±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: cgsimpson
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6645

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 228
Total: 228
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Home
02: Downloads
03: Community Forums
04: News
05: Community Forums
06: Community Forums
07: Home
08: Downloads
09: Home
10: CPGlang
11: Downloads
12: Community Forums
13: Home
14: Community Forums
15: Home
16: Photo Gallery
17: Home
18: Home
19: Home
20: Community Forums
21: Home
22: Home
23: Home
24: Community Forums
25: Home
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Photo Gallery
29: Photo Gallery
30: News
31: Community Forums
32: Community Forums
33: Downloads
34: Photo Gallery
35: Community Forums
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Downloads
39: Community Forums
40: Home
41: Community Forums
42: Community Forums
43: News Archive
44: CPGlang
45: Home
46: Member Screenshots
47: Downloads
48: CPGlang
49: Photo Gallery
50: Community Forums
51: Community Forums
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Downloads
55: CPGlang
56: Community Forums
57: CPGlang
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Community Forums
61: Community Forums
62: Community Forums
63: Home
64: Home
65: CPGlang
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Community Forums
69: Community Forums
70: Home
71: CPGlang
72: Community Forums
73: Community Forums
74: Community Forums
75: Downloads
76: Downloads
77: Community Forums
78: CPGlang
79: Community Forums
80: Community Forums
81: Downloads
82: Community Forums
83: Home
84: Downloads
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: CPGlang
88: CPGlang
89: News Archive
90: Home
91: Community Forums
92: Community Forums
93: Community Forums
94: Photo Gallery
95: Community Forums
96: Home
97: Photo Gallery
98: Home
99: Community Forums
100: Community Forums
101: News Archive
102: Home
103: Member Screenshots
104: Community Forums
105: Home
106: Community Forums
107: Community Forums
108: Home
109: CPGlang
110: News Archive
111: Home
112: Photo Gallery
113: Home
114: Community Forums
115: Community Forums
116: Home
117: CPGlang
118: Community Forums
119: Downloads
120: Home
121: Community Forums
122: Home
123: Community Forums
124: Home
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Member Screenshots
130: Member Screenshots
131: Downloads
132: Photo Gallery
133: Downloads
134: CPGlang
135: Photo Gallery
136: Community Forums
137: Community Forums
138: Downloads
139: Home
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Home
143: Community Forums
144: Home
145: Home
146: CPGlang
147: Community Forums
148: Home
149: Community Forums
150: Member Screenshots
151: Home
152: Downloads
153: Community Forums
154: Community Forums
155: Home
156: Member Screenshots
157: CPGlang
158: Community Forums
159: Community Forums
160: Community Forums
161: Community Forums
162: Community Forums
163: Community Forums
164: Community Forums
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Member Screenshots
169: Community Forums
170: Community Forums
171: Community Forums
172: Home
173: Downloads
174: CPGlang
175: Member Screenshots
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: Community Forums
181: Community Forums
182: CPGlang
183: Member Screenshots
184: Member Screenshots
185: News
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Photo Gallery
190: Community Forums
191: Home
192: Community Forums
193: Home
194: Community Forums
195: Member Screenshots
196: Home
197: CPGlang
198: Home
199: Home
200: Community Forums
201: Photo Gallery
202: Home
203: Community Forums
204: Home
205: Community Forums
206: Downloads
207: Community Forums
208: Member Screenshots
209: Member Screenshots
210: Community Forums
211: Member Screenshots
212: Community Forums
213: Home
214: Community Forums
215: Community Forums
216: Photo Gallery
217: Home
218: Home
219: CPGlang
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Home
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Community Forums
226: Community Forums
227: CPGlang
228: Photo Gallery

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
California Panther Restoration
The AFV ASSOCIATION was formed in 1964 to support the thoughts and research of all those interested in Armored Fighting Vehicles and related topics, such as AFV drawings. The emphasis has always been on sharing information and communicating with other members of similar interests; e.g. German armor, Japanese AFVs, or whatever.
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board

View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
elauterbach
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 7:30 pm
Post subject: California Panther Restoration

Does anyone have any information on the Panther that is being restored in California? In all the pictures that I have seen, it looks like it is progressing very nicely.
Eric
Back to top
View user's profile
toadmanstankpictures
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2006 10:40 pm
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

I'm up there about once a month visiting. Click this link to my website to see a series of photo updates starting with March of 2004: Littlefield Panther restoration

I'll have a new update next week as I plan on visiting again next Saturday.

_________________
Chris "toadman" Hughes
www.toadmanstankpictures.com
www.cafepress.com/toad...ksandstuff
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
zundappuk
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 65
Location: Behind the Westwall, really!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:37 am
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

- toadmanstankpictures
I'm up there about once a month visiting. Click this link to my website to see a series of photo updates starting with March of 2004: Littlefield Panther restoration

I'll have a new update next week as I plan on visiting again next Saturday.


Yup, Jacques is coming on nicely.

This is Kevin Wheatcrofts in the UK, I visit Kevin every couple of months or so.
He has three Panthers. This is his early Ausf A. This should roll under its on power in 2007.

