 am
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

Something to do with Kevin Wheatcroft, Iain King's? The Frankfurt wreck?
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Asbjoern
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 10:28 am
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

The main part of Wheatcrofts Tiger I should be the hull fragment frormerly in a German collection in the Rhein-Main region, which is, according to the pictures, far more complete. As most of the side - panel seems newly manufactured with only the front part original this may be the fragments from the Pirmasens collection.

Jens
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TimRoyall
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:51 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

Where's the one in the background from?
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Walter
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 5:28 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

[quote="the_shadock"]:
said to be "a recent restoration of two Tiger tanks by the German company Hoebig". I've never heard of this before...

Hoebig is much involved in Sinsheim Museum and Westwall museum
and also involved with the Jagdpanther from Gibb
He trade the gun for the jagdpanther wich came from Westwallmuseum

Walter
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Manu-Military
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 6:31 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

Mr Hoebig was the former and last owner of the Trun scrapyard.
When I first met him, he told me that he was actually rebuilding one Tiger I with scrap parts along with a PzIV.
But that was in 2005, so a lot of water has dropped since then...

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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 7:03 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

The more complete Tiger tank in the background doesn't fit with the Bovington's or the Aberdeen's, because that one has a late running gear, and the two others have early running gears. Doesn't seem to fit with any of the known survivors indeed. Doesn't fit with the repro made for the film "the white tiger", which also has an early running gear.


I really wonder what it is and where it comes from...

P-O

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VonForhud
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:43 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

Cant you just call Hoebig and ask them? Is it a big secret who they work for?

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:51 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

Intriguing to say the least. Not one but TWO tigers under restoration ... how could this have slipped under our radar, under all radar?

I want more pictures and provenance NOW dammit Smile

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:10 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

My best guess is that the Tiger in the background is the Iain King Tiger "parts kit" that came out of Russia (Moscow Oblast) It was, when recovered, fairly complete concerning hull components (in pieces though) and with late type running gear.

The hull under reconstruction looks like parts from the Westwall Museum, final drive plate fragment and sponson side plate.

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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 5:55 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

I'll ask Iain King to see if that's really his tank.

P-O

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Asbjoern
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 10:11 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

o.k. ... the lower hull in progress contains the fragments known as parts of the westwall museum. The parts owned by Ian King schould be the parts found in Estonia by a guy active on the WAF as Jevginii. The hull from Mocsow oblast (found with the Tiger now in Lenino) is listed in the .pdf as parts of a private collection near Frankfurt, according to other informations sold to Kevin Wheatcroft...

None of these puzzles (as long as the pictures published contain the whole lots) contained more parts of the turret then fragmented roofs... so it would be a wonder if one of the two puzzles in queston made it to a complete Tiger in such a short time... so the Tank in the background must be another tank ... misteriousely out of sight for all tank hunters until today! And if it is a repro it would be the best running gear I ever saw on a such a tank!

Very interesting...

Jens
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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 10:27 am
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

The Tiger tank doesn't contain any of Iain King's parts. I've asked him and he answered that he didn't really started with this project yet.

On the Wehrmacht Awards Forum, a member answered that "Herr Hoebig was once the owner of the Trun scrap yard in Normandy. So he probably took all the Tiger I bits and pieces and started welding them back together again ( several Tiger i's were cut up there).

the Jagdpanther at Sinsheim is another creation of him. He used a former target range Jagdpanther wreck (what was left was the lower hull and the gunmount). The entire rear and engine deck was recreated using Panther G parts ( also from the Trun scrap yard) . The upperhull and fighting compartiment is replica. if you look at it closely you can see all kinds of extra weldseems that shouldn't be there."

So this is maybe the answer to our questions. It would be very nice if someone speaking German correctly could ask Mr Hoebig, and then we would know... at worst, Herr Hoebig will say "I have nothing to say, that's not your problem".

There are some other forums dealing with the same question :
http://worldwartwozone.com/forums/index.php?/topic/27370-new-tiger-1s-restoration/

http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?36514-Tiger-population-increasing

P-O

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the_shadock
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 11:12 am
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

I've sent an email to the French newspaper, asking for more information, or to be put in contact with the source of the photo. Fingers crossed !!

P-O

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Rikard_Hufschmied
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:09 pm
Post subject: Re: What's this Tiger tank?

- Asbjoern
o.k. ... the lower hull in progress contains the fragments known as parts of the westwall museum. The parts owned by Ian King schould be the parts found in Estonia by a guy active on the WAF as Jevginii. The hull from Mocsow oblast (found with the Tiger now in Lenino) is listed in the .pdf as parts of a private collection near Frankfurt, according to other informations sold to Kevin Wheatcroft...


Of course, I got them mixed up. Nevertheless, both the Moscow Oblast and Estonian Tiger parts are late running gear and I'm still guessing that the more or less complete looking Tiger is assembled from the Moscow parts. It also looks like the turret is new manufacture.

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