±Recent Visitors

Recent Visitors to Com-Central!

±User Info-big


Welcome Anonymous

Nickname
Password

Membership:
Latest: HighestAce
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 6648

People Online:
Members: 0
Visitors: 969
Total: 969
Who Is Where:
 Visitors:
01: Community Forums
02: Member Screenshots
03: Photo Gallery
04: Home
05: Community Forums
06: Home
07: Community Forums
08: Community Forums
09: Home
10: Photo Gallery
11: Photo Gallery
12: Member Screenshots
13: Community Forums
14: Community Forums
15: Home
16: Community Forums
17: Home
18: Photo Gallery
19: Home
20: Community Forums
21: Community Forums
22: Community Forums
23: Community Forums
24: Community Forums
25: Home
26: Community Forums
27: Community Forums
28: Member Screenshots
29: Community Forums
30: Community Forums
31: Photo Gallery
32: Community Forums
33: Photo Gallery
34: Photo Gallery
35: Photo Gallery
36: Community Forums
37: Community Forums
38: Community Forums
39: Community Forums
40: Downloads
41: News
42: Home
43: Photo Gallery
44: Community Forums
45: Community Forums
46: Photo Gallery
47: Photo Gallery
48: Member Screenshots
49: Community Forums
50: Downloads
51: Photo Gallery
52: Community Forums
53: Community Forums
54: Photo Gallery
55: Photo Gallery
56: Home
57: Statistics
58: Community Forums
59: Community Forums
60: Home
61: Photo Gallery
62: Community Forums
63: Community Forums
64: Member Screenshots
65: Member Screenshots
66: Community Forums
67: Community Forums
68: Photo Gallery
69: Home
70: Community Forums
71: Home
72: Community Forums
73: Home
74: Community Forums
75: Community Forums
76: Home
77: Home
78: Community Forums
79: Community Forums
80: Home
81: Home
82: Search
83: Community Forums
84: Community Forums
85: Community Forums
86: Community Forums
87: Photo Gallery
88: Community Forums
89: Community Forums
90: Community Forums
91: Home
92: Community Forums
93: Home
94: Downloads
95: Community Forums
96: Community Forums
97: News
98: Statistics
99: Photo Gallery
100: Community Forums
101: Downloads
102: Community Forums
103: Statistics
104: Community Forums
105: Home
106: Community Forums
107: Home
108: Photo Gallery
109: Community Forums
110: Photo Gallery
111: Community Forums
112: Home
113: Community Forums
114: Home
115: Community Forums
116: Community Forums
117: Community Forums
118: Community Forums
119: Photo Gallery
120: Community Forums
121: Community Forums
122: Community Forums
123: Photo Gallery
124: Home
125: Community Forums
126: Community Forums
127: Community Forums
128: Community Forums
129: Community Forums
130: Community Forums
131: Community Forums
132: Community Forums
133: Community Forums
134: Community Forums
135: Community Forums
136: Home
137: Community Forums
138: Community Forums
139: Community Forums
140: Community Forums
141: Community Forums
142: Community Forums
143: Photo Gallery
144: Community Forums
145: Community Forums
146: Photo Gallery
147: Photo Gallery
148: Community Forums
149: Home
150: Photo Gallery
151: Home
152: Downloads
153: Community Forums
154: Member Screenshots
155: Community Forums
156: Community Forums
157: Photo Gallery
158: Community Forums
159: Member Screenshots
160: Member Screenshots
161: Community Forums
162: Statistics
163: Member Screenshots
164: Home
165: Community Forums
166: Community Forums
167: Community Forums
168: Member Screenshots
169: Community Forums
170: Member Screenshots
171: Downloads
172: Community Forums
173: Photo Gallery
174: Home
175: Member Screenshots
176: Community Forums
177: Community Forums
178: Community Forums
179: Community Forums
180: News Archive
181: Member Screenshots
182: Community Forums
183: Photo Gallery
184: Community Forums
185: Community Forums
186: Community Forums
187: Community Forums
188: Community Forums
189: Community Forums
190: Home
191: Photo Gallery
192: Photo Gallery
193: Home
194: Community Forums
195: Home
196: Photo Gallery
197: Community Forums
198: Home
199: Downloads
200: Community Forums
201: Community Forums
202: Photo Gallery
203: Community Forums
204: Statistics
205: Home
206: Photo Gallery
207: Community Forums
208: Community Forums
209: Community Forums
210: Community Forums
211: Community Forums
212: Member Screenshots
213: Community Forums
214: Community Forums
215: Photo Gallery
216: Community Forums
217: Community Forums
218: Community Forums
219: Community Forums
220: Community Forums
221: Community Forums
222: Community Forums
223: Community Forums
224: Photo Gallery
225: Home
226: Community Forums
227: Community Forums
228: Community Forums
229: Community Forums
230: Community Forums
231: Photo Gallery
232: Community Forums
233: Community Forums
234: Photo Gallery
235: Photo Gallery
236: Community Forums
237: Community Forums
238: Member Screenshots
239: Photo Gallery
240: Home
241: Community Forums
242: Community Forums
243: Photo Gallery
244: Community Forums
245: Community Forums
246: Community Forums
247: Community Forums
248: Community Forums
249: Community Forums
250: Photo Gallery
251: Community Forums
252: Community Forums
253: Member Screenshots
254: Community Forums
255: Community Forums
256: Community Forums
257: Photo Gallery
258: Community Forums
259: News Archive
260: Community Forums
261: Community Forums
262: Community Forums
263: Home
264: Community Forums
265: Community Forums
266: Member Screenshots
267: Community Forums
268: Photo Gallery
269: Community Forums
270: Photo Gallery
271: Photo Gallery
272: Community Forums
273: Community Forums
274: Home
275: Photo Gallery
276: Community Forums
277: Community Forums
278: Community Forums
279: Home
280: Community Forums
281: Community Forums
282: News Archive
283: Member Screenshots
284: Community Forums
285: Community Forums
286: Community Forums
287: Community Forums
288: Member Screenshots
289: Home
290: Photo Gallery
291: Community Forums
292: Community Forums
293: Community Forums
294: Community Forums
295: Community Forums
296: Photo Gallery
297: Home
298: Photo Gallery
299: Statistics
300: Community Forums
301: Photo Gallery
302: Statistics
303: Community Forums
304: Home
305: Member Screenshots
306: Community Forums
307: Community Forums
308: Community Forums
309: Community Forums
310: Community Forums
311: Community Forums
312: Community Forums
313: Community Forums
314: Home
315: Community Forums
316: Community Forums
317: Community Forums
318: Community Forums
319: Community Forums
320: Community Forums
321: Home
322: Member Screenshots
323: Member Screenshots
324: Community Forums
325: Community Forums
326: Community Forums
327: Community Forums
328: Community Forums
329: Community Forums
330: Community Forums
331: Community Forums
332: Community Forums
333: Community Forums
334: Community Forums
335: Home
336: Community Forums
337: Downloads
338: Community Forums
339: Community Forums
340: Downloads
341: Home
342: Photo Gallery
343: Member Screenshots
344: Community Forums
345: Community Forums
346: Home
347: Downloads
348: Community Forums
349: Community Forums
350: Photo Gallery
351: Community Forums
352: Home
353: Community Forums
354: Member Screenshots
355: Community Forums
356: News Archive
357: Statistics
358: Photo Gallery
359: Community Forums
360: Community Forums
361: Community Forums
362: Community Forums
363: Community Forums
364: Community Forums
365: Community Forums
366: Community Forums
367: Photo Gallery
368: Community Forums
369: Community Forums
370: Community Forums
371: Home
372: Community Forums
373: Community Forums
374: Downloads
375: Community Forums
376: Downloads
377: Community Forums
378: Community Forums
379: Community Forums
380: Community Forums
381: Community Forums
382: Community Forums
383: Community Forums
384: Photo Gallery
385: Member Screenshots
386: Community Forums
387: Community Forums
388: Downloads
389: Downloads
390: Community Forums
391: Home
392: Photo Gallery
393: Community Forums
394: Community Forums
395: Community Forums
396: Community Forums
397: Home
398: Community Forums
399: Home
400: Home
401: Community Forums
402: Community Forums
403: News Archive
404: Home
405: Home
406: Photo Gallery
407: Community Forums
408: Community Forums
409: Community Forums
410: Community Forums
411: Community Forums
412: Community Forums
413: Member Screenshots
414: Photo Gallery
415: Photo Gallery
416: Home
417: Community Forums
418: Home
419: Home
420: Photo Gallery
421: Member Screenshots
422: Downloads
423: Home
424: Home
425: Community Forums
426: Community Forums
427: Photo Gallery
428: Community Forums
429: Photo Gallery
430: Community Forums
431: Community Forums
432: Member Screenshots
433: Community Forums
434: Downloads
435: Photo Gallery
436: Community Forums
437: Photo Gallery
438: Member Screenshots
439: Community Forums
440: Member Screenshots
441: Community Forums
442: Community Forums
443: Member Screenshots
444: Community Forums
445: Community Forums
446: Community Forums
447: Member Screenshots
448: Community Forums
449: Member Screenshots
450: Community Forums
451: Member Screenshots
452: Home
453: Community Forums
454: Community Forums
455: Community Forums
456: Community Forums
457: Community Forums
458: Community Forums
459: Member Screenshots
460: Member Screenshots
461: Photo Gallery
462: Community Forums
463: Community Forums
464: Member Screenshots
465: Home
466: Community Forums
467: Community Forums
468: Member Screenshots
469: Member Screenshots
470: Photo Gallery
471: Photo Gallery
472: Photo Gallery
473: Community Forums
474: Photo Gallery
475: Home
476: Photo Gallery
477: Community Forums
478: Photo Gallery
479: Community Forums
480: Community Forums
481: Community Forums
482: Home
483: Community Forums
484: Community Forums
485: Community Forums
486: Home
487: Community Forums
488: Community Forums
489: Home
490: Community Forums
491: Member Screenshots
492: Community Forums
493: Photo Gallery
494: News Archive
495: Community Forums
496: Community Forums
497: Community Forums
498: Community Forums
499: Photo Gallery
500: Community Forums
501: Community Forums
502: Photo Gallery
503: Community Forums
504: Member Screenshots
505: Home
506: Community Forums
507: Community Forums
508: Home
509: Home
510: Community Forums
511: Community Forums
512: News Archive
513: Community Forums
514: Community Forums
515: Community Forums
516: Community Forums
517: Community Forums
518: Community Forums
519: Community Forums
520: Community Forums
521: Community Forums
522: Photo Gallery
523: Community Forums
524: Photo Gallery
525: Community Forums
526: Community Forums
527: Member Screenshots
528: Member Screenshots
529: Member Screenshots
530: Member Screenshots
531: Community Forums
532: Photo Gallery
533: Community Forums
534: Downloads
535: Community Forums
536: Photo Gallery
537: Community Forums
538: News Archive
539: Home
540: Statistics
541: Community Forums
542: Downloads
543: Home
544: Community Forums
545: Member Screenshots
546: Community Forums
547: Community Forums
548: Community Forums
549: Home
550: Community Forums
551: Community Forums
552: Community Forums
553: Community Forums
554: Community Forums
555: Community Forums
556: Community Forums
557: Community Forums
558: Photo Gallery
559: Downloads
560: Community Forums
561: Community Forums
562: Community Forums
563: Community Forums
564: Home
565: Community Forums
566: Community Forums
567: Home
568: Community Forums
569: Community Forums
570: Member Screenshots
571: Home
572: Home
573: Photo Gallery
574: Home
575: Community Forums
576: Photo Gallery
577: Community Forums
578: Home
579: Community Forums
580: Community Forums
581: Community Forums
582: Home
583: Downloads
584: Community Forums
585: Home
586: Community Forums
587: Home
588: Community Forums
589: Community Forums
590: Home
591: Community Forums
592: Community Forums
593: Community Forums
594: Community Forums
595: Community Forums
596: Community Forums
597: Community Forums
598: Community Forums
599: Community Forums
600: Home
601: Photo Gallery
602: Community Forums
603: Community Forums
604: Community Forums
605: Home
606: Community Forums
607: Community Forums
608: Community Forums
609: Community Forums
610: Community Forums
611: Photo Gallery
612: Community Forums
613: Community Forums
614: Community Forums
615: Community Forums
616: Community Forums
617: Community Forums
618: Home
619: Community Forums
620: Community Forums
621: Community Forums
622: Community Forums
623: Community Forums
624: Community Forums
625: Home
626: Home
627: Photo Gallery
628: Community Forums
629: News Archive
630: Downloads
631: Downloads
632: Community Forums
633: Home
634: Photo Gallery
635: Community Forums
636: Home
637: Community Forums
638: Home
639: Community Forums
640: Community Forums
641: Community Forums
642: News
643: Community Forums
644: Home
645: News Archive
646: Community Forums
647: Community Forums
648: Community Forums
649: Community Forums
650: Member Screenshots
651: Community Forums
652: Community Forums
653: Photo Gallery
654: Community Forums
655: Community Forums
656: Photo Gallery
657: Community Forums
658: Home
659: Downloads
660: Community Forums
661: Community Forums
662: Community Forums
663: Community Forums
664: Community Forums
665: Community Forums
666: Community Forums
667: Community Forums
668: Community Forums
669: Community Forums
670: Member Screenshots
671: Photo Gallery
672: Community Forums
673: Home
674: Community Forums
675: Community Forums
676: Community Forums
677: Community Forums
678: Home
679: Community Forums
680: Community Forums
681: Photo Gallery
682: Community Forums
683: Community Forums
684: Community Forums
685: Community Forums
686: Home
687: Community Forums
688: Community Forums
689: Community Forums
690: Community Forums
691: Community Forums
692: Community Forums
693: Community Forums
694: Home
695: Community Forums
696: Community Forums
697: Community Forums
698: Community Forums
699: Community Forums
700: Community Forums
701: Photo Gallery
702: Downloads
703: Photo Gallery
704: Community Forums
705: Community Forums
706: Community Forums
707: Community Forums
708: Community Forums
709: Community Forums
710: Community Forums
711: Community Forums
712: Photo Gallery
713: Community Forums
714: Community Forums
715: Downloads
716: Photo Gallery
717: Community Forums
718: Photo Gallery
719: Community Forums
720: Photo Gallery
721: Community Forums
722: Community Forums
723: Community Forums
724: Home
725: Photo Gallery
726: Photo Gallery
727: Community Forums
728: Community Forums
729: Community Forums
730: Community Forums
731: Community Forums
732: Member Screenshots
733: Community Forums
734: Community Forums
735: Community Forums
736: Community Forums
737: Photo Gallery
738: Statistics
739: Community Forums
740: Community Forums
741: Community Forums
742: Community Forums
743: Photo Gallery
744: Community Forums
745: Photo Gallery
746: Photo Gallery
747: Photo Gallery
748: Photo Gallery
749: Community Forums
750: Community Forums
751: Statistics
752: Community Forums
753: Member Screenshots
754: News
755: Photo Gallery
756: Member Screenshots
757: Community Forums
758: Community Forums
759: Community Forums
760: Community Forums
761: Community Forums
762: Community Forums
763: Photo Gallery
764: Photo Gallery
765: Photo Gallery
766: Photo Gallery
767: Community Forums
768: Downloads
769: Member Screenshots
770: Downloads
771: Statistics
772: Community Forums
773: Community Forums
774: Community Forums
775: Home
776: Home
777: Community Forums
778: Community Forums
779: Community Forums
780: Community Forums
781: Community Forums
782: Community Forums
783: Community Forums
784: Community Forums
785: Community Forums
786: Community Forums
787: Community Forums
788: Community Forums
789: Community Forums
790: Community Forums
791: Community Forums
792: Community Forums
793: Community Forums
794: Community Forums
795: Home
796: Community Forums
797: Home
798: Community Forums
799: Community Forums
800: Photo Gallery
801: Home
802: Community Forums
803: Community Forums
804: Photo Gallery
805: Downloads
806: Downloads
807: Community Forums
808: Photo Gallery
809: Community Forums
810: Member Screenshots
811: Home
812: Home
813: Community Forums
814: Community Forums
815: Community Forums
816: Home
817: Home
818: Community Forums
819: Member Screenshots
820: Photo Gallery
821: Home
822: Member Screenshots
823: Your Account
824: Downloads
825: Community Forums
826: Community Forums
827: Community Forums
828: Community Forums
829: Community Forums
830: Community Forums
831: Home
832: Community Forums
833: Community Forums
834: Community Forums
835: Community Forums
836: LinkToUs
837: Photo Gallery
838: Community Forums
839: Photo Gallery
840: Community Forums
841: Community Forums
842: Community Forums
843: Home
844: Community Forums
845: Home
846: Community Forums
847: Home
848: Community Forums
849: Photo Gallery
850: Community Forums
851: Photo Gallery
852: Photo Gallery
853: Community Forums
854: Photo Gallery
855: Photo Gallery
856: Community Forums
857: Community Forums
858: Photo Gallery
859: Community Forums
860: Community Forums
861: Photo Gallery
862: Community Forums
863: Home
864: News
865: Community Forums
866: Community Forums
867: Photo Gallery
868: Community Forums
869: Home
870: Downloads
871: Home
872: Community Forums
873: Community Forums
874: Community Forums
875: Community Forums
876: Community Forums
877: Photo Gallery
878: Home
879: Photo Gallery
880: Community Forums
881: Community Forums
882: Home
883: Community Forums
884: Home
885: Community Forums
886: Community Forums
887: Community Forums
888: Photo Gallery
889: Home
890: Home
891: Photo Gallery
892: Downloads
893: Community Forums
894: Home
895: Community Forums
896: Home
897: Community Forums
898: Statistics
899: Community Forums
900: Photo Gallery
901: Downloads
902: Statistics
903: Photo Gallery
904: Home
905: Home
906: Community Forums
907: Home
908: Home
909: Community Forums
910: Community Forums
911: Community Forums
912: Community Forums
913: Community Forums
914: Home
915: Photo Gallery
916: Community Forums
917: News
918: Community Forums
919: Home
920: Community Forums
921: Community Forums
922: Community Forums
923: Photo Gallery
924: Community Forums
925: Community Forums
926: Home
927: Home
928: Community Forums
929: Community Forums
930: Community Forums
931: Community Forums
932: Photo Gallery
933: Community Forums
934: Photo Gallery
935: Community Forums
936: Community Forums
937: Home
938: Member Screenshots
939: Community Forums
940: Home
941: Community Forums
942: Community Forums
943: Downloads
944: Community Forums
945: Member Screenshots
946: Member Screenshots
947: Your Account
948: News
949: Home
950: Home
951: Your Account
952: Community Forums
953: Community Forums
954: Community Forums
955: Member Screenshots
956: Community Forums
957: Community Forums
958: Downloads
959: Community Forums
960: Photo Gallery
961: Home
962: Home
963: Community Forums
964: Community Forums
965: Home
966: Photo Gallery
967: Community Forums
968: Community Forums
969: Community Forums

Staff Online:

No staff members are online!
Boeing - Airbus wars..... :: Archived
A general meeting place for all pilots!
Post new topic    Revive this topic    Printer Friendly Page     Forum Index ›  Officer's Club

Topic Archived View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 4:15 pm
Post subject: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

Flying High
How Boeing cut short Airbus's rule as king of the skies.
by James Thayer

12/15/2005 12:00:00 AM
EUROPE WAS CROWING, and it could be heard all the way across the ocean.

Airbus called Boeing's new 787 Dreamliner "dreaming in Seattle," and Airbus's then-CEO Noel Forgard dismissed the 787 as a "Chinese copy of [Airbus's] A330." The BBC said Airbus had stolen the march on its arc-rival Boeing, and the Economist predicted Airbus's A380 super-jumbo would "break the 747's longstanding monopoly on the big-jet market." Airbus's sales chief John J. Leahy said Boeing was ''just flailing around looking for something to compete with us.''

Indeed, 12 months ago Airbus seemed about to permanently replace the Boeing Company as the world's dominant airplane producer. It never happened. Instead, Airbus's ambitions have suddenly skidded off the runway.

Earlier this week Australia's flagship carrier Qantas ordered 45 787 Dreamliners worth $8 billion at list prices, and announced it would eventually take delivery of 100 Boeing airplanes, bringing the total order to $13 billion. Earlier in the month Hong Kong's Cathay Pacific Airlines also placed a big order: a dozen 777-300ERs with options for an additional 20 more planes, for a total list-price of $9 billion. The Qantas and Cathay Pacific contracts are bitter blows to Airbus and signaled Boeing's return as the industry king. The inevitability of European aircraft supremacy--so obvious a year ago--suddenly seems a laugher. What happened?

Boeing and Airbus have two competing and vastly different visions of the future of air travel. At least for now, it appears Boeing got it right.
TWO COMPANIES--Airbus and Boeing--manufacture the vast majority of the wide-body passenger airplanes in service around the world. Eighty percent of Airbus is owned by the European Aeronautic Defence and Space Company, formed by a 2000 merger of the German, French, and Spanish aircraft industries. Twenty percent is owned by the British company, BAE Systems PLC. Most Airbus fabrication occurs in Toulouse, Hamburg, Barcelona, and Broughton, in Wales.

Boeing's corporate headquarters are in Chicago, but its main commercial airplane plants are in the Seattle area. Both Airbus and Boeing believe that air-passenger traffic will triple in the next two decades. Half a world apart, the two manufacturers have been desperately dueling to gain a majority of orders for the 40,000 new planes they anticipate the industry will need in that time.

Airbus believes that the hub-and-spoke system will govern air travel in the coming decades, where larger airplanes fly between major cities--the hubs--and then the passengers are shunted to their final destinations on smaller planes. In their vision, travelers going from New York City to Little Rock would first fly the Chicago or Atlanta hubs on a jumbo jet, then on to Arkansas in a smaller plane.

To meet this perceived need, Airbus has developed the A380, which will enter service in a year. With a wingspan of 266 feet, the plane is routinely described in the European press as being as wide as a football pitch. The A380 is 240 feet long, and the top of its tail is 80 feet off the concrete.
How can airports handle such a behemoth, one that when fully loaded weighs 177 tons more than a loaded Boeing 747-400, and has a 50-foot wider wingspan, and will carry as many as 853 passengers, almost twice as many as the Boeing plane?

They can't. No airport older than brand new is wide enough, high enough, or thick enough to handle the A380.

So port authorities are scrambling to get ready. London's Heathrow will spend $821 million to accommodate the plane, and will widen taxiways, build double-decker loading ramps, construct new corridors that will segregate the hordes of arriving and departing passengers, and install longer luggage carousels in an enlarged baggage claim area. Heathrow's director of planning and development, Eryl Smith, says the A380 "will change the face" of the airport.

Los Angeles International will erect a new terminal for the A380. Singapore's Changi airport has widened runway shoulders and taxiway junctions, and lounges and passenger concourses have been increased in size. Some cities--Hong Kong, Seoul, and Bangkok--have built new airports that will handle the A380.

Airbus spent $12 billion developing the A380 super-jumbo, and those triumphant predictions made last year about Airbus's new dominance should have come true. And they would have, too, except for one small irritant: the Boeing Company.

BOEING does not buy into the idea of hub-and-spoke dominance. Rather than 1,500 A380 sales in the next 20 years, as Airbus predicts, Boeing strategists expect the number to be closer 320. The reason: Boeing believes travelers and airlines will demand "point-to-point travel"--direct flights between smaller cities and smaller airports. Business people in a hurry, they reason, will not want to stop in the middle of their journey to change planes.

So Boeing's emphasis has been on smaller aircraft with longer range. The 787 Dreamliner is Boeing's plane of the future, "a radically different airplane," asserts Mike Bair, senior vice president of Boeing's Dreamliner development program.

The 787's new technologies are breathtaking. For example, the plane's fuselage will be made entirely of composites, making the plane lighter than older planes, saving weight and therefore fuel. Composites are also stronger than the traditional aluminum used in plane fuselages, and are more resistant to corrosion, and so the Dreamliner will have greater cabin pressure and humidity levels that will reduce passenger dehydration so that travelers will be more comfortable.

The Dreamliner will also use the bleedless new-generation Rolls Royce engine. In the traditional bleed-air engine, air is diverted to power fuel, pressurization, and oil pumps, hydraulic lines, and other systems. In the 787's bleedless engine, all the air flowing through the engine will be used for propulsion, while electric power for the pumps and hydraulic lines will be produced by a generator linked to the engine. The result will be greater fuel efficiency. The 787 will offer 20 percent to 30 percent greater fuel efficiencies over other aircraft.

THE 787 DREAMLINER is the first all-new Boeing plane in 14 years, but the company has been continually upgrading its product line. It offers the 300-seat wide-body 777-200LR, which last November set a record for the longest non-stop flight by a passenger plane, flying 13,422 miles from Hong Kong to London in 22 hours and 42 minutes. Fuel prices are high, and the 777 is a twin-jet, making it much more efficient than the plane it principally competes against, the four-engine Airbus A340.

The 787 and 777 will be able to do things an A380 cannot: fly along the spokes, between, say, Chicago and Little Rock, and among the spoke ends, from, say, Little Rock to Omaha. The Boeing planes can land at every airport the A380 will be able to, but the reverse is not true. The Boeing products can adapt to both the hub-and-spoke and the point-to-point systems.

And the new model of Boeing's venerable long-hauler, the 747-8, was launched last month, called 8 because it shares much technology with the Dreamliner. The 747-8 is 12-feet longer, and quieter and more economical than its predecessor.

Airbus counters these Boeing products with the promise of the A380 super-jumbo, and the A340-500, a derivative of a plane first introduced in 1988, which analyst Richard Aboulafia of the Teal Group calls a "legacy dinosaur." Airbus is also developing its answer to the 787 Dreamliner, the A350, which won't enter service until two years after the 787.

TWO YEARS AGO Airbus overtook Boeing as the world's best-selling commercial aircraft maker. But technical problems (read: weight problems) with the super-jumbo A380 and delays in its delivery "have infuriated airlines," the Australian reports. Weight problems are poison to airlines since overweight planes result in reduced passenger and freight payloads and shorter route lengths. The A380 is selling slowly.
Even before the new Qantas and Cathay Pacific orders, Boeing had won 109 firm new orders for 777s this year, compared with only 14 orders for the A340. Two weeks ago, Emirates, the huge Middle East airline, spurned Airbus, ordering 42 777s with a list price of almost $10 billion, a sale that observers termed "stunning."

Air Canada has decided to replace its entire A330 and A340 fleet with 96 777s and 787s, which the London Observer called "a savage blow" to Airbus. Air India and Northwest Airlines have also recently turned aside Airbus, preferring the Boeing product.

As of November 30, Boeing had logged almost four times more firm orders for its 787 Dreamliner than has Airbus for its A350. That's 185 planes to 49 planes. This week Qantas chairman Margaret Jackson said the 787 was "a very clear commercial winner for Boeing." Boeing this year will likely beat its previous sales record of 878 planes, set in 1998. A Seattle Times front-page headline read, "Boeing increases lead over Airbus."


Airbus's sales leadership lasted only two years.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-Dan736
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 26, 2005
Posts: 484
Location: Burlinton Ont
PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 8:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

Good read Ascout thanks for posting.I have to agree with Boeings take on things that people won't want to change planes to get to the smaller cities,more flexibility means better customer service,time for airbus to fire it's ceo for leading them down the wrong path.

_________________

eagles may soar but a weasel won't get sucked into a jet engine
Back to top
View user's profile
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2005 8:47 pm
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

I'm unhappy with Airbus for introducing this behemoth because I actually use those international airports that will attempt to accomodate it. In fact, I expect to be making some different selections in my travel plans to avoid it (like landing at Gatwick, instead of Heathrow...a change worth making anyway given the prehistoric and inefficient nature of Heathrow). Probably unavoidable at Frankfort, but given the efficiency with which that airport functions, they can probably adapt better than most.
I won't be unhappy if the marketing of this aircraft fails.

This will likely complicate some connections, but will beat the crud out of landing behind 800 tourists clearing passport control and baggage claim.

I don't dislike the other Airbus planes, and use them a lot in Europe. I think their model of airline operations goes against reality on the continent and in the U.S., though.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Shades
Forum Tree-Rat

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 6475
Location: 3rd Branch up, 'Ye Olde Oak', Green Wood.
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:16 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

Gatwick are probably further ahead with their preparations for it than Heathrow at the moment. They want it to land there.

Any major hub is in the running for it and you'll probably still find airlines running both as both are designed for entirely different roles which (when u think about it) compliment one another perfectly.

_________________
Skwerl's place.

Com-Central's cutest, fluffiest, twitchiest, tail.
CPU > Intel i9-9900k (o/c 4.9GHz); COOLING > BeQuiet! Dark Rock Pro 4;
MOBO > ASUS PRIME Z390-A; RAM > 2x32GB Corsair LPX 2666MHz;
GPU > Gigabyte GEFORCE GTX650Ti PCI-e 3.0 2Gb GDDR5;
AUDIO > Creative X-Fi Xtreme Music (plus - Universal Audio UAD2 Quad Custom accelerator);
HDD > 3x1TB+ M.2. SSDs; LCD > DELL - S2419HGF (1920x1080);
PSU > 650W be quiet Straight Power 11 - 80+ Gold;
CASE > BeQuiet! SILENT BASE 601; OS > Windows 11 Home Advanced (64-bit).
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:12 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

- EURO_Shades
Gatwick are probably further ahead with their preparations for it than Heathrow at the moment. They want it to land there.

Any major hub is in the running for it and you'll probably still find airlines running both as both are designed for entirely different roles which (when u think about it) compliment one another perfectly.


I believe it....Heathrow is still preparing for 1975! Laughing

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
{5thRangers}Sutherland
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Dec 21, 2005
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:48 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

The thing with the new super jumbo by Airbus is its too big. Not many airlines will want to buy it. Boeing cash in on the 747 when big was better. Now with large amounts of small airlines like WestJet and so on... an A-380 wont be needed. A group like WestJet could use a 787 to do Vancouver-Hawaii route or sompthing. Airbus might have a really bad decision in putting the money in the A 380

_________________
{5th Rangers}Sgt.Sutherland

....."keep your stick on the ice"

Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website
Shades
Forum Tree-Rat

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 6475
Location: 3rd Branch up, 'Ye Olde Oak', Green Wood.
PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 8:31 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

I would agree, if Boeing had decided to compete with them. As it is, these planes can only fly to a few of the world's major hubs which both Boeing and Airbus were considering doing and then using smaller aircraft as shuttles out from each hub.
I think that with Boeing deciding to let Airbus experiment with the super jumbo idea and build a more realistic alternative themselves, the arrangement actually works out well for both companies and both should come out of it well with two complimentary aircraft.
We shall see.


_________________
Skwerl's place.

Com-Central's cutest, fluffiest, twitchiest, tail.
CPU > Intel i9-9900k (o/c 4.9GHz); COOLING > BeQuiet! Dark Rock Pro 4;
MOBO > ASUS PRIME Z390-A; RAM > 2x32GB Corsair LPX 2666MHz;
GPU > Gigabyte GEFORCE GTX650Ti PCI-e 3.0 2Gb GDDR5;
AUDIO > Creative X-Fi Xtreme Music (plus - Universal Audio UAD2 Quad Custom accelerator);
HDD > 3x1TB+ M.2. SSDs; LCD > DELL - S2419HGF (1920x1080);
PSU > 650W be quiet Straight Power 11 - 80+ Gold;
CASE > BeQuiet! SILENT BASE 601; OS > Windows 11 Home Advanced (64-bit).
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
XcalibeR
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 11, 2005
Posts: 358

PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:14 pm
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

- {5thRangers}Sutherland
The thing with the new super jumbo by Airbus is its too big. Not many airlines will want to buy it. Boeing cash in on the 747 when big was better. Now with large amounts of small airlines like WestJet and so on... an A-380 wont be needed. A group like WestJet could use a 787 to do Vancouver-Hawaii route or sompthing. Airbus might have a really bad decision in putting the money in the A 380


One might think that, but actually, the A380 is already a success for Airbus. On pre-orders alone, they've already broken even (I can't garuantee that's true, however, we've had a few Airbus speakers at school, and they say it is highly successful). Airlines don't want these things for short hops, obviously, but since they're so economical, they are great for transporting hundreds of people on long cross-ocean flights, and the airlines know this. They can jack up the prices, and people don't complain cause they get a high tech jet with lots of gadgets to mess with on the long flight.

It's also highly useful for freight. I went to a speech by the VP of International Shipping for FedEx, and he said they have preordered like 8 of them. Said they will most likely have at least 3 A380s in the air over the Pacific at any given time. Being an aviation school, though, we did drill him about the weight problems with the A380 Wink

Either way, it may have been a big gamble 5-10 years ago, when Airbus started with it, but they took that risk, and it's turned out great for them.

_________________


[TSF]Lt. Col. XcalibeR{5thF}
PG_Raptor
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
JG300-Ascout
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Jan 05, 2005
Posts: 6257
Location: Cyberspace
PostPosted: Thu Dec 22, 2005 7:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

I expect it may do very well eventually on the transpacific routes dominated by 747's now. Unfortunately, one of the destination airports is going to be Los Angeles.

_________________
"All facts go to clearly prove that Shades is a thrice-cursed traitor & mentally deranged person steeped in inveterate enmity toward mankind"
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
XcalibeR
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 11, 2005
Posts: 358

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:58 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

Well now they seem to be working together!

"A340-600 ONLY"... yeah, look what's it's unloading, lol.


Click here for a larger shot

_________________


[TSF]Lt. Col. XcalibeR{5thF}
PG_Raptor
Back to top
View user's profile Photo Gallery
Shades
Forum Tree-Rat

Offline Offline
Joined: Mar 07, 2005
Posts: 6475
Location: 3rd Branch up, 'Ye Olde Oak', Green Wood.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:04 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

LOL
There's lotsa those kinda things u see everyday at Heathrow and all the guys on the ramps have cameras handy for the more... 'interesting' ones.

_________________
Skwerl's place.

Com-Central's cutest, fluffiest, twitchiest, tail.
CPU > Intel i9-9900k (o/c 4.9GHz); COOLING > BeQuiet! Dark Rock Pro 4;
MOBO > ASUS PRIME Z390-A; RAM > 2x32GB Corsair LPX 2666MHz;
GPU > Gigabyte GEFORCE GTX650Ti PCI-e 3.0 2Gb GDDR5;
AUDIO > Creative X-Fi Xtreme Music (plus - Universal Audio UAD2 Quad Custom accelerator);
HDD > 3x1TB+ M.2. SSDs; LCD > DELL - S2419HGF (1920x1080);
PSU > 650W be quiet Straight Power 11 - 80+ Gold;
CASE > BeQuiet! SILENT BASE 601; OS > Windows 11 Home Advanced (64-bit).
Back to top
View user's profile Visit poster's website ICQ Number
Shadow_Banshee
Power User

Offline Offline
Joined: Feb 03, 2005
Posts: 575

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 11:37 am
Post subject: Re: Boeing - Airbus wars.....

well if this gives me more choice of direct flights to the far east i'll be happy, i for one find dificulty in getting seats on decent airlines on direct routes to the far east out of the uk. i recently flew eva air on a 777 300er to bangkok and must say its the ideal plane for the job far superior cabin to most 747s , but as usual it was fully booked and even had no places in upper class, reality is, we need more seat out, do we add more flights to already congested routes or simply add more seats to flights on those routes?

_________________
Lay me place and bake me Pie
I'm starving for me Gravy
Back to top
View user's profile
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    Revive this topic    Printer Friendly Page    Forum Index ›  Officer's Club
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT - 6 Hours

Archive Revive
Username:
This is an archived topic - your reply will not be appended here.
Instead, a new topic will be generated in the active forum.
The new topic will provide a reference link to this archived topic.