DAvid

Back to top
View user's profile
Maple_Leaf_Eh
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 517

PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2006 8:39 pm
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

After seeing the 'as found' condition of many of these parts, I am utterly amazed at the workmanship of their restoration. Yes, the number of new build parts is not always clear, but man are these guys good! Please express our collective amazement and appreciation.
Back to top
View user's profile
Rikard_Hufschmied
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 9:50 pm
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

David,

Those tracks are the ones Kevin had cast new aren't they? Do you know if Littlefield had a part in the track batch? I know that the "Panther Collectors" try to team up for manufacture of replacement parts to keep costs down.

I could have sworn that that Panther was a late Ausf. D though ...



Cheers,
Rik
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
zundappuk
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 65
Location: Behind the Westwall, really!
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2006 9:51 am
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

Rik,


I am no Panther expert (Zundapp KS750 and Steyr 1500 I am) So I had assumed that the later cupola indicated one of the main differences between D and A Ausfs ? The three main private Panther restorers have co-operated on certain parts. The main one was in producing new torsion bars. Originally the WTS in Koblenz had some made for their JagPanther, so Mike Gibb, Jacques Littlefield and Kevin Wheatcroft jumped on board too. Kevin showed my some time back the new made track links (now black cad plated) also new made drive sprockets and new made rubber tyres (tires for the US readers).

David





- Rikard_Hufschmied
David,

Those tracks are the ones Kevin had cast new aren't they? Do you know if Littlefield had a part in the track batch? I know that the "Panther Collectors" try to team up for manufacture of replacement parts to keep costs down.

I could have sworn that that Panther was a late Ausf. D though ...



Cheers,
Rik
Back to top
View user's profile
Rikard_Hufschmied
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 7:41 am
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

David,

Could you please ask Kevin what make it really is, because I see some indications that it's not an A but indeed a D (altough late). The main D factor is the slot/flap MG mount in the front glacis, this was replaced by the ball mount on the Ausf.A.

However, there was a substantial production overlap in the shift from D to A and there are some indications that it's an early A, the main factor here being the doubled amount of reinforcing rim-bolts on the roadwheels.

The turret with the new style commanders cupola and pistol ports could go either way, it was fitted both to late D:s and early A:s. On the mid and late A:s the pistol ports were deleted once and for all.

So what do we have here, a late D, an early A or a D/A hybrid?

Mr.Wheatcrofts Panther as it was first presented on the web:



An Early production Ausf.A:




It's a fantastic restoration nevertheless and it will be amazing to see it move under its own power!

Cheers,
Rik
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Jens_O_Mehner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 511
Location: Giessen, Germany
PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:44 am
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

Rikard,

throw away your old references, as a matter of fact the cupola is the main indicator if it's an A or a D- no As were built with the drum cupola, as indicated by the latest research by Tom Jentz, there was no physical way to mate the drum cupola to the A turret, since the mounting points were of a totally different design.

The glacis MG mount is no indicator, as you've already noted, early As were built with the flap.

Cheers,

Jens O.
Back to top
View user's profile
Rikard_Hufschmied
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 5:20 pm
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

- Jens_O_Mehner
Rikard,

throw away your old references, as a matter of fact the cupola is the main indicator if it's an A or a D- no As were built with the drum cupola, as indicated by the latest research by Tom Jentz, there was no physical way to mate the drum cupola to the A turret, since the mounting points were of a totally different design.

The glacis MG mount is no indicator, as you've already noted, early As were built with the flap.

Cheers,

Jens O.


Ok, point taken but as there is a hybrid Panther D/A still in existence (Thun) I thought the question merited some consideration. I know there were no A:s built with the drum cupola. And it still doesn't explain why there were D:s built with same turret as on the early A:s (with the periscope commanders cupola) or are my references totally shot on that point as well? I'd love to see if there is an episcope for the loaders position on the Wheatcroft turret cause that would settle it, it would be an A.

I'm the first to admit though that I'm no expert on the Panther ... yet. So any help and insight in correcting or discarding sources are most welcome.

Cheers,
Rik
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Dontos
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 3436
Location: Vine Grove, KY
PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 5:40 pm
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

A question which comes to mind about the variant confusion...

Would a 'field maint point' have pieced together the ausf A & ausf D based on getting combat power back in the fight?

From the perspective of a 'tanker', with very basic understanding of the Panther, I would think that an inventive (& resourceful) maintenance crew would canibalize whatever they had on hand.

My perception of German maintenance personnel is that they kept the force going by recovering & recycling a massive amount of combat power.

Would there be merit in this idea?

Can the 'ausf A' hull or turret be matched with the 'ausf D' hull or turret?

_________________
"Gonna hold my breath until Armor returns home..."
Back to top
View user's profile Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger Photo Gallery
Dubliner
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 94

PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:35 am
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

nt


Last edited by Dubliner on Sat Mar 24, 2007 2:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile
Rikard_Hufschmied
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 24, 2006
Posts: 458
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:11 am
Post subject: Re: California Panther Restoration

- Dubliner
Jentz's Panzer Tracts No. 5-2 - Panzerkampfwagen "Panther"Ausf.A clears up the Ausf D / Ausf A differences once and for all. You can not tell them apart just based on the drum cupola. A few As had drum cupola.


I'm a tad embarrassed to say I haven't sampled it yet, it's on my list on "have to get" though.

I've always had the D/A discrepancies down to the rushed nature of the Panthers development and production; with recalls, combat repairs and quick production line shifts producing more or less hybrid veichles.

Thank's for the help!

Cheers,
Rik
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Reply to topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  AFV News Discussion Board
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours



Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum